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| THIS IS AN ANIME ONLY DISCUSSION POST. DO NOT DISCUSS THE MANGA BEYOND THIS EPISODE. ---------------------------------------- So Grimmer was really from 511 Kinderheim. I still wonder how he managed to beat the hell out of all those guys. Also, for some reason, I found it funny that it's Suk's mother, who has the tape =P |
| Grimmer IS The Incredible Hulk! LOL :D |
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| wow his character got even better |
| Grimmer is the incredible Steiner or something like that. |
| I think Grimmer is able to beat those people up because he goes completely berserk when he changes to his other personality...they're probably overwhelmed. |
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| Amazing. Now I know why Johan did not kill Grimmer while in that basement. He shot one guy, and then saw Grimmer go on a rampage. If he would not have seen that, Johan would have probably killed him too, since he had the tape with Johan's voice. Another thing might be that he recognized him from Kinderheim 511. They probably were there as friends or at least "classmates', if you could call them that way. One thing is unclear to me though. This is a second time Johan has shown sympathy to people from former Kinderheim. First time it was in Munchen, when he was talking to that detective about him killing a boy while supposedly drunk. That boy was also from Kinderheim. This fact is acceptable. Johan sympathizes to people he thinks are like him. But some ties are loose. Why did he exterminate entire Kinderheim back then when he was a kid? Maybe he befriended only certain "classmates" and let them live? That would give a interesting spice to the story. Another thing we found out in this episode is why Grimmer was nauseated when he hear Johan's voice from that tape. It probably brought back memories of his past. But the fact that he only became nauseated when Johan mentioned monster let's us think that it did not do such a thing. Instead, the tape has woken up a monster inside Grimmer. |
| No sig :( |
| I like the ending now too. I love the way she says "purity" lol |
| Great, incredibly well written stuff. Grimmer is such a fantastic character, he's completely different from Johann in so many ways. |
| "Yes, I have been deprived of emotion. But not completely. Whoever did it, botched the job." - Geralt of Rivia |
| so now theres a similair story too tenma, good to see them unite angain |
 Behold of my awesomeness~ controversial and/or sensitive topics likely devolve into the same repetitive, derogatory, abusive, and harassing comments can no longer be posted. But my feels. |
| good episode :) |
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| Oh wow, Grimmer is from 511 Kinderheim. |
Life is really simple, but we insist on making it complicated.~ |
| well, that explains why Grimmer came off as a 'badass'... although slightly less than Johann, but still the most developed character aside from the main cast, considering his appearance til now wasn't that long ago as opposed to say, Eva or Nina. once again though, even if Grimmer would shift into Steiner mode... Johann just overwhelms him, which is damn cool ^^ |
| It's interesting how Grimmer "transforms". |
| i wanna see grimmer in action lol |
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| Grimmer is an excellent character. I always disliked his forced smile, but now we actually get an explanation of why he is like that. Suk's mother is going to go crazy hearing the tape. |
| "Perhaps there is a universal, absolute truth. Perhaps it justifies every question. But that's beyond the reach of these small hands." Mamoru Oshii There is a cult of ignorance (...) nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that “my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.” Isaac Asimov |
| Yeah the tape made Grimmer and ex-spy freak out, I can't imagine what it would do to someone if they listened to it over and over, I bet she will see Johan as some kind of higher being or something stupid like that. He will just walk in and she will say something stupid like "you finally came". |
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| Awesome episode and Tenma is back! About Episode: So Tenma was whole time in Purge searching files but when he met that newspaper man and gave newspaper to him. He saw the case Suk has been investigating. And really quickly understand that Johan was behind it. While Tenma went that Hospital and Suk's mom was talking with him after telling him that Suk used to be playing detective in mansion. I was creep out when that woman started playing tape and Johan voice on it. So Suk and Grimmer became targets by secret police and seems like they really messed up Suk and almost hurted Grimmer. This was lucky that Tenma was in the next house and got to scene right on time. Although nothing was left anymore Grimmer standing there just smiling kind of creepy me. And after Tenma called ambulance for Suk. Grimmer told him that he is from Kinderhaim 511 and he has monster site like I reasoned. So Grimmer's full name is Wolfgang Grimmer. And like we know he was spy sent on missions from Kinderhaim 511. But he learned smiling from there also. Kinderhaim 511 that was also in OP seems really bad place and living condition there is awful. 5/5 |
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| So ex-spy Grimmer was from 511 Kinderhaim. Very interesting. |
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Algirdyz said: Amazing. Now I know why Johan did not kill Grimmer while in that basement. He shot one guy, and then saw Grimmer go on a rampage. If he would not have seen that, Johan would have probably killed him too, since he had the tape with Johan's voice. Another thing might be that he recognized him from Kinderheim 511. They probably were there as friends or at least "classmates', if you could call them that way. One thing is unclear to me though. This is a second time Johan has shown sympathy to people from former Kinderheim. First time it was in Munchen, when he was talking to that detective about him killing a boy while supposedly drunk. That boy was also from Kinderheim. This fact is acceptable. Johan sympathizes to people he thinks are like him. But some ties are loose. Why did he exterminate entire Kinderheim back then when he was a kid? Maybe he befriended only certain "classmates" and let them live? That would give a interesting spice to the story. Another thing we found out in this episode is why Grimmer was nauseated when he hear Johan's voice from that tape. It probably brought back memories of his past. But the fact that he only became nauseated when Johan mentioned monster let's us think that it did not do such a thing. Instead, the tape has woken up a monster inside Grimmer. Given how Johan's motive is pretty much on a whim, I simply assume he wants to retain all his pawns. I'm pretty sure it's mentioned before that Johan is capable of uniting the alumni of Kinderheim 511. That, or he simply doesn't see the need to kill Grimmer; which is highly probable given his characterization. It should be noted that the boy whom the drunk cop killed and Grimmer are alumni of Kinderheim 511. I reckon at certain age or when they're 'qualified', they'll be send to an artificial neighbourhood (as mentioned by Grimmer) to further polish their respective 'area of expertise'. Hence everyone who died during the rebellion led by Johan doesn't include the alumnus (since they're not within Kinderheim 511 during the rebellion); whom probably knew Johan one way or another. Alternatively, given that this IS anime, it could simply be the fact that Johan who is the epitome of Monster is able to summon/manipulate those who is akin to him. I also find it a nice touch that Grimmer's trained to 'smile'. Unless he's subjected to extreme pressure, he pretty much smile all the way. Does it mean that he genuinely smile because he's easygoing and haphazard or that his easygoing mentality is unwittingly formed in his conscience because it's 'easier' and 'correct' to smile when you're free of worries? It feels good writing this up; everything seems clearer. |
| I knew it! Mr. Grimmer is from 511 kinderheim. I wasn't sure before because he seems too old to be from there. Especially compared to Johann. Correct me if i am wrong but did Grimmer apparently "graduate" from 511 at the age of 14? Which would make him older than Johann since when Johann left 511 (destroyed it) he was around 10. It is also funny to note that a lot of the viewers did not see through Johann's disguise but Tenma was able to deduce it immediately that Johann was behind all this. But I guess even he would have been confused if he had seen the disguise. |
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| When the first time Grimmer was tortured one man was shot in the head the other two where beaten to death but i didn't even suspect that he could have done this. And the way he took care of the tape by giving it to Suk's mother in the hospital was a great idea. Grimmer the raging hulk !!! |
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| I love how he just stood on the middle of the hotel room, clothes stained with blood, smiling... great character. |
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| Magnificent Steiner= Incredible Hulk? |
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spyrocoot said: I love how he just stood on the middle of the hotel room, clothes stained with blood, smiling... great character. This. For such a monstorous other half, you got to also appreciate that chilled side he has. |
| we really learned alot in just one episode! lol Suk's mom has the tape, i wonder if she memorized the tape? isn't she afraid? nice of Tenma to extract the information about Suk's hideout :P man Tenma would have heard the tape if only he noticed and heard her say it! man Suk's was hurt as hell, but what a wimp he is. for someone trying to act like the savior of justice he seems to give up so easily. and man Grimmer went berserk!!! so that's why he always smiled like that. so the sniper guy is still alive since Tenma only knocked him out. Grimmer really did come from Kinderheim 511 huh? but it seems he's more afraid of Johan, especially seeing him in disguise. i thought only Johan survived? could it possibly be that there are even more survivors from Kinderheim 511?? looks like we're getting pieces of information about the activities they do at kinderheim 511. next episode Johan Crossdress Anna!!! |
| Grimmer is a good character! |
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| So he was from that cursed orphanage after all... The themes of the importance of having a name and having a monster lying deep inside were really emphasized in this episode, as this show continues its thorough examination of the nature of evil. It's not meant to be seen as simply being a case of Grimmer having a split personality; he literally has a hidden monster inside him, the one that was trained to emerge thanks to his nightmarish childhood. We saw this before with Johan as well. Do all humans have the capability of committing atrocious acts of evil under the right conditions? Grimmer snapped under the pressure of what was happening around him, and went berserk. He literally beat those guys to near-death, even though we see he's a perfectly good person. Grimmer has developed into a fantastic character. I didn't like him at first (though that may just be my weariness of the constant onslaught of new characters speaking) but he's really grown on me, and is easily one of the most developed characters in the show. |
| My anime blog Latest Post: The Zero Requiem (Analysis of the Ending of Code Geass) |
| The magnificent steiner did it again. I didn't think Grimmer was actually from 511 kinderheim because of his age/appearance. Glad to see Suk and Grimmer are still alive, along with Tenma returning to the stage. |
MrAM said: So he was from that cursed orphanage after all... The themes of the importance of having a name and having a monster lying deep inside were really emphasized in this episode, as this show continues its thorough examination of the nature of evil. It's not meant to be seen as simply being a case of Grimmer having a split personality; he literally has a hidden monster inside him, the one that was trained to emerge thanks to his nightmarish childhood. We saw this before with Johan as well. Do all humans have the capability of committing atrocious acts of evil under the right conditions? Grimmer snapped under the pressure of what was happening around him, and went berserk. He literally beat those guys to near-death, even though we see he's a perfectly good person. Grimmer has developed into a fantastic character. I didn't like him at first (though that may just be my weariness of the constant onslaught of new characters speaking) but he's really grown on me, and is easily one of the most developed characters in the show. First of all, I think all humans are capable of committing atrocities and evils. However, I don't think it's impossible to fight or overcome it. Part of this relates to the innocence of the person, or the "condition of the soul": Even one who has been trained to do evil from childhood may remain innocent, though they may be defiled by said evil. The point of the matter is in relation to free will; have they been made aware that their actions are evil? Do they want to be the way they are? This point plays out heavily with Johan and Grimmer: Evil has beget more evil inside of them, yet Johan embraces it while Grimmer defies it. In this sense we could consider Johan "truly evil" (guilty) and consider Grimmer victimized by it (innocent). Any degree of love or righteousness within Johan is buried so deep that it can no longer be seen; even what miniscule bits he does show are actual, but a fake twisted by the evil within. He's fully aware of his evil, his "monster", to the point that it scares him, yet at the same time he takes pleasure in his evils. Grimmer, on the other hand, tries his best to be a good person and copes with his situation as best as he can. The evil is using him, rather than him using the evil. I wouldn't be surprised in the least to find that he's trying to overcome or get rid of the monster within him. I'm very pleased with this addition to the show. I was a bit skeptical at first, but Grimmer is perhaps the most interesting character introduced yet. I hope the story continues to explore his character. |
| Holy shit, that was intense |
| This episode was epic. It annoys me how much of a coward Suk is. Wish he would man up already. I had a feeling Grimmer was from 511 Kinderheim after seeing how he reacted to hearing the tape. Grimmer is a fucking badass. This episode made me love him that much more. I think it is safe to say he's my favorite character in Monster. Seeing Grimmer smiling with all that blood all over him made him look fucking insane. Now I really want to see what Grimmer is like when he becomes the Magnificent Steiner. Another god-tier episode. Oh I fucking love this anime. 10/10 |
| When Grimmer said how to smile, i'm done. That bastards, what did exactly they do to children in Kinderheim 511 ? They stole the children's future. im sure that similar things exist somewhere on the real world. That bastard must be punished. |
| Damn Grimmer's a beast. |
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| Wow, I expected that Grimmer had some kind of abuse done to him as a child, but never expected him to be from 511 Kinderheim |
"You either die an Ashita no Joe, or you live long enough to see yourself become a Naruto."  |
| "The hardest thing to learn was learning how to smile" right in the feels .__. |
| 5/5 |
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| Didn't expect to learn that Grimmer is from 511. Can't wait to eventually see the incredible Steiner in action! |
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| Grimmer is truly a fantastic character, the contrasts between him and Johan add so much depth to the story. |
FragOutFire said: Why am I a Berserk fan? All I ever experience is pain. We are in the eclipse and Miura has sacrificed us |
| Choujin Steiner, Grimmer for MC. Great ep, i previously said because of the chipped nails that Grimmer couldn't be the one who murdered the other two guys but that was before we knew the woman was Johan but now it certainly makes sense, but does that also mean that Johan shot the first guy and allowed Grimmer to take care of the rest, in order words he is aware of Grimmer's 'condition, well, well, well, things will get even more feisty. Also, where is Lunge!? |
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| Grimmer is easily among the best characters in this show, nah. The best with Johan. |
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