Descending Stories
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| THIS IS AN ANIME ONLY DISCUSSION POST. DO NOT DISCUSS THE MANGA BEYOND THIS EPISODE. ---------------------------------------- Nice episode, really liked the characterization of Kiku although I think he should be more open to others. In the meantime, Hatsutaro continuously tries to bring the best out of Kiku. So much potential still for his future. I really like their connection in this show and that embrace XD lol  l |
Stark700Feb 26, 2016 4:51 PM
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| On the trip, and the lady heard about it from the friend. She says she's a fool because she gets tricked by guys. He's back early and saw that moment... He likes her but he wants to break up with her (did I hear wrong?)? He wants to be alone and concentrate on his rakugo. Even though he enjoys his friend's company. Adapted grandpa is a rakugo master? He gave the main guy the fan (w. "Sukeroku" on) his grandpa gave for parting gift. Teacher looking at the booklet of the "name". |
I ♥ Two Syaorans from Tsubasa RESERVoir CHRoNiCLE and TRC!!! |
| Damn old farts be jelly of Shin-chan because he's so good and has the right idea.....Dem Shin and Miyokichi backstories tho TwT Thankfully Yakumo #7 was able to get him to be promoted alongside Kiku who's also doing better and better with each episode...I liked the talk that Shin and Kiku had in that club a lot too and their plan for the future is pretty cool imo Other than that, the stuff with Miyokichi was even more sadder than last week and I can't believe that Kiku is going to toss her aside like that knowing full well that this woman deeply loves him Next week looks like it's going to be even not brutal in more ways than one and I'm scared :( |
TokoyaFeb 26, 2016 1:35 PM
| This series plays it so understated despite the drama and the OST is so smooth. A great watch. |
| "Perhaps there is a universal, absolute truth. Perhaps it justifies every question. But that's beyond the reach of these small hands." Mamoru Oshii There is a cult of ignorance (...) nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that “my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.” Isaac Asimov |
| Well the theme this week seemed to be goodbyes, if not permanent ones, not yet anyway. Mainly between Shin and Yakumo, and Miyokichi and Yakumo. Although going by the preview that latter breakup will drag into next week too, and she'll finally accept Shin. Watching that all go down is rather unpleasant. Frankly I wish it was over and done with by now. Like tearing off a bandage in one move versus slowly dragging it off. I've already given my thoughts about Yakumo's choices. His true love seems to be rakugo, willing to abandon anything else for it. I'm not sure how much I buy into his preference to be alone, given his admitted love of Miyokichi, but he's getting his wish. It just seems like such a waste though to me. Another goodbye though, more permanent it seems, was between Shin and his dream to be the next Yakumo. His transfer of the fan was pretty heavily symbolic. He seems to have accepted that his life, and rakugo style has too many detractors for such a title to be given, fair or not. Watching them discuss their futures and the future of rakugo was interesting. I can't entirely figure Shin out. I'm wondering why he loves Miyokichi, and how deep it really runs. He claims to love rakugo, but he's not the loner Yakumo claims to be. Maybe he relates to her sense of being an outcast, I dunno. More on that is to come, I assume. |
| Damn so they both separated :( Well at least it was on good terms and both made a promise to keep Rakugo going. Also cool to see that Yakumo was able to get Shin his promotion even with all the negotiation he had to go through. Miyokichi's parts are way too bad for my heart D: Her drama is so sad. I feel bad for her. And there's still the break up we need to see OTL That's gonna be a tough one esp with seeing the pv, seems Shin is hugging her. And Yakumo & Kiku seem to be angry at him? What's he gonna do now :/ |
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| Great episode. I felt for all three characters. Miyokichi would be much happier with Shin. |
OrangeFeb 26, 2016 3:45 PM
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| People who can't—or don't even try—to balance their personal and work life annoy me. "I must give up everyone to master muh rakugo!" It's so small-minded and egotistical. Good episode, but Kiku is starting to annoy me. I can barely stand seeing him. Miyokichi and Shin are the heart of this series for me right now. Their stories continue to hold my interest. |
| This was a pretty sad episode, I enjoyed it. Next week looks like it's going to be interesting. Seeing Miyokichi in the previews makes me conflicted, I was hoping we'd be seeing her less after what happened. Oh well. |
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aikaflip said: People who can't—or don't even try—to balance their personal and work life annoy me. "I must give up everyone to master muh rakugo!" It's so small-minded and egotistical. Normally I think that too, but in this case it seems like society and his rakugo Masters are the ones forcing him to choose between them. As far as the social ladder goes, Miyo seems to be right down at the bottom; if Kiku continues to associate with her then his rakugo career will suffer immensely for it. Given that he's only just started to develop his own style and become popular, I'm a little more sympathetic to his choice because there isn't really anything else he could do. It does suck though. |
 It's an entirely different kind of flying, altogether! It's an entirely different kind of flying. |
| Damn these people have to fuck off! Why force him to leave her ffs. Ep preview looks interesting. |
| shin was more likeable in this episode ,he is a good guy kiku...really you have to choose??? |
| Music was great this episode. Seems like this is where things start to get rough. The 'ditch everything for your work' thing is big in Japan. Lots of Samurai film and other period dramas deal with that theme. Toning down the rakugo in exchange for bringing out character motives and ideals is being done so well. |
| ANime News Network episode reviews were screaming "Kikuhiko is gayyyy because he distances himself from Miyokichi!" Turns out he is merely choosing his work over love since his master and higher ups don't approve of his relationship with Miyo. Not because he's gay. Kikuhiko even admitted his love for her. I'm curious to see this week's write-up. What do you guys think? |
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| Kiku's reaction when he saw miyokichi with sukeroku was exactly what i would expect of him. I loved how they wrote that part. It's more clear to me that he doesn't like her that much and if he has to choose, he'll choose rakugo. I don't think that's wrong. At least he is not lying to himself. I also liked that he was honest with sukeroku, saying that when sukeroku was with him, he couldn't practice properly and that he actually envy him in a certain way because he has so much potential. |
| A really good and really sad episode. That separation T_T 5/5 |
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NaturalPerm said: ANime News Network episode reviews were screaming "Kikuhiko is gayyyy because he distances himself from Miyokichi!" Turns out he is merely choosing his work over love since his master and higher ups don't approve of his relationship with Miyo. Not because he's gay. Kikuhiko even admitted his love for her. I'm curious to see this week's write-up. What do you guys think? I noticed the same, particularly their episode 5 review almost made it sound as if Kiku is homo. Not that I would've had a problem with it, but I always knew his feelings towards Shin have been nothing more than a mixture of admiration and envy. Not sure what that ANN reviewer was surmising all along. |
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| Gloomy episode. Yakumo's decision to separate from Miyokichi was unfortunate considering what Miyokichi had been thinking all this time. Shin seems rather ambiguous in the moment, however. Plans for the future are interesting so far. |
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NaturalPerm said: ANime News Network episode reviews were screaming "Kikuhiko is gayyyy because he distances himself from Miyokichi!" Turns out he is merely choosing his work over love since his master and higher ups don't approve of his relationship with Miyo. Not because he's gay. Kikuhiko even admitted his love for her. I'm curious to see this week's write-up. What do you guys think? I don't want to rub it in their faces neither do I know why they instantly jumped to that conclusion but Kikuhiko isn't gay. Last episode when his master reminded Kikuhiko of his relationship should have been obvious why he suddenly distanced himself from Miyokichi and we've already been shown he had no problem dating other women in the past. Heck even considered settling down with one of them. Anyways this episode should clear the misunderstanding. |
| This show has such a strong sense of place. I love it. The culture behind rakugo and the talks of how to preserve it are surprisingly intriguing. I enjoyed Kiku's and Sukeroku's conversation regarding the path each will take: one will adhere to traditional rakugo while the other will continuously develop his rakugo to target new audiences. Despite the difference in approach, their goal is the same. And of course the characters and their interactions continue to impress. There was Miyokichi's stony rant; Kiku's acknowledgement of his feelings toward her; Sukeroku's little revelation about his past and his worries; and finally the goodbye between our two protagonists. I'm most interested to learn exactly how Kiku would describe his feelings toward Sukeroku. Kiku is obviously subconsciously attracted to him in some way, though it may just be admiration or something. It was very noticeable during the scene right before their farewell, in which he kept leaning closer to Sukeroku as he talked. Also, did anyone catch the brief but ominous shot of the incense sticks (during the drinking scene with the two masters)? Probably a bit of foreshadowing for what's to come. |
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| I don't believe he really wants to break up with her because of what he has been told. I think it's rather convenient for him. He likes her maybe but he's not in love with her, from the beginning she's the one pushing her feelings on him, he just let her do. |
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Z4k said: NaturalPerm said: ANime News Network episode reviews were screaming "Kikuhiko is gayyyy because he distances himself from Miyokichi!" Turns out he is merely choosing his work over love since his master and higher ups don't approve of his relationship with Miyo. Not because he's gay. Kikuhiko even admitted his love for her. I'm curious to see this week's write-up. What do you guys think? I don't want to rub it in their faces neither do I know why they instantly jumped to that conclusion but Kikuhiko isn't gay. Last episode when his master reminded Kikuhiko of his relationship should have been obvious why he suddenly distanced himself from Miyokichi and we've already been shown he had no problem dating other women in the past. Heck even considered settling down with one of them. Anyways this episode should clear the misunderstanding. Well he dated other women but never really showed them strong interest, if I remember well, he said it was just because he was curious or something like that. We can't say he is or he is not, perhaps he's not just interested in that kind of relationship, but one thing is sure, it's his friendship is way more stronger and it's what makes Miyokichi jealous. |
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| I like the mentioning of tradition versus change, it's something that comes up once in awhile, but usually choosing between the two or somehow blending them. Here, they're doing both. Sukeroku is the change while Kikuhiko is the tradition. I'm glad they're trying to keep alive rakugo by attracting audience with change but at the same time preserving tradition. It's sad that they had to say goodbye though, but I can see why Kiku would go so far to work on rakugo. It's his passion, and it's something he wants to get better at. If that's the answer he's come to, then he should go for it. If it doesn't work out as well as he wants it to, then he can try a different way. |
| Damn, it looks like there's going to be a lot of drama in the next episode. Especially if you consider the fact that Miyokichi is hugging Shin at the end of the episode preview. |
| People on MAL refuse to actually enjoy watching anime. Your taste in anime isn't a personality trait. MAL is literally just anime Twitter as its own website lol. |
| Kiku is a very cold man who shut his heart from any woman. |
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| Sooo.....My guess is that Chin-chan will get Miyokichi pregnant... and the result is Konatsu? Unless it's Kiku child? Hm... Can't wait for the next episode. |
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| Ahhh this hurts to watch. Sure it's frustrating seeing Kiku act like this, but it's not like we haven't literally had his character conflict presented as slowly and clearly as possible. It sucks, but it's logical that he is this way. He can't risk losing this place he has worked so hard for, dedicated his life to. And even if he realized he loves Miyokichi, it's not like he has a deep understanding or ability to comprehend his love. All he's really known aside from the one relationship at a younger age is his admiration for Shin and Yakumo, so he really can't grasp how deeply he's fallen for her. He's too cold to understand that and make the emotional decision to actively pursue her as a priority, that just isn't his character. And it's not like him to just ghost her and pretend they were never anything, so this is his best approach. But yeah, it hurts. And next episode looks like it's reaaaaally gonna hurt. |
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| Another flawless episode. |
| The final scene was so good. Shin's back, the voice of Kiku practicing what I assume is his famous piece and that soundtrack were all too perfect. |
| What a twist I didn't think Kiku liked Miyokichi at all, he always looked so uncomfortable around her. Next episode looks scandalous, cant wait! |
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Annick said: Well he said in this episode that he loves her but i think he left her because of his goals of keeping rakugo alive and becoming a master and so far in the show Kiku has been shown to be a much weaker and less confident character compered to Shin that could also be a reason for him leaving her all in all i think that he can't handle the job of being a rakugo master and also keeping her happy and loved.I don't believe he really wants to break up with her because of what he has been told. I think it's rather convenient for him. He likes her maybe but he's not in love with her, from the beginning she's the one pushing her feelings on him, he just let her do. |
Annick said: Z4k said: I don't want to rub it in their faces neither do I know why they instantly jumped to that conclusion but Kikuhiko isn't gay. Last episode when his master reminded Kikuhiko of his relationship should have been obvious why he suddenly distanced himself from Miyokichi and we've already been shown he had no problem dating other women in the past. Heck even considered settling down with one of them. Anyways this episode should clear the misunderstanding. Well he dated other women but never really showed them strong interest, if I remember well, he said it was just because he was curious or something like that. We can't say he is or he is not, perhaps he's not just interested in that kind of relationship, but one thing is sure, it's his friendship is way more stronger and it's what makes Miyokichi jealous. i guess kiku really liked his first girlfriend. But it looks like they didn't had much time together because she had to go to country and the war also begun. His first girlfriend had a personality that imo matches perfectly to kiku. And no, i don't think he is gay. Maybe the fujoshis want him to be gay, but that's not gonna happen xD |
ItsMaz said: aikaflip said: People who can't—or don't even try—to balance their personal and work life annoy me. "I must give up everyone to master muh rakugo!" It's so small-minded and egotistical. Normally I think that too, but in this case it seems like society and his rakugo Masters are the ones forcing him to choose between them. As far as the social ladder goes, Miyo seems to be right down at the bottom; if Kiku continues to associate with her then his rakugo career will suffer immensely for it. Given that he's only just started to develop his own style and become popular, I'm a little more sympathetic to his choice because there isn't really anything else he could do. It does suck though. I agree, I actually don't blame him at all. Considering if he stays with her, he'll be banished from rakugo. I mean, what else is he going to do? Regardless, it's a pretty awful situation to be in. |
| Well they separate maybe we will know how the goofy one actually died... I really like his character though. Though there is this betrayal part highlighted in the name which I am really looking forward to |
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yeah well nice guys finish last  |
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maverick0999 said: Annick said: Well he said in this episode that he loves her but i think he left her because of his goals of keeping rakugo alive and becoming a master and so far in the show Kiku has been shown to be a much weaker and less confident character compered to Shin that could also be a reason for him leaving her all in all i think that he can't handle the job of being a rakugo master and also keeping her happy and loved.I don't believe he really wants to break up with her because of what he has been told. I think it's rather convenient for him. He likes her maybe but he's not in love with her, from the beginning she's the one pushing her feelings on him, he just let her do. He did said "suki" which is more "like" than "love" (but could be both as well). He may love her but as someone said earlier, he always looks uncomfortable around her, he shows more affection toward Shin than her. So far what I saw in their relationship was her loving him (and sticking like glue) and him just going with the flow...it was somehow painful to watch...So even if it wasn't for Raguko I think he would have let her go because he probably thinks she would be better with his master or Shin...but wouldn't be the same for them? If she jeopardizes his position, what about them? |
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sun123 said: Annick said: Well he dated other women but never really showed them strong interest, if I remember well, he said it was just because he was curious or something like that. We can't say he is or he is not, perhaps he's not just interested in that kind of relationship, but one thing is sure, it's his friendship is way more stronger and it's what makes Miyokichi jealous. i guess kiku really liked his first girlfriend. But it looks like they didn't had much time together because she had to go to country and the war also begun. His first girlfriend had a personality that imo matches perfectly to kiku. And no, i don't think he is gay. Maybe the fujoshis want him to be gay, but that's not gonna happen xD Yes "liked", like a puppy...but they were young and didn't have much time. Once again she proposed and he went with it, he acted nice around her but never showed passion. The manga is not yaoi or shonen-ai, so I don't think it will go that way, but I think he's not confortable in those relationships or with people in general. I think Rakugo and his friend will always come first. |
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Annick said: Well that depends on what the character wants to do we know that Kiku loves rakugo more than any character in the show i would say even more then Shin so he would give up anything for rakugo on the other hand Shin would be a better fit for Miyokichi but that whole paring won't make any sense because Miyokichi hasn't shown any sort of affection towards Shin nor Shin has shown any romantic feeling to her, so we have a love triangle where only the girl has some romantic feelings towards one of the guys which i have rarely seen in anime.maverick0999 said: Well he said in this episode that he loves her but i think he left her because of his goals of keeping rakugo alive and becoming a master and so far in the show Kiku has been shown to be a much weaker and less confident character compered to Shin that could also be a reason for him leaving her all in all i think that he can't handle the job of being a rakugo master and also keeping her happy and loved. He did said "suki" which is more "like" than "love" (but could be both as well). He may love her but as someone said earlier, he always looks uncomfortable around her, he shows more affection toward Shin than her. So far what I saw in their relationship was her loving him (and sticking like glue) and him just going with the flow...it was somehow painful to watch...So even if it wasn't for Raguko I think he would have let her go because he probably thinks she would be better with his master or Shin...but wouldn't be the same for them? If she jeopardizes his position, what about them? |
maverick0999Feb 27, 2016 11:37 AM
maverick0999 said: Annick said: Well that depends on what the character wants to do we know that Kiku loves rakugo more than any character in the show i would say even more then Shin so he would give up anything for rakugo on the other hand Shin would be a better fit for Miyokichi but that whole paring won't make any sense because Miyokichi hasn't shown any sort of affection towards nor Shin has shown any romantic feeling to her, so we have a love triangle where only the girl has some romantic feelings towards one of the guys which i have rarely seen in anime.He did said "suki" which is more "like" than "love" (but could be both as well). He may love her but as someone said earlier, he always looks uncomfortable around her, he shows more affection toward Shin than her. So far what I saw in their relationship was her loving him (and sticking like glue) and him just going with the flow...it was somehow painful to watch...So even if it wasn't for Raguko I think he would have let her go because he probably thinks she would be better with his master or Shin...but wouldn't be the same for them? If she jeopardizes his position, what about them? Yes Rakugo is all his life because he has nothing else. We also know that he's not the kind to open to others, Shin is closer to him than anybody else, he's his family, I even think he would be able to make more sacrifice for him, whereas he seems distant with others, including his girlfriends. Perhaps he's just not good with romantic relationships. In the first episode he shows some affection for Yotaro and Konatsu, he still have that cold personality but we sense that he cares for them, whereas with Miyokichi, I just felt awkwardness ...and the fact she's a bit maso and his master's lover is not helping...maybe it's just my own perception, but to me, she is more a friend to him than a lover. Shin is a womanizer, so of course he will show some interest to Miyokichi, I think he was a bit jealous when Kiku said he was seeing her, it's maybe not true love but it's sure he will make a move on her. In the first episode it is said that Natsuko is the daughter of a geisha, so she's more likely her and Shin daughter..Or... or ...or... another possible plot (a classic one)....Kiku's biological daughter and Miyokichi had no other choice than eloping with Shin after Kiku rejected her. It's just that Natsuko looks a lot like Shin... Not to spoil, in the PV we see a couple lying on a futon, I'm not 100% sure but it looks like Shin and Miyokichi. Just looked up at the author and she mostly writes yaoi and shonen-ai, it seems to be the only title that is not in that category...So perhaps that's why their relationship look like bromance at some time. |
AnnickFeb 28, 2016 8:45 PM
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| Damn. The separation happened :( Miyo is also in a pretty depressing state. Pretty sad episode. Kiku has been getting so much better. |
| Rakugo is such a great series. Every week it just keeps getting better. Kiku's 'love' for Miyokichi doesn't strick me as the romantic kind. I think he likes her, is fond of her (he feels comfortable enough around her to talk about his insecurities) but so far, both in the manga and the anime, I didn't see romantic attraction. We all get to see Miyo's past, which also excuses her behaviour regarding men so far. It only supports my theory that she clings to men for her own personal 'survival' and is a dependant person, because she has nothing else to do (she sort of said so in the anime). Judging from the preview next week is the start of Sukeroku and Miyo. |
| Yeah, I don't buy that Kiku loved her. The way he acted around her in the previous episodes. Even if his master told him he wasn't suitable as a wife, he always acted very passive and kinda disinterested waaayyy before that. She was always pushing herself on him and he went with the flow. |
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| Best anime of the season. |
 That preview, NTR confirmed? |
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| Wow, that encounter was really random. I didn't expect Kiku to sudden show up like that. Kiku's confession confirms what I said last episode. He felt affection towards Miyokuchi, but he didn't really love her all that much. His commitment to his new-found passion is also understandable. I love the developments this episode. To aikaflip, It's important to consider the class separation, culture, society, and time-period that Kiku is in though. Even in modern Japan that balance between work and personal life is difficult (and undesirable to some extent) when you look at Japan's work culture and expectations (expected unpaid OT, long hours, etc.) in comparison to other societies. Also, Miyokuchi is pretty much an ex-prostitute from a lower class (hierarchical society), so as Kiku noted, it would be increasingly difficult to maintain their relationship as he gains prestige, status and widens the gap. Prioritizing love/women over his work would also be seen as foolish, especially for someone of Miyokuchi's status. https://www.reddit.com/r/anime/comments/47rakt/spoilers_shouwa_genroku_rakugo_shinjuu_episode_8/ Reddit has a nice analysis. |
MirorinFeb 27, 2016 8:38 PM
| seriously heartbreaking. Im slightly annoyed with kiku for giving up so mich for ralugo, but I can also understand since this is the first time he's been good and successful at something, so he wants to take advantage. I'm sad to see kiku and shin seperate. their friendship is truly the highlight of the series but that's ending(???)I wonder how the series will continue after the 9th ep |
| Episode begins and I'm pumped! The girl comes and meets Sukeroku, I guess he'll be getting her now. Fucking hell, hug and Kiku comes If he loves her why not go after her? Fuck status and shit, you go after the one you love. But I do understand his actions and the position he's in. Kiku and his friend going their own ways Not much really happened in this episode but it was a good episode Next ep will be intense (NTR incoming) 3/5 One more thing, when Kiku will realize what he's given up on he's gonna have a hard fucking time Sukeroku will get Miyokichi and he'll be left there with sadness. |
AhoNoGinFeb 28, 2016 12:20 AM
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sun123 said: Annick said: Well he dated other women but never really showed them strong interest, if I remember well, he said it was just because he was curious or something like that. We can't say he is or he is not, perhaps he's not just interested in that kind of relationship, but one thing is sure, it's his friendship is way more stronger and it's what makes Miyokichi jealous. i guess kiku really liked his first girlfriend. But it looks like they didn't had much time together because she had to go to country and the war also begun. His first girlfriend had a personality that imo matches perfectly to kiku. And no, i don't think he is gay. Maybe the fujoshis want him to be gay, but that's not gonna happen xD I don't necessarily think we can rule out the idea that Kiku could be gay. Like, it's not just a thought that people are reaching for, there is genuine subtext that still indicates he could be. He may even be bi for all we know. For one, the mangaka who worked on this has also worked on a lot of BL manga before so it isn't totally implausible that he could be. Kiku didn't seem to hold much interest in his first girlfriend. If I remember correctly, he only mentioned how "nice it would be to settle down with a nice girl like this". There isn't really much passion in his words. He just describes her as "nice" and "gentle". I'm not sure how many of you guys are gay, but that's a really relatable experience for a lot of gay youth. You grow up thinking that life would be so much easier if you were able to be"normal"(straight) and assimilate by getting married. This seems even more likely by the era this is set in. We can't really mark out gay-ness just because Kiku says he's in love with Miyokichi. Like there are implications obviously there. Especially within his conversations with Sukeroku. Like did people forget about the years they've spent together? The romantic embrace (lol) after Sukeroku came back from Manchuria? The scenes in the bath and the scenes in Kiku's lap where Miyokichi was obviously jealous? IDK I don't really think people are making this up, and invalidating people's opinions on this just seems counterproductive for having good discussion on the matter. But w/e just my onion. :^O |
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