Shigatsu wa Kimi no Uso Episode 13 Discussion

Fatma94 said:


May I ask why you found it disappointing? I thought they did a great job adapting it after the disappointing previous episode. They added all the important flashbacks. They didn't drag out his performance, and they let us know what happened to Kaori.

OT : Mad props to Hanae Natsuki for his stellar voice acting.

Fatma94 said:

Mirianime said:
So did he FINALLY hear the notes?

Cincib0i said:
A little off topic, but I'd like to know how often are speechless performances given in music? I mean in the literal sense, a performance so beautiful (not from shock or horror) that every being in the audience is left in some ethereal trance (like we see in this episode). I guess at more somber events with music playing (funerals? memorials?) it could happen, but I want see this kind of reaction from a live performance given for the sake of purely making music. Every performance I've been to, no matter how amazing, has been met with applause. Never have I seen a reaction like the crowd gives to Arima's music in this episode. Of course this kind of reaction is easy to fabricate in an anime or if staged in a movie/show. I mean a genuine reaction like this. Would love to hear if anyone else has.

surfboard_ said:


Haven't seen any speechless performances so far, since applause is a formal approach to receive a musician after a performance. (specially in serious environments), but I do know that french people will have negative reactions if they dislike it, like leaving in the middle or calling it crap.

VanishingKira said:
Arima might lose someone again...blah blah blah another deathflag for Kaori.

Honestly even if she dies now it still won't save this show.

Only good thing that happened this episode is that Amira finally got over his mother situation...only took 13 episodes.

surfboard_ said:


Haven't seen any speechless performances so far, since applause is a formal approach to receive a musician after a performance. (specially in serious environments), but I do know that french people will have negative reactions if they dislike it, like leaving in the middle or calling it crap.

What we see in the anime is that the audience doesn't know exactly how to react to Arima, if they actually like it or dislike. Notice that he varies from a sloppy play to a smooth, accurate and precise style, and the same people that cringed from the raw notes change the mood once Kousei's body receive enough "heat".

Cincib0i said:
I know that applause is the formal way to receive a musician after a great performance. I want to experience a performance so transcendent that every being in the audience forgets all sense of formality, and is just left in a lengthy period of awe from the sheer beauty of the performance. Then finally, after a good while, someone remembers to clap.

AidoWand said:
Really ? French people leave during a performance ? I've personnally never seen that, and be as it may, I'm french soooo.

Cincib0i said:
A little off topic, but I'd like to know how often are speechless performances given in music? I mean in the literal sense, a performance so beautiful (not from shock or horror) that every being in the audience is left in some ethereal trance (like we see in this episode). I guess at more somber events with music playing (funerals? memorials?) it could happen, but I want see this kind of reaction from a live performance given for the sake of purely making music. Every performance I've been to, no matter how amazing, has been met with applause. Never have I seen a reaction like the crowd gives to Arima's music in this episode. Of course this kind of reaction is easy to fabricate in an anime or if staged in a movie/show. I mean a genuine reaction like this. Would love to hear if anyone else has.

burningfire52 said:
The death flags are stronger than ever

TripleSRank said:
I'm looking at this episode discussion topic, and I'm sad. I'm truly saddened. I see maybe one other person here who understands.

That was disgusting... appalling even. I too marvel at this episode, not out of admiration or praise, but out of contempt. How truly ignorant and disgraceful, or otherwise offensive, this is. I'm not sure it would be quite correct, if it would fully encapsulate my meaning, if I were to say that that was the "worst" thing I've ever watched, because it did what it did wrong so brilliantly. The irony is too great. The directing is good; the thematic progression is good; the characters are "good"...

Yet, the core of this story is rotten. This episode captured everything about the story that makes it both so likeable and so contemptible. It's the perfect episode to expound upon.

Perhaps you're reading this, and you don't know what I'm going on about. Or if you do know, you might think I'm taking this too seriously. However, dear reader, this is serious. It is wholly connected to the essence of this story and its message. It is simply wrong, and issue does need to be raised. Someone does need to cry foul. This is not how the world works, no matter how picturesque or pretty it may be to pretend it does.

However, I will refrain from dropping the bomb for now and illustrate my point first. I want you to look at the relationship between Kousei and his mother, Saki. Really think about it as you read this post. Her death and its consequences is what the entire thematic progression of the story is concerned with. Thus, I think it's fair to say this point is the most important part of the story.

Now, what sort of relationship did Saki and Kousei share before his death? Surely enough, she is portrayed as a loving mother, and Kousei is portrayed as a loving son. The sweet memories of Kousei sleeping under Saki's piano are nice. Who would say they aren't? Kousei and his mother liked the piano. However, something happened to Saki. She contracted an illness. This, understandably, sucks, but it's not always something one can help. So, Saki is going to die. What does she do?

Please think realistically here. This story is taking itself seriously, so there's no reason not to.

She constrains Kousei to the piano. Granted, this is something he liked at first, but it extends beyond his desires. Kousei is a child; he wants to play with his friends and do other things children like to do. Yet, his mother places a great deal of pressure and verbal harshness upon him for her own desires. She forces her own will upon him. It is, figuratively, "violence", a forcing of her own will upon another. This has nothing to do with properly raising a child. She is abusing her authority and role in Kousei's life. It's not right.

It doesn't stop at words either. Something critical was shown some episodes ago. Saki hit Kousei. She physically hit him and drew blood. (I will for the moment ignore how horribly the comedy juxtaposes in light of this scene.) This is literal violence. This is abuse.

Do you deny that it is abuse? Amuse me with a reply if you do.

Of the many things I hate, that I cannot stomach or abide, it is evil that presents itself as something good. Or, worded differently, evil that tries to justify itself. Abuse and violence are not okay. PERIOD. The story says that Saki was doing this for Kousei's own good, out of love. Reality says that Saki was doing it out of frustration and resentment, for the sake of rebellion. Saki was taking her anger against the world out on Kousei, and it wasn't and isn't right, okay, or justifiable. Despite this, this story wants us, the viewers, to sympathize with her, to think that she wasn't really a bad person. She was "just" in a bad situation.

In truth, bad situations are what reveal a person's true character, for better or worse. Saki's sentiments may have been understandable, but her actions were far from good. In the end, at her core, she cared about herself and her own lost desires more than she cared about her son. It is a bona fide abusive relationship, yet this story tries to portray it as something beautiful or admirable. It is a wonder to me how so many can overlook this.

This is the sort of stuff that leaves people scarred for life. Kousei was and is a child. Children and sometimes even adults don't understand the nature of abusive relationships or how it affects the abused. This is why Kousei blames himself for his mother's bitterness before her death. This is a very realistic reaction. However, for him to overcome his guilt without addressing it, without understanding it, without any real reason to suddenly be better, that is unrealistic and unbelievable. It's wrong. It belittles his condition.

This story is framing abuse as something okay. Something good. Something loving.

Because of that, I hope someone out there can see why I would be so disgusted, so appalled, so offended by this narrative. I've excluded other missteps related to the overall framing problem, but I think the above encapsulates my point rather well, so with that I conclude.

TripleSRank said:
The directing is good

firejet said:
These people who gave this anime a 4 or below I swear...
Either
1. They have high expectations.
2. Still hate the mom and don't understand her situation.
Or 3. Very nitpicky manga readers that see a small flaw and didn't get the experience they wanted while everyone else is crying from feels.

This is one of the best Animes I've ever watched. Each episode is a roller coaster of emotions and development not wasting any moment while still adding in soft humor to lighten the atmosphere.

surfboard_ said:


Your frustration is right here: the director isn't good, he is a pile of ****, devoid of any talent.
On the other hand, it was Saki that said that all she did was for Kousei's own good, not the story. Nothing is to be taken 100% literal, if you see her abusing her precious son, be aware that she herself have psychological issues.

surfboard_ said:
Do you deny that it is abuse? Amuse me with a reply if you do.

Of the many things I hate, that I cannot stomach or abide, it is evil that presents itself as something good. Or, worded differently, evil that tries to justify itself. Abuse and violence are not okay. PERIOD. The story says that Saki was doing this for Kousei's own good, out of love.

Takuan_Soho said:


Humm, I don't think the lesson of this story is that Saki was right to hit Kousei, even her best friend was appalled at what she did. But there is a difference between "evil" and making a mistake.

Evil is the lack of understanding that one's actions are wrong. It generally requires the act to be repeated to demonstrate this lack of empathy. While Kousei did have some desire to be a kid, they made it perfectly clear that he also wanted to win because he knew his mother didn't have much time (and he enjoyed playing the piano). The motivation was internal. So while Kousei occasionally had some issues with his mother's spartan teaching style, in general he was in agreement with it. He wanted to be the best. So I think calling Saki "evil" is going too far. She got obsessed in pushing Kousei to realize his full talents, but that is something very different than being "evil".

Think of Mozart: his father dragged him and his sister all around Europe as a child in order to make money off of them (and traveling back then was a dangerous activity). Was his father evil? (the Amadeus movie, while amusing had next to nothing of historical merit to it, Mozart got along relatively well with his father).

It really isn't that clear. Tough love from a coach or mentor is generally appreciated by the person after the fact. It is what drives the student to be the best, that which allows them to reach the top of their field. Saki obviously wanted this for Kousei, he wanted it himself, I think she crossed a line, but again that doesn't make her evil.

It's a complicated matrix, and one that can be hashed out later if you want. But there is your response.