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| THIS IS AN ANIME ONLY DISCUSSION POST. DO NOT DISCUSS THE MANGA BEYOND THIS EPISODE. ---------------------------------------- Not many people stayed for this one at MCM Loves Anime. |
 Novels I have read/am reading pending approval: since November 10 2022 |
| This movie in a nutshell: Beginning: ooh, decent interesting concept and good animation Later: Info dumping, info dumping... TL notes, TL notes...(all to quick to read) Too many unrecognizable or unfitting historical names(The instrument of evil is named Paul Bunyan?...Come on guys) Final verdict after the after credits scene: What the fuck was that?! |
AvidAnimeViewerFeb 28, 2016 1:13 PM
| Hmm this movie seemed strange to me. It has a LOT of potential imo because of the premise, setting (yes, I really like the setting in particular of this movie), and Watson seemed like an interesting character at first. I didn't like Friday much throughout the series as I find his connection with others to be hardly interesting. Hadaly is the breakout character imo especially in the latter half. Shame there wasn't much about we learn about her as the movie decided to focus on much bigger things. Wit Studio poured a decent amount of budget into this and the animation is fairly good so I did enjoy the technical part of the movie. Quite a weird ending and seems like it's open ended. Meh, 6/10. It's tolerable for me but I can't say that it's very enjoyable. Good potential but didn't capitalize on it fully. |
Stark700Mar 8, 2016 5:13 AM
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| Lmfao I didn't understand a fuck. It had potential but the movie was confusing asf. The post-credits scenes confused me even more. Goddamn was it a long movie. 7/10 for the animation and the visuals. |
XenocrisiFeb 29, 2016 7:53 AM
| Alright guys, the end was really confusing. 1- Did Watson give his soul to Friday? Then why both of them are safe and sound at the end? (In this case, did Watson forget all? Why?) 2- Did Friday gain a new soul during the journey? 3- Was Friday's soul "always there"? (Remember the promise of pointing twice the pen in Watson's face, Friday did that like saying -see, I remember that promise, I'm here!- ) Basically, what the hell happened in that holding hand final scene? Who is Watson now? Who is Friday? |
HELLO THERE, ONII-CHAN  |
| That was some good shiz. |
| I wonder if you all missed the minute or so after the credits, "4 years later" and the few words Friday said during the last credits. Besides that, I still can't get the scene of when Nikolai died out of my head. |
my_name_is_chef said: Alright guys, the end was really confusing. 1- Did Watson give his soul to Friday? Then why both of them are safe and sound at the end? (In this case, did Watson forget all? Why?) 2- Did Friday gain a new soul during the journey? 3- Was Friday's soul "always there"? (Remember the promise of pointing twice the pen in Watson's face, Friday did that like saying -see, I remember that promise, I'm here!- ) Basically, what the hell happened in that holding hand final scene? Who is Watson now? Who is Friday? 1. It seems like that is a new soul, so maybe he really gave a Friday his soul, and used a different soul on himself? 2. ??? 3. Yeah, it's pretty standard cliche - no matter what, they're be connected. Maybe, in this moment Friday got a Watson's soul, so hint of appearing consciousness appears in his eyes and movements. And it seems like Friday has become a Moriarty. But yeah, end is somehow feel like Evangelion - it's hard to say that this is a bad ending, or not. Maybe, between. |
TlahuizcapanteFeb 29, 2016 2:34 PM
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| Not bad for a 2 hour film. There were some amazing action scenes. The ending was quite unsatisfying for me. Solid 6/10 - whole thing felt like a pseudo-zombie film. |
| The premise was good but imo, the execution was weak. The animations were fantastic. But damn, am I confused O_O. And that ending makes it worse. 3/5 |
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| I'm confuse of what really happens.The story looks good at start but then become confusing later on. |
zueri_na said: had successfully 'rebirth' a new soul/consciousness in Friday by sacrificing Watson's memories? Watson didn't die, Friday got better mobility and ability to convey his thoughts/feelings whatever (at least better than the 'improved' reanimated corpse). Nice explanation! Still I don't get why if Watson gave up his memories, Friday could get more consciousness; it makes no sense to me |
HELLO THERE, ONII-CHAN |
| This movie of Project Itoh’s novels was an utter disappointment, imo. A mess of story and characters. A waste of budget, resources, and time. I heard it wasn’t a success at box office.... even the the Blu-rays (Limited Edition) sold rather poorly for a high budgeted movie. Please, let Harmony and the almost-axed-because-Manglobe-bankruptcy Genocidal Organ be better than this. |
zero-rMar 1, 2016 9:58 PM
 We ultimately fear what spawns from within us ~Shinsekai yori Music is freedom. ~Shigatsu wa Kimi no Uso |
| i dont know why but the movie gives the same feeling as Gundam: G no Reconguista you watch and you dont understand what is going on... the story sucks and using the names of famous characters makes it suck even more... even after credits too much questions left unanswered but not in cliffhanger kind of way but in way that something is missing even if it should be there english subs by russian mate who translated them from russian subs leaves much to be desired the art is amazing but hey this not naruto(or one piece) with episodes every week so it would strange if the art in movie sucked as much as the story and character backbone... Barnaby as the character i liked the rest not at all.... |
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| I think it's understandable as long as you pay attention and think about things. If you could understand the plot of Evangelion or Serial Experiments Lain, SNT's plot isn't rocket surgery by comparison. Keep in mind though that Itoh died before the book was finished, so the movie probably relies on some improvised storyline. My only complaint is that the characters probably should have been given original identities, rather than basing them off the Sherlock Holmes universe - they had very little in common with their literary counterparts. |
| Typing on an ipad is like driving carpentry nails with a sledgehammer. |
| So WIT Studio went into CG too? :| I expected visuals like Rolling Girls and Owari no Seraph, with beautiful hand drawn backgrounds and effects. What I got? CG garbage. I couldn't even focus on story :/ BTW, story was just average too. I don't know how to rate it. 5/10 will be fair. |
rsc-plMar 7, 2016 6:06 AM
| Dub = fake crap. Always. |
rsc-pl said: So WIT Studio went into CG too? :| I expected visuals like Rolling Girls and Owari no Seraph, with beautiful hand drawn backgrounds and effects. What I got? CG garbage. I couldn't even focus on story :/ BTW, story was just average too. I don't know how to rate it. 5/10 will be fair. I'm not sure about Rolling Girls but OnS had Studio Pablo for backgrounds, and actual animation work wasn't that impressive either. Seems to me that people are overhyping WIT too much over SnK considering SnK was full of QUALITY too. |
dilation said: rsc-pl said: So WIT Studio went into CG too? :| I expected visuals like Rolling Girls and Owari no Seraph, with beautiful hand drawn backgrounds and effects. What I got? CG garbage. I couldn't even focus on story :/ BTW, story was just average too. I don't know how to rate it. 5/10 will be fair. I'm not sure about Rolling Girls but OnS had Studio Pablo for backgrounds, and actual animation work wasn't that impressive either. Seems to me that people are overhyping WIT too much over SnK considering SnK was full of QUALITY too. I think that animation in OnS was pretty impressive too (backgrounds was epic) and Rolling Girls: And BTW, SNK was a collab production, I read somewhere that Wit had done only human characters animation. |
rsc-plMar 7, 2016 9:47 AM
| Dub = fake crap. Always. |
| This was interesting and at times, pretty confusing. Things got interesting when they revealed who Friday is. Before that, everything was pretty damn confusing, although the latter parts also had their confusing moments. This had references to many historical figures, both real life people and fictional characters of popular novels and I'm not sure if knowing who they are was important or not. I personally, only heard about Thomas Edison and Dr. Watson (and I found this out after the TL note lol). Anyway, Watson and his his colleague/friend, Friday, had this hypothesis that when a person dies, his body becomes 21 grams lighter. That weight belongs to the soul. They want to return that 21 grams back just like what happened to the First – someone revived complete with his soul. For this purpose, Friday gave himself up as a test subject and wanted Watson to do something and get his soul back. Writing everything that happens was something Watson thought may help bring the soul back. (one thing which was weird was that they have all this technology to bring back people to life as zombies and they still used candles? Why didn't Edison's invention gain popularity?). Watson was caught by the British intelligence man, M, and was told to find Alex – a person who supposedly has the notes of Victor (something which has a lot of secrets to revive people etc). Everyone wants those Notes – the Russians, the British, the Indians (isn't India under British control here?) etc – for their own purposes. Alex and Nick escaped the Soviets and hid themselves and the Notes. Burnaby and Watson go to Kabul with Nick to get those Notes, but they were in Japan – either Alex had them sent there or someone took them there and he found out. Either way, he told Watson to go and destroy the Notes. He and Nick killed themselves because the Soviets Russians were after them – if they were caught alive they would have been tortured to tell where the Notes are or they would have been killed. So they killed themselves to keep the location of the Notes a secret and eliminate the Russians from the search. In Japan, Watson finds the Notes, but instead of destroying it, starts analysing it with Friday to find out how to bring the soul back. That results in failure to an extent as he doesn't find out anything useful. However, Friday gets some soul back – and this is the reason why Hadaly couldn't control Friday through those sound waves which could control all other corpses. We get proof that Friday got some of his soul back later on when he and Watson are on their way to Hadaly's secret hideout – the three signs are: Friday taps Watson with the pen on his nose, Friday has tears in his eyes, and Friday tries to shoot himself. The reason why the First wants the Notes was a bit confusing – either he wanted to punish the humans for overstepping their boundaries by bringing people to life, or he wanted to bring back his ded waifu, or it had something to do with the Empire of Corpses Watson, Nick or Burnaby mentioned (or maybe that last one was the reason why the Russki's wanted the Notes). I think this was kinda like the First saying "we corpses have feelings too you know". After the Japan analysis failed, Watson tells Burnaby that he screwed up and wants to make up for it by stopping M who stole the Notes from the First. M wanted the Notes to punish the humans, I think. But whatever the case, his reason was more or less irrelevant since he didn't do anything in the end as the main thing was between the First and Watson. Hadaly wanted a soul too since she was a robot made by Edison. Her entry though. When they were up in the mountains and were ambushed, suddenly badass woman with a flamethrower shows up. That was pretty damn cool. The ending felt confusing but that could be the point. A theory I have is that Watson gave some of his soul to Friday (kinda like 10 grams out of the 21 grams he has). Both Friday and Watson live on like normal humans, more or less, as is seen in the four years later thing (when Sherlock Holmes and Watson partner up). One thing is for sure that Watson gave Friday his soul which was evidenced by Watson's hand going pale and Friday's hand regaining its color. And whatever Watson did resulted in the side-effect of him losing his memories. I'm not sure if there were any themes they wanted to get through because I didn't quite pick any. The animation was quite good I think. The CG moments didn't feel all that jarring to me. P.S Hadaly was sekushi. |
| Well that was okay. The animation seems good. But the story requires a lot of attention which I would give if it was interesting enough. To be honest, I still don't know what happened. |
Thanks for that :) While most of things you explained I had already understood, it was still nice to have everything written out. I wasn't sure what happened at the end since I thought Watson ended up sacrificing himself, but then the after-credits he was alive and with Holmes...but your explanation makes sense. It's sad that all he wanted to get Friday's soul back (and basically be like before) but even if he did give Friday part of his soul, he ended up forgetting everything. But I guess what Watson doesn't know won't hurt him, and Friday seems happy where he's at. A bittersweet ending is fitting for this type of story. Overall though, this movie was interesting, but felt a little messy, especially towards the end. And that's most likely because there's a lot to the story and the world that just can't be put into the length of a movie, even if it had 2 hours. All that glowing green souls at the end was cool and all, but I felt like I was watching a different movie at that point; everything before was sci-fi, but then it seemed like magic (the being able to control the corpses part too). It was odd. Wasn't sure what was going on with the crystals either. I feel like these things might've been explained in the novel? I would've like to see a little more about Watson and Friday's background, because we're given flashbacks that they were friends who researched together, but it wasn't gripping to see Watson so desperately trying to get Friday's soul back. Which goes back to my main complaint, which is the length of the movie given the type of story that was being told. Still, it now has me interested in the source material. The world of Shisha no Teikoku is quite intriguing, I really like the steampunk setting. The whole idea of an empire of corpses has a lot of potential. It's just unfortunate that the movie didn't flesh out at the very least, the main character, and when none of the characters are given much depth or have something interesting about them, the story just falls flat. The animation and visuals were top notch, as to be expected. I did notice the 3DCGI background characters here and there, but hey, it wasn't as bad as the ones in Bakemono no Ko, because there were a lot of things going on in those scenes, or at least more things to look at, such as the detailed backgrounds. Shiki said: Besides that, I still can't get the scene of when Nikolai died out of my head. For real...that was the most shocking part in the movie, and disturbing, really. Didn't imagine we'd see a live person go through that. I was eating cereal during that part and my appetite went poof. All the "soul" injection scenes made me cringe... |
Yamada2 said: This was interesting and at times, pretty confusing. Things got interesting when they revealed who Friday is. Before that, everything was pretty damn confusing, although the latter parts also had their confusing moments. This had references to many historical figures, both real life people and fictional characters of popular novels and I'm not sure if knowing who they are was important or not. I personally, only heard about Thomas Edison and Dr. Watson (and I found this out after the TL note lol). Anyway, Watson and his his colleague/friend, Friday, had this hypothesis that when a person dies, his body becomes 21 grams lighter. That weight belongs to the soul. They want to return that 21 grams back just like what happened to the First – someone revived complete with his soul. For this purpose, Friday gave himself up as a test subject and wanted Watson to do something and get his soul back. Writing everything that happens was something Watson thought may help bring the soul back. (one thing which was weird was that they have all this technology to bring back people to life as zombies and they still used candles? Why didn't Edison's invention gain popularity?). Watson was caught by the British intelligence man, M, and was told to find Alex – a person who supposedly has the notes of Victor (something which has a lot of secrets to revive people etc). Everyone wants those Notes – the Russians, the British, the Indians (isn't India under British control here?) etc – for their own purposes. Alex and Nick escaped the Soviets and hid themselves and the Notes. Burnaby and Watson go to Kabul with Nick to get those Notes, but they were in Japan – either Alex had them sent there or someone took them there and he found out. Either way, he told Watson to go and destroy the Notes. He and Nick killed themselves because the Soviets Russians were after them – if they were caught alive they would have been tortured to tell where the Notes are or they would have been killed. So they killed themselves to keep the location of the Notes a secret and eliminate the Russians from the search. In Japan, Watson finds the Notes, but instead of destroying it, starts analysing it with Friday to find out how to bring the soul back. That results in failure to an extent as he doesn't find out anything useful. However, Friday gets some soul back – and this is the reason why Hadaly couldn't control Friday through those sound waves which could control all other corpses. We get proof that Friday got some of his soul back later on when he and Watson are on their way to Hadaly's secret hideout – the three signs are: Friday taps Watson with the pen on his nose, Friday has tears in his eyes, and Friday tries to shoot himself. The reason why the First wants the Notes was a bit confusing – either he wanted to punish the humans for overstepping their boundaries by bringing people to life, or he wanted to bring back his ded waifu, or it had something to do with the Empire of Corpses Watson, Nick or Burnaby mentioned (or maybe that last one was the reason why the Russki's wanted the Notes). I think this was kinda like the First saying "we corpses have feelings too you know". After the Japan analysis failed, Watson tells Burnaby that he screwed up and wants to make up for it by stopping M who stole the Notes from the First. M wanted the Notes to punish the humans, I think. But whatever the case, his reason was more or less irrelevant since he didn't do anything in the end as the main thing was between the First and Watson. Hadaly wanted a soul too since she was a robot made by Edison. Her entry though. When they were up in the mountains and were ambushed, suddenly badass woman with a flamethrower shows up. That was pretty damn cool. The ending felt confusing but that could be the point. A theory I have is that Watson gave some of his soul to Friday (kinda like 10 grams out of the 21 grams he has). Both Friday and Watson live on like normal humans, more or less, as is seen in the four years later thing (when Sherlock Holmes and Watson partner up). One thing is for sure that Watson gave Friday his soul which was evidenced by Watson's hand going pale and Friday's hand regaining its color. And whatever Watson did resulted in the side-effect of him losing his memories. I'm not sure if there were any themes they wanted to get through because I didn't quite pick any. The animation was quite good I think. The CG moments didn't feel all that jarring to me. P.S Hadaly was sekushi. thankyouthankyouthankyouthankyouthankyou ---- i was going to say that i wasn't understanding around 60% of the movie, but ^cleared it up for me a lot. i came to the movie literally by a poster, and i found the art interesting. as to be expected, anime movies are excellent in art, so 10/10 there. of course nikolai has my favorite name of all time and he dies. of course. and i had no idea that friday/alex was his brother! but i did notice when nikolai was first seen, i thought it was friday because of the alikeness. i was like "Why is he acting normal??? Is this a flashback or something???" i wonder why he didn't even show a sign that he was looking at his dead brother. as always i am disappointed to see 3D in anime, but there wasn't the much so meh. the ED was excellent, and i knew that it was egoist simply from the singer. the thing is while egoist does make good songs the singer is terrible. she sounds like she's whining all the time, so i barely listen to them. but THIS, this is something worth listening to again. it was just so good. AND THAT ENDING THOUGH!!!!! watson meeting up with sherlock made me gape, and then break out in a clap. i must say with a little guilt that last one minute is better than all the movie. and apparently friday has all of his soul back and is now james. wonderful! i loved it, just because of that twist it's now a 9. and i noticed it was in the theaters too late...D: there's no reason to look at it again there, unless with a friend or some family, which i doubt will happen. |
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| The premise was mostly wasted on the rushed and repetitive execution. The first 20 min was really good. Then it went downhill from there on. Did not like the tacky references to mix known fictional and historical characters... like seriously? Hadaly is Irene Adler? >_> Unfortunately it reminds me too much like a poor attempt to mimic Asimov's Robot series with Daneel and such... |
bla bla bla The endless debate between fans and haters. At one point, after spending a lot of time on MAL, you just realize it's totally pointless.Niko-kun said: On MAL, everyone who has used the lame rating system becomes a critic and an intellectual by default, haven't you heard? |
| The movie was... OK. The story was a complete mess and didn't you feel like some scenes were missing? Also some characters appear and disappear without explanation! so frustrating! The only thing clear from the beginning are Watson's motives: he wants to prove Friday's theory and bring his soul back. But after that, the intentions behind everybody else's actions are badly explained. By the end of the movie you (kind of) understand why they wanted the Notes. This are my theories: 1) The First: when he makes all the corpses kill everybody (alive) you think is to prove a point: having undead people around is dangerous! but then you realize is because he need more undead people to recreate his wife's soul so they can live happily ever after. 2) M: he just thought "hey the best way to end the war is to kill everybody so they can't think for themselves! If they are zombies they won't be thinking about killing each other! problem solved! I'M A GENIUS." and that is why he does the same as the First. Last but not least, Watson recreates (in a smaller scale) The First experiment with the Notes and gives Friday a soul (I think because he couldn't do it like The First, Friday's soul is incomplete - he is like Lilith now) And now Lilith is Irene and she ends up with Watson. |
| Movie started out great but I fell asleep at the half part >.< |
| And this is why it's terrible to adapt an entire book to a 2 hour movie.... I wonder why didn't they milk this into a 2 parter or even to a trilogy, bet we would've gotten a much better exposition. I'm guessing they won't be able to sustain such quality though.... 8/10 bias of the art, music and the tons amount of historical references. EGOIST song at the end is bone chilling too. Only worthy scene to mention is Hadaly's entry and the scene with Nikolai and Karamazov's scene. ...I wonder if the story put M as a relative to Sherlock.... their hair color design is the same though so maybe they did. Maybe it's time to find and read the book instead. |
| Don't attribute maliciousness when stupidity is enough to explain what happens |
| i wish Watson would have destroyed the notes in Japan when he had the chance so i wouldnt have to watch the rest of this..whatever it is. Really forced myself to finish this to be honest. Hadaly is the only reason to finish this movie lol. |
Wind_God_Girl said: And this is why it's terrible to adapt an entire book to a 2 hour movie.... I wonder why didn't they milk this into a 2 parter or even to a trilogy, bet we would've gotten a much better exposition. I'm guessing they won't be able to sustain such quality though.... 8/10 bias of the art, music and the tons amount of historical references. EGOIST song at the end is bone chilling too. Only worthy scene to mention is Hadaly's entry and the scene with Nikolai and Karamazov's scene. ...I wonder if the story put M as a relative to Sherlock.... their hair color design is the same though so maybe they did. Maybe it's time to find and read the book instead. Except that Itoh died before the book was even completed. |
| Typing on an ipad is like driving carpentry nails with a sledgehammer. |
| Seriously, wtf did i just watch? The story was very chaotic! The only thing that prevented me from giving this movie a really bad score was the stellar art and animation. Fuck it im still gonna watch the other project itoh movies just for the art and animation. |
 |
Lu-Ru said: The movie was... OK. The story was a complete mess and didn't you feel like some scenes were missing? Also some characters appear and disappear without explanation! so frustrating! The only thing clear from the beginning are Watson's motives: he wants to prove Friday's theory and bring his soul back. But after that, the intentions behind everybody else's actions are badly explained. By the end of the movie you (kind of) understand why they wanted the Notes. This are my theories: 1) The First: when he makes all the corpses kill everybody (alive) you think is to prove a point: having undead people around is dangerous! but then you realize is because he need more undead people to recreate his wife's soul so they can live happily ever after. 2) M: he just thought "hey the best way to end the war is to kill everybody so they can't think for themselves! If they are zombies they won't be thinking about killing each other! problem solved! I'M A GENIUS." and that is why he does the same as the First. Last but not least, Watson recreates (in a smaller scale) The First experiment with the Notes and gives Friday a soul (I think because he couldn't do it like The First, Friday's soul is incomplete - he is like Lilith now) And now Lilith is Irene and she ends up with Watson. Isn't Irene a love interest of Holmes, not Watson in the actual fiction? Makes the ending even more some kind of fucked up cuckold. |
tenodera said: Isn't Irene a love interest of Holmes, not Watson in the actual fiction? Makes the ending even more some kind of fucked up cuckold. Omg! You are right! Irene is like the only woman who could fooled Holmes I think. Watson was married twice to Mary something and another one I can't remember. |
| Completely impressed I must say! The setting, atmosphere, story development and ending were all just so damn impressive. Loved the industrial/steampunk era addition quite a lot and the whole buildup was just great. It did feel for me though that this somehow was more of a 6 episode OVA series as some of the cuts of the stories really seemed going that way, but to be honest the whole flow of doing it in a movie wasn't wrong either. That said I must say that I really enjoyed this movie, and it definitly has been quite a while since I've seen a great movie. Will definitely recommend this for it being such a fantastic story and setting! |
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| So Friday now has a soul that is a mix of original Friday's, Watson's and something that was born from his writing everything down? To boot, he will eventually become Moriarty? Talk about confusing and lacking a decent explanation. |
| ったく、嫌な世の中だよ。 |
| This movie was suppose to be cool but his VERY disturbing obsession for his "FRIEND" ruined it all. RUINED!! Cute girl went full retard when she laments her lack of emotion/soul with a very sad face. I'm guessing 4 years later in the end the technology already improved so much that all corpses are now upgraded to have "emotions" and behave like a normal person. Bet that emotion data came from the girl anyway.....not so surprising considering the technology existed 4 years ago. |
| Confusing and edgy, that's fine with me. |
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