kitsune0 said: And so I want to reconsider http://myanimelist.net/character/55839/Tsumiki_Miniwa No matter how we I love like her, she's tsundere, thou not classical or contemporary. I just did some research and even though she is listed in the tsundere club, no one made a poll for her. She may have been added by mistake in the tsundere club cause as we know, she isn't a character that expresses herself well and show much facial emotion and if only when she is sparked or teased with her love for the male lead but she wouldn't be a kuu"dere" if there wasn't any of that cause then she would just be an emotionless girl. I'm going to ask why she is added though in the tsundere club. And get to the bottom of this. =o It also would have been helpful to why you think she is a tsundere btw. And for Sheila, wish they had a better picture of her, she sounds KDEG so I'll add her. |
| You kiddin'? It's all in the show. She's even been called "tsun-neko" and has her own musical theme, "Tsun-neko Waltz". 0f course, it's because of her over-the-top-violent (though comedic) reactions to situations where she's been exposed as madly in love with Io, though it's overly obvious and she's just blindly denying it. And also there constant "sound" effect "tsun~" for her in such situations, both in manga & anime. P.S. I'm readin' it, it's one of, if not the, my favorite manga (anime). But yes, she's one of the rather new bound-breakin' characters, just as Hitagi Senjougahara (it's very obvious that she's been called "tsundere" only for comedic reasons. Yes, she has some of it in her, but also too much of yandere to call her just "tsundere". Heck, she's even calling herself "tsundere", where else do you find such conscious tsundere? Tsundere archetype build on the denying of own personal traits. But she's too cold to call her "yandere" (no "-dere" here). Just like life, LoL, all too complicated to fit in any strict form). |
kitsune0Jan 6, 2014 5:37 AM
There is such thing as shit taste. Only idiots think that every "work of art" should have the same value. Persona anime are good. Deal with it. |
kitsune0 said: You kiddin'? It's all in the show. She's even been called "tsun-neko" and has her own musical theme, "Tsun-neko Waltz". 0f course, it's because of her over-the-top-violent (though comedic) reactions to situations where she's been exposed as madly in love with Io, though it's overly obvious and she's just blindly denying it. And also there constant "sound" effect "tsun~" for her in such situations, both in manga & anime. P.S. I'm readin' it, it's one of, if not the, my favorite manga (anime). But yes, she's one of the rather new bound-breakin' characters, just as Hitagi Senjougahara (it's very obvious that she's been called "tsundere" only for comedic reasons. Yes, she has some of it in her, but also too much of yandere to call her just "tsundere". Heck, she's even calling herself "tsundere", where else do you find such conscious tsundere? Tsundere archetype build on the denying of own personal traits. But she's too cold to call her "yandere" (no "-dere" here). Just like life, LoL, all too complicated to fit in any strict form). (Sorry for the late reply) I don't see her denying her love but too shy to let anyone talk about it. Normally tsunderes do deny like you mentioned but they are vocal and really expressive about it in terms of personality (and also take it out on the male lead), where as Tsumiki just blushes and then proceeds to shut people up about it that instigated it unlike most tsunderes we have seen. In other words, she doesn't act how a tsundere should act and due to her quietness, her constant demeanor of lacking expressions unlike normal girls and tsunderes. Well, we do have Hitagi on this list here (I don't agree with it but w/e). Sure, we all would like to have a perfect KDEG list but due to varying opinions since KDEGs in general are not as easy to spot than like tsunderes, there will be things we don't agree with lol. xD I did mentioned Tsumiki to Zettai anyways, and he also doesn't agree with her being reconsidered. Oh, btw, having the anime calling her tsundere doesn't mean she is but you did mention that for Hitagi too as you see her as a yandere. But we aren't going to have an anime calling anyone kuudere anytime soon, that term just isn't popular in the anime world, just "tsunderes" are, so that's why you hear it, for the comedy reasons, rather it being accurate or not. :\ |
EtherSword said: I can't remember clearly and too lazy to go through countless pages, but if my memory not failin' me, there is/are situation(s) where she directly denied bein' in love with Io. 0ne thing I remember clearly: there was that classical "I-it's nyat [="not" with her hysterical "cat accent"] like that!"I don't see her denying her love but too shy to let anyone talk about it. Normally tsunderes do deny like you mentioned but they are vocal and really expressive about it in terms of personality (and also take it out on the male lead), where as Tsumiki just blushes and then proceeds to shut people up about it that instigated it unlike most tsunderes we have seen. In other words, she doesn't act how a tsundere should act and due to her quietness, her constant demeanor of lacking expressions unlike normal girls and tsunderes. Well, we do have Hitagi on this list here (I don't agree with it but w/e). I did mentioned Tsumiki to Zettai anyways, and he also doesn't agree with her being reconsidered. And yes, she's not speakin' much, she prefer action(s) instead. And very violent (though pictured comically), mind it - how about literally chewing/biting Io's head/hand even when it's not he who speak something about love? And it's just a little less violent when it comes to others - even when she's not resortin' to violence, there is always very violent (more like "killing intent") aura. It's much more than "just being too shy to talk about it". If it's not "tsunderish" I don't know what it is. Also, there are too much active (again, in violent-though-comedic form) jealousy in her (as seen, for example, in one "Kindergarden" sequence: how about literally jumpin' on others to not let them hug her precious "Io-tentei"?). |
| There is such thing as shit taste. Only idiots think that every "work of art" should have the same value. Persona anime are good. Deal with it. |
kitsune0 said: ]I can't remember clearly and too lazy to go through countless pages, but if my memory not failin' me, there is/are situation(s) where she directly denied bein' in love with Io. 0ne thing I remember clearly: there was that classical "I-it's nyat [="not" with her hysterical "cat accent"] like that!" And yes, she's not speakin' much, she prefer action(s) instead. And very violent (though pictured comically), mind it - how about literally chewing/biting Io's head/hand even when it's not he who speak something about love? And it's just a little less violent when it comes to others - even when she's not resortin' to violence, there is always very violent (more like "killing intent") aura. It's much more than "just being too shy to talk about it". If it's not "tsunderish" I don't know what it is. Also, there are too much active (again, in violent-though-comedic form) jealousy in her (as seen, for example, in one "Kindergarden" sequence: how about literally jumpin' on others to not let them hug her precious "Io-tentei"?). The thing is, if you removed the absurd scenes where people claim she's a tsundere and her saying the generic tsundere line nothing else would come as her being tsundere, because she isn't. Just because she gets angry or punishes people she doesn't stop being a kuudere. Look at Shouko from BakaTest, who injures her boyfriend-childhood lover all the damn time. Or Kuroneko, who mocks Kyousuke ocasionally. Megumi from Servant x Service is quite agressive towards her boyfriend too. For a yuri example Cthuko gets VERY rough with Nyarlko, but that's more femdom. Hell, for a non-love example look no further than our current top picture, as Ringo spent rought half the latest episode trying to hurt Becky for being rude towards her. By the way, protective jealousy like the one Tsumiki shows is typical of YANDERES and nothing tsunderes do. You also seem to forget all the many, many instances of Io and her being too flustered to talk to each other, when if a REAL tsundere saw the guy get flustered she'd chew him out or something. Honestly, is far more likely than the author had no freaking idea of what a tsundere really was and randomly used the term for a kuudere than anything else. Much like Suite PreCure says over and over a Muse is a goddess of music when that is simply not true. Authors make mistakes too. |
ZettaiRyouiki said: Sadly, I'm familiar only with Kuroneko and Cthuko cases.Look at Shouko from BakaTest, who injures her boyfriend-childhood lover all the damn time. Or Kuroneko, who mocks Kyousuke ocasionally. Megumi from Servant x Service is quite agressive towards her boyfriend too. For a yuri example Cthuko gets VERY rough with Nyarlko, but that's more femdom. Hell, for a non-love example look no further than our current top picture, as Ringo spent rought half the latest episode trying to hurt Becky for being rude towards her. ZettaiRyouiki said: Not really. How about all-too-classical "He is MY dog!" line? Yes, there is more aggression that [actual] violence, but still.By the way, protective jealousy like the one Tsumiki shows is typical of YANDERES and nothing tsunderes do. ZettaiRyouiki said: With author bein' Japanese not Western? I highly doubt it. More likely, as with above-mentioned Hitagi, it's author mockin' & playin' with contemporary tsundere obsession. Yes, just as you mentioned above, Japanese authors somewhat [in]famous for takin' very liberal interpretations on Western culture (actually, reverse cases are no better), but not on their own.Honestly, is far more likely than the author had no freaking idea of what a tsundere really was and randomly used the term for a kuudere than anything else. Much like Suite PreCure says over and over a Muse is a goddess of music when that is simply not true. Authors make mistakes too. ZettaiRyouiki said: G-d-damn, you are so right! Sorry, totally missed it. 0K, I get it. Just as in real life, some characters are too complicated to fit them in strict limits. The Hell with it, I love her anyway, and her bein' [mainly] kuudere plays a big role in it.You also seem to forget all the many, many instances of Io and her being too flustered to talk to each other, when if a REAL tsundere saw the guy get flustered she'd chew him out or something. Thank you both for your time, as always, it was pleasant to talk with you both. |
| There is such thing as shit taste. Only idiots think that every "work of art" should have the same value. Persona anime are good. Deal with it. |
_Hoshi said: I'm not very good at naming characters since I haven't watched an awful lot. Shouldn't Mikasa Ackerman (Shingeki no Kyojin) be added to the list? She does seem like someone that should be on the group. That one case is hard to define, mainly because it's one of those anime where characters aren't "typical" (meaning that, characters don't have their personalities set to fulfill a role within the anime) but if we were to assume regular typification applies, then Mikasa has a few secondary traits, like traumatic past events, but her character is complex, it doesn't adapts to our standard kuudere definition, and it couldn't be emotionless either. I'm leaning yes for the most part though, if only for the secondary traits, I think we would need to demonstrate that she has at least 1 of the main traits for kuudere and that would make her an emotional lesser that can be entered on the basis of secondary traits, kinda like the robot girl from Sasami. |
| Kanna Makino from Tamako Market should definitely be added |
| G-d-dam', totally forgot that I've wanted to return here. I'm takin' back what I said. I'm N0T agree. EtherSword said: I already wrote about it, but: yes, she IS takin' it on the male lead, every damn time he's present.(and also take it out on the male lead), where as Tsumiki just blushes and then proceeds to shut people up about it ZettaiRyouiki said: Yes, because she's not JUST gettin' angry at people for various reasons - she get's angry 0NLY when it's about Io + love. If it's not tsundere I don't evenJust because she gets angry or punishes people she doesn't stop being a kuudere. ZettaiRyouiki said: Not an argument - "mock" not equal "punch & kick". Also, it's one of the classical kuudere traits - bein' sarcastical:Kuroneko, who mocks Kyousuke ocasionally. It's not that they spare friends any of the Deadpan Snarker wit EtherSword said: No, overprotective jealousy IS classical tsundere AND yandere trait, just in latter case in tends to be not comedy-violent, but deadly-serious, which is not present in our case (comedy, remember?).By the way, protective jealousy like the one Tsumiki shows is typical of YANDERES and nothing tsunderes do. You also seem to forget all the many, many instances of Io and her being too flustered to talk to each other, when if a REAL tsundere saw the guy get flustered she'd chew him out or something. And final blow the most important part: compare her to Loise from Zero no Tsukaima. Tsumiko is like a carbon copy of her when it gets to them bein' together: when she & Io are alone, he can do pretty much anything with her without any comebacks, as well as she's bein' all "dere-" over him, but the second anyone appears present, she's at best becomes all too embarrassed (scene at a river with sleepin' Io) and usually just acts very violently (yes, comically, but still) towards Io. If it's not tsundere than we need seriously review the very own definition of tsundere. |
| There is such thing as shit taste. Only idiots think that every "work of art" should have the same value. Persona anime are good. Deal with it. |
| Please add Karen Minamino from Aika R-16 http://myanimelist.net/character.php?id=15617 |
Well, there's the character description, and the fact that Mamiko is voicing her. But after watching the anime I'm still going to say: I'm leaning no. --Thanks for your suggestion though. |
| ZettaiRyouiki said: Just because she gets angry or punishes people she doesn't stop being a kuudere. Kitsune0 said: Yes, because she's not JUST gettin' angry at people for various reasons - she get's angry 0NLY when it's about Io + love. If it's not tsundere I don't even That doesn't make her automatically tsundere. But I think the problem is you're misunderstanding the term "dere", generally a lot of kuudere's, yanderes, tsunderes, show the most emotion when they are around the male lead and if alone with them, its like that in most animes with kuu"deres". I can't even believe you are comparing Tsumiko to Louise, how am I suppose to respond to that lol. xD Their personalities are way, way different dude. xD You need to watch more animes when kuuderes are alone with their male leads or are you going to ahead and decide they are tsunders also now? :P Anyways kuuderes =/= emotionless girls. Yuki Nagato is more like that even though she is showing more subtle emotion "lately" lol. xD |
| Not sure if ithis was mentioned in the previous pages but is Laura Bodewig a kuudere? |
EtherSword said: No, I think it's you misunderstandin' the very definition of -dere family. It's not about how they (=girls) act in general, it's about how they act when it gets to love matters. That's why kuudere=/=emotionless. I can't even believe that you've read my post that inattentively if you think that I'm comparin' Tsumiko & Louise as whole, while it was clear as day that I'm comparin' only their behavior with their loved ones. Fer Cris sake, don't mix temperament & -dere-ness. Tsumiko is phlegmatic tsundere. Try to find kuudere that's physically abuse her loved one on a regular level without any actual need to it, I dare you.That doesn't make her automatically tsundere. But I think the problem is you're misunderstanding the term "dere", generally a lot of kuudere's, yanderes, tsunderes, show the most emotion when they are around the male lead and if alone with them, its like that in most animes with kuu"deres". I can't even believe you are comparing Tsumiko to Louise, how am I suppose to respond to that lol. xD Their personalities are way, way different dude. xD You need to watch more animes when kuuderes are alone with their male leads or are you going to ahead and decide they are tsunders also now? :P Anyways kuuderes =/= emotionless girls. Yuki Nagato is more like that even though she is showing more subtle emotion "lately" lol. xD P.S. G-d-damn, MAL again messin' missin' my notifications about new replies. |
| There is such thing as shit taste. Only idiots think that every "work of art" should have the same value. Persona anime are good. Deal with it. |
| Isuzu Sento from Amagi Brilliant Park. http://myanimelist.net/character/99035/Isuzu_Sento |
 |
kitsune0 said: EtherSword said: No, I think it's you misunderstandin' the very definition of -dere family. It's not about how they (=girls) act in general, it's about how they act when it gets to love matters. That's why kuudere=/=emotionless. I can't even believe that you've read my post that inattentively if you think that I'm comparin' Tsumiko & Louise as whole, while it was clear as day that I'm comparin' only their behavior with their loved ones. Fer Cris sake, don't mix temperament & -dere-ness. Tsumiko is phlegmatic tsundere. Try to find kuudere that's physically abuse her loved one on a regular level without any actual need to it, I dare you.That doesn't make her automatically tsundere. But I think the problem is you're misunderstanding the term "dere", generally a lot of kuudere's, yanderes, tsunderes, show the most emotion when they are around the male lead and if alone with them, its like that in most animes with kuu"deres". I can't even believe you are comparing Tsumiko to Louise, how am I suppose to respond to that lol. xD Their personalities are way, way different dude. xD You need to watch more animes when kuuderes are alone with their male leads or are you going to ahead and decide they are tsunders also now? :P Anyways kuuderes =/= emotionless girls. Yuki Nagato is more like that even though she is showing more subtle emotion "lately" lol. xD P.S. G-d-damn, MAL again messin' missin' my notifications about new replies. Omg, I never said their were emotionless and look at what I bolded. I never said how they acted in general either about their dere side, only around their loved ones. Stop making up stuff on what I said or I'm not going to bother anymore. Your comparison to Louise and Tsumiko is misconstrued, Louise shows a big array of emotions, expressions and body language while we see Tsumiko in a more quiet, expressionless and subtle matter. And guess what, when Tsumiko isn't around her loved one, she stills gives off the same quiet nature while Louise still gives off her boisterous persona. That sets them far apart from them both being tsundere. Stop being in denial already and look at their key differences that I just explained to you. Is that all the argument you are trying to make? Their level of abuse is the only key difference you think that sets them apart in terms of what makes Tsumiko a tsundere or a kuudere? There are all types of kuuderes, not all of them behave the same way, you need to understand that. Take example of Machi from Nagasarete Airantou, going by your flawed logic, she's a tsundere lol. Here you go: http://myanimelist.net/character/2615/Machi Like I said, you need to watch more animes showcasing kuuderes so you have a better understanding of them. PrevE said: Not sure if ithis was mentioned in the previous pages but is Laura Bodewig a kuudere? She's closer to a dandere actually but even then, she's not close enough. What's holding her back imo is she's a bit too strong headed. Palsa-San said: Isuzu Sento from Amagi Brilliant Park. http://myanimelist.net/character/99035/Isuzu_Sento You might actually be right. I always kept thinking about it but I forgot consider her in the club. I'll add her. |
| She has occasional outbursts, but she's definitely kuudere. This is the girl that had to think for a minute, before realizing that she is supposed to say '. . . . . . . Kyaa. . . . . . . .' when someone walks in on you while taking a shower. lol |
|
EpicNothing said: Hi ></, is this thread about KDEG or only Kuudere ? I'm watching Yahari Ore no Seishun Love Comedy wa Machigatteiru, because season 2 is airing now and I wanted to know what happened before. May I suggest http://myanimelist.net/character/67067/Yukino_Yukinoshita ? I think she's at least an EG (or acts as one, not sure if it makes her elligible). Based on TV Tropes deffination of a kuundere: TV said: Type 1 — Always In Control: Comes off as "kuu-" (cool) because of emotional control, maintaining a calm, collected exterior. Expressions are subtle, with watery eyes being akin◊ to bawling, and a small smile being akin to a◊ giggle fit◊. Feelings may be filtered through snark◊ or dry wit. The appeal is their bluntness and directness, in contrast to shy reserve or boisterous rowdiness. If playing a Love Interest, either the other partner will be the source of Will They or Won't They?, or they'll skip that and the focus will be on the drama that comes after they admit They Do. Occasionally this is a trait of a more exaggerated character, the Emotionless Girl. Our page picture, Teen Titans' Raven, is an example of this variation. Type 2 — Once You Get To Know Them: They will show the 'dere' side, but strangers and the untrusted will see the 'kuu' side. Friends all consider them to be caring and in private moments with them you may just catch them laughing. Although it will still be considered unusual. It's not that they spare friends any of the Deadpan Snarker wit or that they don't act 'kuu' with them sometimes. The friends just understand it better than those that aren't close. Type 3 — Mood-Swinger: Alternating between 'kuu-' and 'dere' persona depending on mood. What controls the mood? Some may have clearly defined Berserk Buttons. Companions might learn how to manipulate this to their advantage. Others might switch moods at what seems to be random moments, which can be very unnerving or confusing to those nearby. Some might contend that this version isn't 'kuu-' (cool) enough to qualify as a kuudere, and might place them in some other category. Obviously these variations aren't always used pure, and often are mixed together in different characters. Again using Raven as an example, while she fits the first variation best, she certainly has elements of the other two. I would say that she definitely meets first type, but it's not my call. On a side note, wouldn't Hachiman Hikigaya also qualify as a kuundere?: http://myanimelist.net/character/67065/Hachiman_Hikigaya Seeing as he's cold on the outside and always keeps to himself, but in reality he's always helping others. Another character that I would like to recommend is Isla from Plastic Memories: http://myanimelist.net/character/124049/Isla |
PalsaMay 29, 2015 9:49 PM
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| Please note that our definitions have been adapted to a standardized consensus which was subject to discussion by our staff and does not necessarily reflects the public opinion on the traits that define a kuudere. Also, this club is strictly for female characters, as it is clearly stated on the club title. |
| I still suggest yukino too ^ |
| How about this?not sure if shes eligible by the IAC.she doesnt use any weapons since its a martial arts manhwa http://myanimelist.net/character/74149/In_Gyi_Yoon |
PrevE said: How about this?not sure if shes eligible by the IAC.she doesnt use any weapons since its a martial arts manhwa http://myanimelist.net/character/74149/In_Gyi_Yoon Because of the current selection standard, there are major limitations imposed on "manga only" characters. I know we were pretty open about it before, but at least for the time being, these characters have little to no chance to enter, they will have to wait. I mean, they way you interpret a character on anime is entirely different when you look at the same character on still panels, even meaningless things like color or voice being left to your imagination can drastically change the perception of the character. |
| Tomori Nao should be added to the list. |
| how about Kazuki Kazami from grisaia series and Hishiro Chizuru from manga ReLIFE TBA in 2016 both emotionless of course :) |
| Luca from Mouretsu Pirates should be added to the list. As you can see she meets the first and the second IAC criteria perfectly. After watching the whole TV show I can confirm that she's extremely emotionless and shows no warmth whatsoever toward any character of the anime. |
CaptainCrackpotFeb 13, 2016 2:04 AM
chesschase said: is Kohina from Gugure Kokkuri-san on the list already? ^^ Took a while but she is now. CaptainCrackpot said: Luca from Mouretsu Pirates should be added to the list. As you can see she meets the first and the second IAC criteria perfectly. After watching the whole TV show I can confirm that she's extremely emotionless and shows no warmth whatsoever toward any character of the anime. Well, to be honest, the IAC was more of an algorithm for admins to spot potential KDEGs but as of today, we have our doubts on the so called "sleepy eyes" .. which is now a secondary trait and not as important as we used to think, so we pretty much discarded that in favour of our main criteria. Still, thanks for the suggestion. |
| Is the group exclusive to anime/manga? Didn't see it anywhere so... I strongly suggest In Gyi "Queen" Yoon, from Girls of The Wild's for a kuudere. She's the cutest thing, and meets all the criteria. 50 chapters of the Manhwa are enough to understand it. :P Going to the love interest's house. With a friend. Keep going. Extra *^,^* |
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