| Gundam SEED Destiny exists~ And too early to judge Witch From Mercury, I will wait and see what they will do with the Earthnoids/Spacenoids tensions~ |
| I honestly don’t even see what’s bad about this. The prevented assassination serves to establish the importance of the duels in world affairs and introduce the running theme of the school being a microcosm of the world’s corporate conflicts, not to mention the theme of the school’s students being largely ignorant of the wider conflicts around them due to living in a bubble of peace. Meanwhile, trying to include the core cast directly into the assassination plot would be a subplot in its own right that would be far too much for a single first episode, and would most likely be completely unworkable within the planned framework of Suletta and Miorine’s character arcs. Your only criticism of this point, meanwhile, is that it would be prevented in a completely hypothetical scenario where things went differently… which applies to all plot points in all of fiction Also, do not even begin to say something is the “Worst Written Gundam Show” when SEED Destiny exists |
| Barely catching my breath! Lay my eyes on the crest! Gonna square up to all of the heat that is left! So I carry the torch! To Inferno! Inferno! GENERATION 45: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment. |
| Idk chief… there’s some pretty bad gundams. Like have you seen SEED? |
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boxexp01 said: Yes I agree good point: If tanjiro come back to his home 1 hour earlier or later or if muzan feels like eating hamburger instead of his family, tanjiro will never get a chance to be a demon slayer. Surely it is the worst written shounen since ep1 If denji didn't went to Yakuza hideout or if pochita somehow dying some 100 meters to the left of his father's grave, denji wouldn't ever become chainsaw man. Oh damn, chainsaw man might even be worse written than demon slayer Here's your kny's explaination:- Tanjiro family probably got killed at night time when tanjiro was sleeping. Here's your Csm's explaination:- Why would Denji deny his yakuza boss's order? Pochita was probably already far away from Denji but pochita sensed a human so it came where Denji was. |
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Typecero said: I have to disagree here. If you remove the Assassination, you still have the importance of duels, but with the Assassination event still in the story, you have placed an emphasis where the writers have written themselves into a corner from the outset. If this assassination is not prevented, the entire story falls apart. The Company that Miorine and Suletta form? It can't happen because Miorine is Guel's fiancee, and has no political power. Suletta is no longer at the school, and duels are now removed from the equation because of Guel's father (he comments on episode 1 that he finds them to be stupid, and I would certainly as an assassin prevent myself from losing the power I have gained) I don't really see how that's "being written into a corner". You keep saying that it's bad because if it had happened differently the entire story would have fallen apart, but, well, that's how all stories work, it's called having Pivotal Moment. You could say the same thing for almost every part of the episode ("what if Suletta hadn't noticed Miorine drifting in Space?" for example). I feel like there's a bit of a point buried in what you're trying to say (the fact that the duel occured just as the assassination was happening did seem a bit contrived) but you're communicating it rather poorly and, in my opinion, kinda blowing it out of proportion (one semi-contrived plot point does not mean a show ruined forever) Typecero said: If Gundam SEED is written where episode 1 destroys the entire story, by all means tell me... because Witch of Gundam destroys its story all on its own, in the very beginning. You say Seed is bad, but unless it does this amount of damage in the very first 20 minutes, I have to call bullshit. SEED spent its entire first episode lazily copying Gundam 0079 and doing every single part of it worse (and, in fact, continued ripping off 0079 for the next 25 episodes), squandering its potential to form its own identity and leaving most of the cast (including the protagonist) feeling about as dry and uninteresting as sandpaper. So, yeah, I'd say it had a worse first episode Also, I was specifically referring to SEED's sequel, SEED Destiny. SEED was at least halfway decent, SEED Destiny had 20 episodes straight of pure crap which ruined all the potential the first half of the show had and left more than a few people (myself included) rather frustrated with its ending (though, ironically, its first episode was pretty good, but I personally value endings more than beginnings anyway) |
| Barely catching my breath! Lay my eyes on the crest! Gonna square up to all of the heat that is left! So I carry the torch! To Inferno! Inferno! GENERATION 45: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment. |
boxexp01 said: Yes I agree good point: If tanjiro come back to his home 1 hour earlier or later or if muzan feels like eating hamburger instead of his family, tanjiro will never get a chance to be a demon slayer. Surely it is the worst written shounen since ep1 If denji didn't went to Yakuza hideout or if pochita somehow dying some 100 meters to the left of his father's grave, denji wouldn't ever become chainsaw man. Oh damn, chainsaw man might even be worse written than demon slayer Kamados were killed intentionally by Muzan. But yeah, OP complains about first episode which suppose to establish everything so there is no plot contrivance yet. ImElitist said: boxexp01 said: Yes I agree good point: If tanjiro come back to his home 1 hour earlier or later or if muzan feels like eating hamburger instead of his family, tanjiro will never get a chance to be a demon slayer. Surely it is the worst written shounen since ep1 If denji didn't went to Yakuza hideout or if pochita somehow dying some 100 meters to the left of his father's grave, denji wouldn't ever become chainsaw man. Oh damn, chainsaw man might even be worse written than demon slayer Until you realise the kind of author tatsuki fujimoto is and know that he doesn't normally write action and that chainsaw man isn't a shounen as much as it is a deconstruction/reimagining of it hence the asspulls which are a mirror of the genre itself and its numerous issues, not saying chainsaw man is a 10/10 best of all time, just saying that setting up rules and judging things by them in a story are pretty pointless if they don't apply to them at all, you can't say a question is wrong because you using the wrong formula gives you the wrong answer, stuff isn't that simple especially with something as subjective as media made for our consumption Stop pretending you are smart or elitist. Most of your comment is gibberish. CSM is shounen because it's published in shounen magazine, just like Death Note was, in the same one. SHOUNEN IS NOT A GENRE. IT DOESN'T SPECIFY ANYTHING ABOUT THE PLOT. You can't deconstruct it. |
bastek66Dec 10, 2022 12:45 PM
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| That reminds me of an epic quote, 'If my grandmother had wheels, she'd been a bike'. Or in this case, 'My grandmother is only human because she doesn't have wheel'. |
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| I invite the OP to go and watch ZZ Gundam, Reconguista or Seed Destiny before writing something like this. While clearly Mercury will probably not reach the heights of episode 1 again, it's not that awful of a story. |
| "Perhaps there is a universal, absolute truth. Perhaps it justifies every question. But that's beyond the reach of these small hands." Mamoru Oshii There is a cult of ignorance (...) nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that “my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.” Isaac Asimov |
| this is unironically shaping out to be one of the better gundam shows. I highly doubt anything will dethrone Stardust Memory and WING from being the "Worst" in a long long while |
| SEED Destiny, X, Wing, Thunderbolt, all exist. |
| Sir, this is a Wendy's. On a serious note, your point is pretty dumb. Not only because of your "IBO contrivances good, G-Witch contrivances bad" which are 100% arbitrary, or the face that you can use the same logic in every Gundam (I'll use Turn A as an example): *What if the FLAT landed on Luzianna instead of Inglessa? *What if Loran wasn't saved by the coyotes because Guin Rhineford wasn't flying there or didn't have his gun? What if he had missed his shots? *What if he decided to go swim one hour earlier/later, therefore never meeting the Heim family? *Isn't it a bit too lucky that he happened to meet the only person in the world that looks like Diana? *What if the Earth Invasion didn't happen the same day as the "Coming-of-Age Cerimony"? But also because of the fact you're criticizing something you yourself invented. No, the events of the first episode don't exist solely to prevent the assassination sub-plot, but rather have value into themselves, the sub-plot only serves as dramatic irony. In fact, if this "offends" you so much, know that this sub-plot could've been removed with some pretty trivial changes and wouldn't change anything in the plot, just make Prospera being forced to explain herself to the Benerit Group instead of only being able to go there because she blackmailed Vim Jeturk. If something, what you should be complaining instead is Delling accepting the duel proposal when he couldn't just said "No" since he was earlier presented as an "I am the rules" guy that no one can go against, but based on events that happened afterwards this could be explained with "he always favors his daughter in a way or another". That's a fallacy, since you can only say that knowing the following events. G-Witch could have 100% happened in an alternative version where Miorine's dad is killed, the only thing is that we would have a different story, which essentially makes your point "If something relevant in the plot changed, it would go other way", for which the answer is "...Yes?". |
thewiruDec 11, 2022 2:09 PM
NewestPersonHere said: Gundam SEED Destiny exists~ And too early to judge Witch From Mercury, I will wait and see what they will do with the Earthnoids/Spacenoids tensions~ Aren't you the same person that complains about seed on every gundam forum yet go as far as to shill G Reco over evangelion. It is kind of obvious this show flopped outside the children demographic age. Its mal rating despite being a new hyper show is already much lower than the previous entries and has some abysmal performance on polls. Kind of time for people to admit this show has become hot garbage |
icefirestone23Dec 11, 2022 2:39 PM
| People do realize there isn't a single well received nor good Gundam show after zeta. There is a reason Tomino said the franchise should have ended after 79. yall are addicted to burning your salary on model kits to realize most people are not enjoying this show. It regularly fails on polls, extreme amounts of people dropped the show, those who continue are complaining. The only reason the mal rating is fairly high because gigguk and anitube shilled this show and even they aren't watching it. |
icefirestone23 said: NewestPersonHere said: Gundam SEED Destiny exists~ And too early to judge Witch From Mercury, I will wait and see what they will do with the Earthnoids/Spacenoids tensions~ Aren't you the same person that complains about seed on every gundam forum yet go as far as to shill G Reco over evangelion. It is kind of obvious this show flopped outside the children demographic age. Its mal rating despite being a new hyper show is already much lower than the previous entries and has some abysmal performance on polls. Kind of time for people to admit this show has become hot garbage I have not compared G-Reco with Evangelion before, not sure who you are describing. A lot of people criticise SEED because of Kira/Lacus. MAL rating does not matter, profits matter to Bandai. Well, gunplas and Gundam games here always sell out faster than shounen fighting games~ I won’t judge Witch From Mercury until its final episode. |
NewestPersonHere said: icefirestone23 said: Aren't you the same person that complains about seed on every gundam forum yet go as far as to shill G Reco over evangelion. It is kind of obvious this show flopped outside the children demographic age. Its mal rating despite being a new hyper show is already much lower than the previous entries and has some abysmal performance on polls. Kind of time for people to admit this show has become hot garbage I have not compared G-Reco with Evangelion before, not sure who you are describing. A lot of people criticise SEED because of Kira/Lacus. MAL rating does not matter, profits matter to Bandai. Well, gunplas and Gundam games here always sell out faster than shounen fighting games~ I won’t judge Witch From Mercury until its final episode. The Gundam fandom outside japan has to one of the most brain dead anime fandoms I have ever seen. What fandom has some OCD on a 20 year old series that had the best ratings and sales out of the entire franchise. Then goes on to praise one of the worst anime shows of the decade (aka G Reco). I have seen you defending G-Reco a lot as well as flops like after war and turn, and constantly hating on seed, wing, ibo. Here is bad news by the way. Bandai is not going to hit their sales margins overseas. Many overseas retailers are starting to put even their uc kits on clearance. Just like what happened to transformers and gi joe. It is pretty obvious that people think this show is trash, despite anitube shilling this show like crazy. We have people dunking on this show every week now, and social media buzz is low. Poll turnouts are terrible. If the only defense of a show is dunking on another 20 year old show, the show has to be hot garbage. |
icefirestone23Dec 11, 2022 5:17 PM
Monochrosanity said: Idk chief… there’s some pretty bad gundams. Like have you seen SEED? Comments like these shows the overseas fandom need to touch some grass thinking they know the Gundam franchise better than Japan. I have seen so many Gundam fans fiercely defending G Reco and saying it is a better show than Evangelion when the entire internet trashed it and sales reflected it. People need to just admit this show is dog shit and is just an excuse to burn money on plamo rather than having a riot on r/anime whenever anime corner rankings come out, and a bunch of gundam fans have to get banned on facebook and reddit. |
icefirestone23Dec 11, 2022 5:36 PM
icefirestone23 said: NewestPersonHere said: I have not compared G-Reco with Evangelion before, not sure who you are describing. A lot of people criticise SEED because of Kira/Lacus. MAL rating does not matter, profits matter to Bandai. Well, gunplas and Gundam games here always sell out faster than shounen fighting games~ I won’t judge Witch From Mercury until its final episode. The Gundam fandom outside japan has to one of the most brain dead anime fandoms I have ever seen. What fandom has some OCD on a 20 year old series that had the best ratings and sales out of the entire franchise. Then goes on to praise one of the worst anime shows of the decade (aka G Reco). I have seen you defending G-Reco a lot as well as flops like after war and turn, and constantly hating on seed, wing, ibo. Here is bad news by the way. Bandai is not going to hit their sales margins overseas. Many overseas retailers are starting to put even their uc kits on clearance. Just like what happened to transformers and gi joe. It is pretty obvious that people think this show is trash, despite anitube shilling this show like crazy. We have people dunking on this show every week now, and social media buzz is low. Poll turnouts are terrible. If the only defense of a show is dunking on another 20 year old show, the show has to be hot garbage. You probably got me mixed up with someone else. I enjoyed X, Turn A and G-Reco but I don’t defend these titles if people don’t enjoy them, I usually recommend people other anime. Both Turn A and G-Reco require a lot of experience watching Tomino-directed anime or the viewer will be lost. I don’t criticise Wing or IBO, I just have mixed feelings with those titles. Gundam community is huge and diverse. You can get many different tier list or watch orders if you asked a bunch of people in the Gundam community. Not sure what you meant by Gundam merchandise not selling well, probably in the West? Bandai is terrible in marketing in the West. Here in Southeast Asia, Gunplas can cost up to hundreds and are always out-of-stock. |
| This is the thread of all time |
Snuffleskin said: I did not foresee my one offhand comment about seed starting a battle of the thesis’sThis is the thread of all time |
|
Monochrosanity said: Snuffleskin said: I did not foresee my one offhand comment about seed starting a battle of the thesis’sThis is the thread of all time You should feel proud, you got these lads writing an entire bible |
Typecero said: So with the assassination plotline in, you go from three quirky teens interacting, to THESE THREE TEENS HAVE TO INTERACT, ELSE YOU CANNOT PREVENT THE ASSASSINATION. You seem to ignore my point of "even if the assassination happened, you would still have a plot", but nevertheless... Typecero said: The assassination plotline is stopped because of a Duel. A duel that Guel's dad would know could derail his plans. If Guel's Dad does the smartest, and simplest thing, and says to his son "Hey Guel, if you stay home from school today, I will buy you new a Mobile Suit". Anything to get him to stay home to prevent Guel's loss, and Miorine's dad is killed with 100% CERTAINTY. Bribe your son for ONE DAY, and his dad gets everything he desires in one fell swoop. I'll assume you haven't watched episode 10 where pretty much the rest of Benerit group admits that they think Vim Jeturk is dumb and incompetent. Either way, doesn't the entirety of episode one happen in the span of a single day? If so, why only complain of the second duel and not of the first that happened that day? Your only argument here would be "But if he was 200% careful-" (Despite the fact that Prospera had proof of his direct involvement with the assassination, either way), but even so: There is a rank list in Asticassia, Guel knows who he can lose against and who he can't, so there's nothing strange with him accepting a duel with a literally-who that appears to be weak. "B-b-but what if he asked Guel to-" Yeah, like he asked Guel to leave everything to the AI system in the Darilbalde, or to not enter in any duel after his second loss, or to go work in his subsidiary, those definitely worked, right? |
Monochrosanity said: Snuffleskin said: I did not foresee my one offhand comment about seed starting a battle of the thesis’sThis is the thread of all time true enlightenment is understanding Superior Defender Gundam Force is the best show |
| Thread locked for not encourage meaningful and/or civil discussion. Anime Discussion Rules 2: Please refrain from creating threads that do not encourage discussion. d.　personal storytelling, narration, ranting, and/or blog-style posts e.g.　Rate my list/favorites, Post your ___ and I'll rate it, review and/or rant texts about an anime, etc. These topics only encourage a one-way discussion where members are commenting on the poster's idea (or vice versa). And now cleaned |
ZedlinDec 15, 2022 9:22 AM
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