| That's a whole lotta words. I find most of it to be good reasons too. But unless we're talking anime fans in general, and even than that's stretching it, I don't agree that English speakers can speak Japanese better than the opposite, even if I do agree that our language allows for a better variety of speech patterns. A LOT of Amurrcans, as many actual Americans actually say American, can barely speak the English language correctly. Asking anyone to say any word not native to them batches it up hilariously. On the same level as the worst Engrish from a Japanese tongue. This really goes both ways and as long as the person doesn't know it, it will come out poorly. I also don't believe TK said English good at all lol. I mean it's the over exaggerated Terry Bogard style talk lol. AWW YOU OKAY!? BUSTAA WOLF! |
 |
| Maybe I misspoke a bit. In reference to English- and Japanese-speakers globally, Japanese-speakers might have the upper hand just because English is so commonly taught in schools there. I really don't know about that one. As far as voice acting goes, though, only once in a blue moon do I hear someone speaking in a respectable series' English dub totally botch a Japanese term. In fact the worst I can think of in any series off the top of my head is people in the Pokemon dub pronouncing it "poh-kee-mon." Listening to Japanese-dubbed anime, though, the English lines are usually dreadfully executed... not always, but definitely more often than not. So I think that people in the English anime-dubbing industry can sound fluent using Japanese terminology better than Japanese voice actors using English terminology. |
XTApocalypse said: A very apt summary, HCM. (I don't know what to call you for short. =( ) HyperCobaltMax said: I find that several subs out there are either rushed or have just little to no care at all as to whether or not their subs are accurate both in translation and grammar. The dub on the other hand, averts misspellings and minimizes the grammar error down to the size of a dime as compared to that of a big plate of the subs. About half the reason for this is that most of the subs that people watch are fansubs (but I have seen it with professional ones all too often as well), and half is that people tend to expect subtitles to be translated into English from Japanese on a word-for-word basis. Which really doesn't work too well - if you don't restructure the dialogue at least enough so that it sounds fluid in English, it will just come out blocky and awkward-sounding. Which, in my experience, I've found most subs - fansubs especially - to be. HyperCobaltMax said: Everytime the characters speak in English, it is English. Not Engrish. Explanation: Whenever we hear the original dub (I mean, the Japanese version), most often they always murder an English word because they follow the pronunciation based upon the Kanas p. Example : ハイエブリボディ！ アイムファイン！ サンキュウ！/Hai Eburibodi! Aim fain! Sankyuu! which means "Hi Everybody! I'm fine! Thank you!" in pure English which sounds awkward, if not a very rich source of NARM (tvtrope it!). Sometimes, it can get really annoying as they cannot pronounce it well. While in English, they sound okay. However, there are some little exceptions like that one in Bakemonogatari wherein Senjougahara said this really well "PTA"---> "Parent Teacher Association" and another specifically in Angel Beats where we have TK speaking it! I agree, and would even go a step farther than that. I think that, in most cases, English speakers are able to speak Japanese/use Japanese terminology better than Japanese speakers are able to use English. Most of the reason for this is because the English language incorporates many more sounds and syllables than Japanese... not all of them, mind you; having spoken English all my life, I still can't get that rolling "R" used in Spanish and similar languages down. But syllabically, Japanese is one of the less complicated languages. HyperCobaltMax said: - Accents. Real, real, real accents. Explanation: A case in Hellsing really brought up a wonderful British and Italian accents which makes it much, much, much justifiable. They do not try hard enough to deliver it splendidly for it is the nat'l language of the English VAs. Look, they do not force it out, they are just natural. Another big point. And Hellsing has one of my favorite dubs chiefly because of the authenticity of the accents. It just feels odd to hear a series that's all about British people and British culture taking place in Britain speaking unfiltered Japanese to eachother. Out of curiosity, how many languages do you speak? There were a few grammatical errors in your post, but I'm impressed with your knowledge. Side note: If you want to post a link, use the following code, with []'s instead of {}'s. <pre>{url=LINK}TEXT{/url}*Paragraph-by-paragraph and a little sentence-by-sentence reply* It is short but I added it with explanation for I just feel like it would not be that good if I just leave it as they are. Those explanations can also be considered as optional. Sometimes, the subs can be irritating as they mislead the audience in a grammatical way. I mean, I have seen so many fansubbed animes out there and these people are not reviewing the grammar and stuffs. Another thing is that it may give too obvious, if not, it may give the character a guilt of being "Captain Obvious". Like, I do not hate the subs as a whole but it is just that mostly, fansubs are prone to errors. Another thing is that, the L and R switching. I have heard this several times in anime and tokusatsu that they say things like "Reberu", which can mean "Lever", "Revel", "Level", "Rebel" or any near-sounding words. It can be a bit irritating if you are a good English speaker because you can hardly understand it, unless analysis is done in between or so. I agree though, that the Japanese language is one of the easiest to speak of all of the foreign languages out there for we are just speaking in pre-defined syllables rather than multiple consonants and exception-to-the-rule pronunciation of words. Like, it reminds me of my nat'l language's (Ang Wikang Pilipino/ The Filipino Language) ABAKADA phonetics. BTW, I just remembered Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha and I am so impressed with the English of their devices in the subbed versions for they are authentic. Raising Heart and Bardiche's English FTW!!! Yes! Indeed! I love the way how Crispin Freeman, K.T. Gray and Victoria Hardwood did their respective roles in that show at full stop. Another thing is that we have this Hetalia, where every single character speaks English WITH THEIR OWN COUNTRY'S ACCENT! Man! I watched the first episode of Hetalia dub and subbed and I enjoyed the dub more for the justifiable pronunciation. Well done America (country, not the character)! Well done! I speak English, Filipino, Visayan (dialect), a few Hebrew, Greek and Latin (because they are the languages of my faith as a Christian that belongs to the Roman Catholic Church), a few Japanese (because of being a big fan of Japanese multimedia like games, anime, tokusatsu, Vocaloids and a lot more). Yeah, I am aware of that because I got so excited about my response for this specific thread and thanks for the impression though. Thanks! I will do my best because I am more used to the VBulletin- powered forums out there and that is why I am not that good in here with the links but the Youtube and the picture ones. iwatch2muchanime said: This really goes both ways and as long as the person doesn't know it, it will come out poorly. I also don't believe TK said English good at all lol. I mean it's the over exaggerated Terry Bogard style talk lol. AWW YOU OKAY!? BUSTAA WOLF! Exception to that one with the English to Japanese and vice versa spoken words in one show is done wonderfully in Heroes as an example and as a whole. George Takei, Jack Coleman, David Anders and James Kyson Lee managed to perform it splendidly. Well, he said it nicely in my ears, even if he speaks like Terry Bogard. |
| It's a pity Hellsing is the only dub that K.T. Gray is in... or at least credited for being in on her profile. She has a lovely voice. |
| I totally agree that in the anime industry in general, English speaking Japanese is better more often than Japanese speaking English. Lol i thought Heroes had good japanese too until season 2 when i watched it with a friends parents who are from japan and they said that most of them had terrible accents and couldn't pronounce words right. I was like.......... ouch. |
|
XTApocalypse said: It's a pity Hellsing is the only dub that K.T. Gray is in... or at least credited for being in on her profile. She has a lovely voice. I agree, I wish that she could go for more roles as her ANN and [[http://myanimelist.net/people/301/Katharine_Gray ]] her profile in our site} only has 2. Like what happened? A voice like hers could reek pigeonholding. iwatch2muchanime said: I totally agree that in the anime industry in general, English speaking Japanese is better more often than Japanese speaking English. Lol i thought Heroes had good japanese too until season 2 when i watched it with a friends parents who are from japan and they said that most of them had terrible accents and couldn't pronounce words right. I was like.......... ouch. Well, I think there was a rare case that Miyuki Sawashiro reprised her role in the English version of Di Gi Charat- A Trip to the Planet which is so surprising to hear. Well, in my ears, they speak good Japanese. |
| Now I have to defend Grey's accent on her profile page. Goodness, I can't seem to stay out of arguments anywhere. =/ |
| Guys, I have to put this trailer here: and I have to admit that they have a good choice of VAs here. Look! K'ON's Azunyan, Mio and Ritsu are reunited. Lyrical Nanoha's Nanoha and Chrono Harlaown/ Arf are reunited too! Tekken Blood and Vengeance's Alisa and Ling Xiaoyu are reunited as well. Thank you Cristina Vee for this! I admit, I love the trailer a lot but I must not put my hopes too high for this. |
| I've never seen any of the things you just referenced. <=( |
| I find that really sad XTA..... I also want to say though that that trailer does NO justice in even trying to show you what that show is really like. That's by far one of the most misleading trailers in the world. It's like the LE Box for Higurashi... that show is not about cute waitresses.... not at all. |
|
| I think I was waiting for the K-ON! dub to watch it. How long ago was it released? Last I heard about it was the trailer for it someone posted here in the club. |
XTApocalypse said: I've never seen any of the things you just referenced. <=( What? Haven't seen them? Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha K'ON! Tekken: Blood and Vengeance? Watch them. They are good! iwatch2muchanime said: I find that really sad XTA..... I also want to say though that that trailer does NO justice in even trying to show you what that show is really like. That's by far one of the most misleading trailers in the world. It's like the LE Box for Higurashi... that show is not about cute waitresses.... not at all. That is why we have this trope, courtesy of TvTropes dot org: Never Trust A Trailer! http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/NeverTrustATrailer That trope simplifies the trailer's entirety. Making it look so cheerful and happy... UNTIL Episode 3 that is... Even I was not prepared to see that one even if I was ALREADY spoiled by TVTROPES. |
| Let's put it this way I don't have 30 minutes to watch a 20 minute show because I HAVE A LIFE. I need not read a TV show and in many cases such as captions or subs switch too quickly, I have to rewind, pause it, and read it, then continue. Plus, it's easier to understand what's going on when you're hearing it and not reading it. And anyone with WORKING ears will know that NOT ALL DUBS ARE BAD. |
| That's the point though. The Japanese marketing for the show did basically the same thing. Not wanting the shows darkness to be shown through preview, but rather shock the audience. |
| That is why we have this trope courtesy of TvTropes dot org as our reminder when trailers that seem to be so happy to be true. Anyways, I really cannot wait for its release. I love to buy that dubbed Madoka Magica as part of my anime collection (which by now, is still little). |
| Well if you really want to cut the time, there's speed-subbing (play video at 2x speed with captions) but most video players don't handle that well. |
| I've just finished watching Axis Powers Hetalia S1 and S2 and definitely, the dub is so far superior in my opinion. While indeed it is true that the Japanese version may be good, but then they are just limited to a few Japanese accents. The dub however brings us every single accents in English. I find it also good that they added some extras like this: Germany said this in APH S2 Ep 1: Original: And so, Italy skipped his training again today. Dub: Ditto but with added "Lazy bastard!" which makes it better. Seriously, I've never been so full of enthusiasm watching 20+ episodes watching the hilarity that the dub has made. |
| The reason I like dubs that most of them need to be. Good examples are chrono crusade, Soul eater, and many others. |
HyperCobaltMax said: Seriously, I've never been so full of enthusiasm watching 20+ episodes It helps that each episode is only 5 minutes long. |
 Oh pitiful shadow lost in the darkness bringing torment and pain to others, oh damned soul wallowing in your sin...perhaps it is time to die |
coolcat said: HyperCobaltMax said: Seriously, I've never been so full of enthusiasm watching 20+ episodes It helps that each episode is only 5 minutes long. And are also played by the right VAs with the voices of Eric Vale, Michael J. Tatum, Patrick Seitz, Jerry Jewel and the rest. I personally enjoyed their performance over that of the Japanese version. Now, I rewatched Digimon Tamers and I personally liked how the dub goes, especially that we have Steve Blum, Melissa Fahn, Bridget Hoffman, Michael McConnohie on deck. |
| Hetalia is a fun dub. |
Oh pitiful shadow lost in the darkness bringing torment and pain to others, oh damned soul wallowing in your sin...perhaps it is time to die |
| Wait, Blum and McConnohie are in Digimon Tamers? |
| Blum is the guy running the entire organization that's tracking the Digimon. Man in Glasses. Kenta AND Guilmon himself lol He's also BLACK WAR GREYMON |
|
| Why do I like English dubs? Because English is the only language I know and trying to read subs and watch the anime is a pain in the ass. |
 Active Military, Prior Service and Veteran's Anime Club do not forget the sound of my voice until the day we reunite |
| Grand reason was that so I wouldn't have to squint to read the freakin subs, much easier to relax and enjoy the show. Plus some dubs sound really great and some take some smart liberties. Yu yu hakusho is one show I CANNOT listen to the original audio for beacuse the dub is too much fun and fitted in perfectly with the show. Sgt. frog made a few episodes funnier (for me at least) because some of the cultural jokes flew over my head, plus Keroro sounds more like a jerk now in that its easier to laugh at him when he gets his just deserts, because he sounds like he desrves them. Baccano, which even dub haters agree had the brilliant choice of making everyone have a new york mobster like accent and recently Deadman wonderland has made things alot more crass for the better to make the "you're in jail" feel real. |
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XTApocalypse said: Wait, Blum and McConnohie are in Digimon Tamers? Yep! Mister Tamaki and Azulongmon respectively. |
| My visions gone downhill. How am I going to read them captions?? ;) |
| Mostly cuz I prefer to hear the words in my own language so I can concentrate on watching the anime/scenes/characters, rather than have my eyes glued to the bottom of the screen reading subtitles. |
| I'll never understand dub haters. One of the arguments they use (To cover up the fact that they're just massive weeaboos) is that they just watch everything in its original language. But here's the thing. Foreign movie dubs are widely regarded as being terrible. The voices just can't match up with what's happening on the screen. I don't know anyone who would get serious enjoyment out of watching dubbed foreign movies. With anime, the majority of people in western countries don't care because... they're cartoons. There's nothing inheritly special about the original language of something that's usually made for kids. They don't have the same problems as live action films. The fact that people get so hot and bothered about people watching cartoons in their own language is beyond me. tl;dr: Because I'm not a massive weeaboo |
 |
| That sounds like a terrible attitude to have. It sounds like you're saying, "They're just cartoons so they don't matter. They're not REAL entertainment like live-action." It is worth noting, however, that the vast majority are animated such that they can be dubbed in multiple languages. That's why the mouths just flap instead of having proper syllabic motions. That's the biggest difference between dubbed animation and dubbed live action. |
| That's not the message I was trying to get across. What I'm trying to do is criticise the dub haters argument that they just believe that everything should be watched it in its original language. But the thing is that most people would watch French cinema in French anyway. The only thing that's different from them and the average person living in the west is that they watch anime with subtitles when most people would watch it dubbed. |
|
| I'm still not sure I understand your argument, or how you're connecting anime with foreign movies. Wouldn't "most people watch French cinema in French" be something that sub-premacists would use to SUPPORT their claims that everything should be watched in its original language? |
| I like English Dubs if they fit the setting or if I'm just lazy. Sometimes when the majority cast is other than Japanese it gets annoying when they say names. "Arekusuanda" "Andateka" "erizabesu" gets annoying imo. also when even the male characters sound like girls.. it's just ... e___e But I like both Jap or Eng. I just think Eng dubs have rights too x3 |
Alone on a Friday night? Remember that DIO did nothing wrong! |
| I don't like reading words at the bottom of the screen.I find that from watching subs and dubs that a lot of your attention is on the subs instead of mostly on everything else that is going on in the anime. If I want to read then there are these things called books, magazines, web forums, newspapers. Characters from another country will usually have an accent. Watching a anime in your own language closely gives you the same experience watching that those in Japan did. Those in Japan watching the anime didn't need to read little words on the bottom of the screen, nor did they need to look up wikipedia to see what a word,honorific or phrase means.Most dubbing companies also leave out the Japanese honorifics or they find English equivalent of those words.S they didn't need to look up wikipedia to see what the hell Onichan means |
| I want you to know that I only half-read most of that because I was distracted by your awesome avatar. |
| I like dubs because they're easier for me to watch the anime, I'm waaay to lazy to read the subs on every anime that I watch. I remember there was a time when people where excited to see/hear which voice actor was going to play who in the series. To me both english/japanese dubs can get extremely annoying, Laura Baley plays all the girls in one anime, the japanese shy girl in anime always get that annoying high pitch voice, that seriously wants me to plug my ears. Back to back its the same but I think english Dubs has more variety than those who get "idol" status in Japanese Dubs. I rather listen to variety-english dub-voices than that of perfect-japanese dub-voices. And lets face it, people dont watch anime for subs, they just like to hear the japanese voices because they have more "emotion" into their voice acting than actually reading subs. No one cares about subs, they are only there to communicate/translate to the other audiences. Sigh~ I hope that make sense |
SHINOKAZI09 said: I like dubs because they're easier for me to watch the anime, I'm waaay to lazy to read the subs on every anime that I watch. I remember there was a time when people where excited to see/hear which voice actor was going to play who in the series. To me both english/japanese dubs can get extremely annoying, Laura Baley plays all the girls in one anime, the japanese shy girl in anime always get that annoying high pitch voice, that seriously wants me to plug my ears. Back to back its the same but I think english Dubs has more variety than those who get "idol" status in Japanese Dubs. I rather listen to variety-english dub-voices than that of perfect-japanese dub-voices. And lets face it, people dont watch anime for subs, they just like to hear the japanese voices because they have more "emotion" into their voice acting than actually reading subs. No one cares about subs, they are only there to communicate/translate to the other audiences. Sigh~ I hope that make sense I read somewhere that psychologically speaking, people find foreign languages more emotional and in depth because they are not accustomed to that language and it is harder to get an emotional reading off words that do not normally hear. At least thats the best way I can explain it. Also do not know how true that was. I just remember some guy arguing that foreigners were giving some German actor in a move too much credit. |
SHINOKAZI09 said: I rather listen to variety-english dub-voices than that of perfect-japanese dub-voices. And lets face it, people dont watch anime for subs, they just like to hear the japanese voices because they have more "emotion" into their voice acting than actually reading subs. No one cares about subs, they are only there to communicate/translate to the other audiences. I'm not sure I understand. You're claiming that Japanese voice actors inherently have more "emotion" in their portrayals? Tomoki_Sakurai said: I read somewhere that psychologically speaking, people find foreign languages more emotional and in depth because they are not accustomed to that language and it is harder to get an emotional reading off words that do not normally hear. At least thats the best way I can explain it. Also do not know how true that was. In simplest terms, I think it's harder to recognize bad acting in a language you don't speak, so people don't recognize it in subs as much as they do in dubs. Of course, this is also true for good acting. So I think a large majority of the subbed fanbase have established the assumption that all Japanese acting is good acting. |
XTApocalypse said: In simplest terms, I think it's harder to recognize bad acting in a language you don't speak, so people don't recognize it in subs as much as they do in dubs. Of course, this is also true for good acting. So I think a large majority of the subbed fanbase have established the assumption that all Japanese acting is good acting. Yea that sums up what I was trying to say in a less confusing manner lol. |
SaberRitsu said: I'll never understand dub haters. One of the arguments they use (To cover up the fact that they're just massive weeaboos) is that they just watch everything in its original language. But here's the thing. Foreign movie dubs are widely regarded as being terrible. The voices just can't match up with what's happening on the screen. I don't know anyone who would get serious enjoyment out of watching dubbed foreign movies. With anime, the majority of people in western countries don't care because... they're cartoons. There's nothing inheritly special about the original language of something that's usually made for kids. They don't have the same problems as live action films. The fact that people get so hot and bothered about people watching cartoons in their own language is beyond me. tl;dr: Because I'm not a massive weeaboo On the movie part, I have to agree. In my country, I've watch so many American movies being dubbed into my own nat'l language "The Filipino Language" or "Ang Wikang Pilipino" and it sounds so terrible even if I have a lot of patriotic fervor running in my veins. Why? It sounds so cheap, the voice actors indeed cannot match as they seem to water it down or make it sound corny if not downright so bad its good. Much as I love a show that is dubbed into a language that suits you best, here in my country, there is a large enough number of educated people who understands English a lot and it would be unnecessarily redundant if not impractical for them (including me myself) to ever hear such a thing. Now this is not to say that I just push those non-educated ones aside but rather if dubs are done, hire the fitting VAs and a well-made script to boot. Today, most of the Fil dubs done are mingled with English which would lower the integrity of the lines dubbed over in a translated manner, similarly, we even have here in my country over-acting dubbers who hammed scenes up in the wrong time and there are those who just didn't care and they sound monotone. Just my two cents here. |
| Well, the quality of the dub is a fact to consider, as well. I can't imagine the Filipino dub market is nearly as grand as the English one on a global scale, so it would make sense that not as much time and effort is put into the dubbing process. |
XTApocalypse said: Well, the quality of the dub is a fact to consider, as well. I can't imagine the Filipino dub market is nearly as grand as the English one on a global scale, so it would make sense that not as much time and effort is put into the dubbing process. Especially if they're anything like those Singapore English dubs. Oh my God, those are so terrible. |
mrbling252 said: \XTApocalypse said: Well, the quality of the dub is a fact to consider, as well. I can't imagine the Filipino dub market is nearly as grand as the English one on a global scale, so it would make sense that not as much time and effort is put into the dubbing process. Especially if they're anything like those Singapore English dubs. Oh my God, those are so terrible. True! I used to enjoy English dubs where ever they were made until quality kicked in, then came the "dubs are horrible!" from my offline peeps and I noticed that those that were of the US were of higher quality while those done in Singapore/ Hong Kong were utterly of low quality. Hell I watched K'ON! in both Official English Dub (via WatchCartoonsOnline and Youtube back then when Youtube wasn't a jerk) a and HK/S Dub (via Animax) and found a VERY HUGE (intended in highlighting this one) difference. I found the Official Dub highly superior that that or even as good if not better than the subbed version. The HK/ S dubbed one sounds like there was just one if not three dubbers and sounds so deadpan while the official version was clearly distinguishable as ever. Yes! Azusa in particular sounds old while in the official version she sounds so young and girly. Now I even remembered watching dothacks Sign and Legend of the Twilight as well as Chobits and I found the Official Dub still superior. |
| I started watching anime in dub, and ever since then I've been.. well.. used to it. Watching anime in the English version helps me understand the situations the characters are in and how the story is developing. Some of the subs have bad translations and they mess up what the characters are trying to say. Let's just put it this way, I prefer the English dubs, but I don't mind the Japanese subs either. I'm watching Shingeki no Kyojin, which has been licensed by Funimation and I'm liking the voices so far. Though I'm excited to see what Funimation has in store for it. 8D FMA and Black Lagoon are examples why there is a large number of people out there who prefer the English dubs. |
 "Even when our eyes are closed, there's a whole world out there that lives outside ourselves and our dreams." |
SaberRitsu said: I'll never understand dub haters. One of the arguments they use (To cover up the fact that they're just massive weeaboos) is that they just watch everything in its original language. But here's the thing. Foreign movie dubs are widely regarded as being terrible. The voices just can't match up with what's happening on the screen. I don't know anyone who would get serious enjoyment out of watching dubbed foreign movies. With anime, the majority of people in western countries don't care because... they're cartoons. There's nothing inheritly special about the original language of something that's usually made for kids. They don't have the same problems as live action films. The fact that people get so hot and bothered about people watching cartoons in their own language is beyond me. tl;dr: Because I'm not a massive weeaboo The truth! |
"Even when our eyes are closed, there's a whole world out there that lives outside ourselves and our dreams." |
| My first anime (not counting the childhood animes) was Naruto and I did indeed watch that in dub. There's a lot of reasons why I love dubs: 1. I just like the language better than japanese overall. 2. Don't have to read subtitles. 3. I like almost all of the VA's. 4. Japanese seiyuus tend to sound a lot like others, there's only with few whom I really recognize. ...and the list goes on, but those are my main reasons. My favorite VA is undoubtly John Swasey. Listening to him as Captain Ahab from Hakugei: Legend of Moby Dick was ultimately perfect. I can't even think of a nitpick for that role, it's incredibly good! |
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