Keikenzumi na Kimi to, Keiken Zero na Ore ga, Otsukiai suru Hanashi. Episode 1 Discussion

Fantastic first episode. For those who think this is a "they'll sleep together soon enough" situation -- you're missing the point of this story.

As a woman, I can 100% relate and vouch for the idea that Runa is sleeping with men because she sees it's her duty. It stems from insecurity. She's a hopeless romantic with an optimistic view of dating, that's WHY she's slept with them in the past. She doesn't even like doing it, she just wants to be a "good girlfriend" -- she's extremely faithful to the person she's dating and has never broken up with a guy in the past. And yet, the men around her are the ones who got bored of her, used her body, and left.

She is the picturesque girlfriend. Blushing, energetic, happy-go-lucky -- and yet, so many people hated this series because she's simply "used goods". That's not my words. That's an actual comment I saw on the site I watched this on.

This anime is likely going to show us that Runa is no different than a virgin. She'll still feel butterflies -- she'll still blush -- she'll still want a beautiful love story. The only difference is that she's dated other men. That's it.

This story is going to pull out all the weirdos who rate it 1-star because they don't agree with the message that a woman is more than her body. She isn't a car that is worth less because it's driven off the lot.

@loreeellaii No one here denies that a woman is worth more than her body. A woman can have alot of casual sex and have a great career and social life. That woman is worth alot to her friends, family, and society. That does not mean that she'll be viewed by men as an attractive long term partner. Just like in real life, a woman can act like a pure born again virgin and be the perfect girlfriend. That won't change how men view her past though.

@Dhx379 Men need to ask themselves why virginity is seen as more desirable than an experienced woman. What is it about virginity that signals that a woman would be a better partner?

What is it about sleeping with more than one person that makes the person seem less-than?

This is coming from someone who's only slept with one individual. It doesn't make sense to me.

@borderliner yeah let's just disregard every scientific study because the people writing it are implied to be leaning in a certain political direction, see how far that gets you 😂😂😂

@Dhx379

Most of what gets published as scientific research is junk.

You said this "she's broken because people with high counts make horrible long term partners" and backed it up with the junk study.

But almost half of all marriages in the USA end in divorce, are these all the fault of broken women with high counts?

And how come Sweden has a lower divorce rate than the USA, are there less promiscuous girls there perhaps!?

And wow, look at all those super religious red states in the US with insane divorce rates, it must be the promiscuous girls' fault mustn't it 'cause it's never the man's fault.


All of this is just piss taking because you kind of deserve it.


I wonder if you're actually unaware of how misogynistic the statements you make are.

@borderliner "Since I have no arguments against what the study actually says, I will call it junk." Also coming from someone who praised someone for throwing ad hominems, think that says alot about you. 50% of all marriages end in divorce, yet 80%+ of all marriages are initiated by women and the rate at which men and women cheat are about the same. Wonder whats the cause of that high rate? I also never said that female promiscuity is the sole cause of divorce, merely its a prominent factor. Swedens divorce rate is about the same as the US and I'm not arguing in terms politics either so idk how that's relevant. Calling promiscuous women out isn't misogyny either lol, unless you think all women are promiscuous, in which case you'd be the misogynistic one.

@borderliner You're strangely defensive for someone talking about an anime on the internet. The age of consent in South Africa is 16. The same in some states of the US. Given this logic, and that the main characters are in high school in Japan, best case scenario is that Runa is already 18 years of age. Since she's had multiple boyfriends (conservative assumption of 10), each with a relationship period of 2.5 months, this would have made her a minor during her first relationship. If this was real life, her life would be significantly impacted by her choices to date, regardless of being a minor or not.

Look, if you want to believe that women can sleep around and not be affected by it, all the power to you. I'm not here to preach to a wayward generation. Most people, myself included, learns the hard lessons in life through own mistakes. Make your own mistakes and learn to live with the consequences.

@Dhx379

It's not a prominent factor, can't you read, the study finds correlation not causation that's why it's junk.


Misogyny - ingrained prejudice against women:

These are opinions clearly drawn from ingrained prejudice

just the author desperately attempting to disprove the whole "you can't turn a hoe into a housewife" phrase. They can try adding as many redeeming qualities as they want, still won't erase her body count though.

Just like in real life, a woman can act like a pure born again virgin and be the perfect girlfriend. That won't change how men view her past though.

Now if a man finds out that a woman is willing to give it up for free to random men, they'll often think that there's no point in putting in that much effort into building a relationship.


What praise, you know nothing about my history with LostSpectre

Dude got super close to contracting an STD :)

OMG they finally made a slut shaming anime. It's like Fuufu ... except this girl actually has zero self worth ... which is wrong for so many reasons.

This being said, the guy is nice at least? He's attempting not to be a bad guy, like all the others who have used the girl for sex and then promptly discarded her.

@Stormy_77
I don't see how it's a "slut shaming anime" when the MC has not shamed her even in his own head. That means there is no narrative of "slut shaming" being good. Just because some side characters gossip about her being easy and wanting in on it doesnt mean it's a "sllut shaming anime". The narrative is actually going the other direction suggesting that someone like her can be still desirable in a romantic way.

Id say only problem is I am not quite sure I understand her motives because they make no sense when she has already basically said she hasn't fallen deeply for anyone before so I can't see why she would act like she's attached trying to take relations further. It would help if she just outright said she's afraid of being alone and rejected even if she hasn't fallen for someone yet, that would make it make a bit more sense. Or if she actually did fall for someone but got screwed over by them cheating on her when she hadn't slept with them which wouldnt be her being a slut just a girl with bad luck in relationships. That would make more sense too. Or you know she could just be portrayed as a girl actually into sex, that also would make more sense than this weird combination we get. Since a guy just wanting sex would leave her if she didnt "put out" soon enough and also would leave her if he grows bored of her sex and wants someone else too so it seems like she has nothing to gain from her choice of actions which makes them not really make sense for me.

@JdT1977

Throwing math at it isn't going to detract from you stating Runa was underage because the age of consent is 18

And of course the age of consent is a pathetic thing to bring up anyway because it's clear that many young teens regularly engage in sexual activity below the age of consent with absolutely zero harm to themselves or those around them.

You stopped talking about the anime a while ago and started attacking the life choices of women, literally writing them off like they were "damaged goods"

As far as I can see Runa is the victim here, why are you attacking women in general as a proxy?

@loreeellaii well there are many reasons, first being that women with many partners are far more likely to cheat or leave a relationship or marriage. There are multiple studies that show that women (and men) with fewer partners often have lower divorce rates along with more happy, stable, and sexually active marriages. There's also the factor that traditionally, men and women would spend years getting to know each other before sleeping with them. Now if a man finds out that a woman is willing to give it up for free to random men, theyll often think that theres no point in putting in that much effort into building a relationship. Does that also mean that men only court for sex? That depends on the man but even for the men who want want that deep connection, whatever relationship they have won't be as meaningful because they will have conflicting views on sex and intimacy. There's more reasons but this is the gist of it.

I love pure hearted "gal" anime girls, like Galko-chan or Kitagawa Marin, girls that dress and act like that but are actually completely different in the inside, that's why I'm watching this low tier romance anime, but I don't know how to feel here.

I wanna make clear that I do not care if Runa has had sex with 1, 2, 3, 10, or even more guys, I personally don't like that but that's the plot here, I know it and I'm ok with it. But what I do care, and absolutely hate here, is that she literally just want to have a boyfriend, she doesn't give a shit on who it is, she accepts to date a guy who's name she didn't even knew and take him to her house just to fuck with him because "she wants to make his boyfriend happy", brooo that's too much, that's not being pure hearted, and even if it looks like it I wouldn't call it being a "bitch", what that is, is just being a stupid person. Yeah yeah, sure, "the plot is also about her learning how romance works, she IS dumb about it", but no man, that just ain't right, if one of her boyfrends told her she should shoot her family and teachers because that would make him happy, she would had done it? With what I saw here I would say yes, she would had done it, and that's because she is just outright stupid.

How many people will get mad just because she is not a virgin...

@Dhx379 That's simply not true. The more partners you have doesn't indicate likeliness to cheat or leave. In fact, relationships with the FIRST partner you ever have are extremely unlikely to last. There are NO official, peer-reviewed studies that suggest the more you sleep with someone the less likely you are to "pair-bond" -- IF that were true, then men, who sleep with more people on average and are more likely to engage in casual hook-ups, would be emotionally unavailable to their partners.

"Traditionally, men and women would spend years getting to know each other" --
1. traditional doesn't mean correct. We also traditionally used to cut people's arms and let them bleed to death as a form of medicine
2. That's not even true!! Traditionally, arranged marriages were common and you had to spit out an heir. Love marriages didn't even exist.
3. I AGREE WITH YOU that casual hook-ups aren't a way to find a long-term, stable partner -- and yet, society taught Runa that if she wanted to be loved, she'd better be ready to sleep with her boyfriend at any time. That's what society is teaching women. That her feelings don't matter. And yet the same people will criticize Runa for that instead of the society that teaches her that.

It's ridiculous. Why, logically, would virginity be a "wanted" trait in a woman, yet not a wanted trait in a man? If it were such a big deal, why aren't we talking about [i]men [/i] pair-bonding? None of this is based in statistics or science at all. When you take a real look at the facts, it falls apart entirely.

@StallionXD I think you misunderstand her intentions about a boyfriend. She sees "casual dating" as normal, because she has an optimistic view of dating. She says "even if we don't like each other at first, maybe love can blossom from that" -- that's why she says yes to everybody that asks. She doesn't want to say "no" to somebody who might surprise her.

It's naive and horribly optimistic and unrealistic, but that's who Runa is. She's too pure, she doesn't even realize all the dudes before her didn't even like her, they just wanted her body.

You're calling her stupid, I think she's just horribly naive and was taught "as the woman, you have to please the man". WE see it as stupid, because western women have more agency than that, but in the eastern world it's really common for women to give up their jobs, social life and career for their husbands

@loreeellaii pair bonding is a very obscure area but there are absolutely studies that show the strong relationship between partner count and divorce. It ain't exclusive to just a single gender either, and I never made that claim that it was exclusively for women. You can argue whether or not partner count causes divorce, but on average, couples with less partners get divorced or broken up less. That's the whole point.

https://osf.io/preprints/socarxiv/ke5fj/

The point still stands. Why would a man put in effort to be traditional with a woman when she herself is not traditional and is willing to hook up immediately? Unless a guy thinks sex and intimacy are two different things, he's not going to build a long term relationship with that type of woman.

The modern feminist society does not teach women that their feelings don't matter. If anything, it teaches women to have high standards as to who they date, which is a good thing if they actually go for a person who's gonna commit to them instead of someone who will just use them.

Ask women why virginity isn't as important in a man than in a woman, cause women are the ones who choose who they date. No man is influencing women to choose factors such as height or income over virginity, but those are prioritized over virginity in western society.

@traed Well, the way all the rest of the school talked about her it was like she had no value as they see her as someone who puts out then gets dumped. Frankly I don't like the double standard (they surely don't shame all the guys who've slept with her) but it's very clear the anime presents her as a slut.

She herself even said she was "expected" to put out, or the guys would get bored and go look for other girls. Which is what I meant by the girl has no sense of self worth, which isn't surprising considering all her previous boyfriends basically got bored and ditched her once they got laid. The fact that she was immediately willing to sleep with MC on the first day is already ... a problem. It's a good thing he chose to turn her down, even if he regrets it. He is 100% right, it's too soon, they barely know each other, etc.

I am hoping there is a good romance in here despite the "problematic" nature of the FL, because the MC is kind of sweet, and gallant.

@Dhx379 Men need to ask themselves why virginity is seen as more desirable than an experienced woman. What is it about virginity that signals that a woman would be a better partner?

What is it about sleeping with more than one person that makes the person seem less-than?

This is coming from someone who's only slept with one individual. It doesn't make sense to me.

@loreeellaii That's an easy one to answer. It all boils down to the fact that men cannot be absolutely certain of paternity, whereas women are assured of maternity when procreating. A promiscuous woman isn't a good investment for a man, because he cannot be certain that she won't cheat on him and make him unwittingly raise another man's child (expending a great deal of effort without being able to propagate his genetic line). In contrast, a woman that's a virgin at marriage has a track record of self restraint, which is a good signal that she could be a reliable partner (certainly not a guarantee, but a much better bet than a promiscuous woman). Women on the other hand do not care as much if their man is promiscuous, as long as he can provide for her in full. It is for this reason that a man cares about a woman's past, while a woman cares about a man's future.

Read up on the field of evolutionary psychology, if you're interested. It's a fairly young field of study, and there are a number of gaps in the current theories, but it helps explain a great deal about people's hardwired, primitive motivations.