Eris and rudeus are NOT cousins

Feb 25, 2021 8:06 PM

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Sep 2020

I saw a few days ago some people were very disturbed by eris and rudeus because they thought they were both cousins, although some people are not bothered by it because cousin marriage is allowed in some cultures of the country, but some people are very annoying and make a fuss about this, I thought they were not close cousins but I don't know how far their blood relationship is, so I can't confirm.

But some time ago someone asked this directly to Rihujin's Twitter account like this :

Rihujin-sensei, can I ask you something about the Greyrat family? I don't understand how far the 4 branches of the Greyrat family are. Were Paul's father and Sauros brothers? If not, the 4 branches split since which generation?

and he answered like this:

グレイラットは中世の貴族らしくグレイラット同士で婿や嫁にいったり養子に迎えたりしているので、枝分かれがいつになるかは不明です。家系図は複雑に絡み合っています。
Or here the translite :
"It is unclear when the branches will occur, as Greyrats are like medieval aristocrats, and they are adopted by their sons-in-laws and brides. The family tree is intricately intertwined.

so they can't be called cousins with relations like nowdays, You could say they belong to one clan and different branch families, and the branching had been going on for a very long time, considering the asura kingdom was a very old kingdom too, rudeus born in the branch of the notos family, eris was born in the branch of the boreas family.

Randolph77Feb 25, 2021 8:09 PM

Feb 25, 2021 8:12 PM

Only_Brad

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May 2018

1811

I wish they were cousins, incest is wincest.

Feb 25, 2021 8:28 PM

sonkun911

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Jun 2019

119

Since Philip said him and Paul were cousins I assumed it meant Rudy and Eris were either third cousins or fourth cousins or maybe even further away considering the multiple branches, meaning they probably don't even share like 1% of the same DNA.

Feb 25, 2021 9:14 PM

Only_Brad

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May 2018

1811

skysurf said:

Only_Brad said:
I wish they were cousins, incest is wincest.

Worry not, the author surely knows his audience and there's also certain AUNT TO NEPHEW incest in the original source material. Plenty of degeneracy for those who enjoy that.

I heard this got cut because the readers hated it so it was never included in the light novel.

Feb 25, 2021 9:15 PM

ExcaliburAO

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Nov 2019

752

skysurf said:

Only_Brad said:
I wish they were cousins, incest is wincest.

Worry not, the author surely knows his audience and there's also certain AUNT TO NEPHEW incest in the original source material. Plenty of degeneracy for those who enjoy that.

I don't see how this has relevance to this thread

Feb 25, 2021 9:42 PM

skysurf

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Dec 2018

567

Only_Brad said:
I heard this got cut because the readers hated it so it was never included in the light novel.

In the case of Eris and Rudeus, the incest debate is fuzzy because it's not easy to establish how close their blood relation is.

skysurfFeb 25, 2021 11:22 PM

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Feb 25, 2021 10:47 PM

BigNut666

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Jan 2021

120

skysurf said:

Only_Brad said:

I heard this got cut because the readers hated it so it was never included in the light novel.

That's right, it got backslash even from loyal fans but the real reason for removal was that the author was hit with a notice of breach of terms from the publishing platform. Still canon and you can find it if you look for it.

In the case of Eris and Rudeus, the incest debate is fuzzy because it's not easy to establish how close their blood relation is.

Are we bringing up spoilery stuff from a story that was already deleted? The threads already off topic now. Also, are you implying Mushoku Tensei fans like incest or are degenrates? Readers hated the extra story because it didn't add anything new and felt like it was degrading one of the characters.

BigNut666Feb 25, 2021 10:51 PM

Feb 25, 2021 11:26 PM

skysurf

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Dec 2018

567

BigNut666 said:
Are we bringing up spoilery stuff from a story that was already deleted? The threads already off topic now. Also, are you implying Mushoku Tensei fans like incest or are degenrates? Readers hated the extra story because it didn't add anything new and felt like it was degrading one of the characters.

Not what I wanted to convey, but I can see how it could have been interpreted that way. My bad. Please disregard that comment.

skysurfFeb 25, 2021 11:41 PM

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Feb 26, 2021 9:04 AM

Black_Jack18

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Nov 2014

Anyone know where to find the aunt x nephew deleted story? Pure curiosity on my part

Feb 26, 2021 8:28 PM

#10

pblivingston91

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Oct 2018

Even if they were, it wouldn't be a big deal. Fantasy settings tend to emulate medieval culture and "keeping it in the family" (even as closely related as siblings) was pretty common, especially among nobility. Even today, 1st cousins aren't so genetically similar that medical complications with children would be extremely likely - possibly just too likely for comfort. Get even only so far out as 2nd cousins (you share great-grandparents) and genetics are basically a non-issue. Siblings are just a bit too genetically similar and there's more of a risk that children of siblings can end up born with medical complications.

Feb 26, 2021 9:28 PM

#11

Daohog

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Aug 2017

skysurf said:

Only_Brad said:
I wish they were cousins, incest is wincest.

Worry not, the author surely knows his audience and there's also certain AUNT TO NEPHEW incest in the original source material. Plenty of degeneracy for those who enjoy that.

What do you mean? Disgusting incest? No

AxA is the pinnacle of story telling. AxA is the greatest love story that been written since the day of Shakespeare

DaohogFeb 26, 2021 9:35 PM

Feb 26, 2021 9:32 PM

#12

ExcaliburAO

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Nov 2019

752

Daohog said:

ExcaliburAO said:

I don't see how this has relevance to this thread

What do you mean? Disgusting incest? No

AxA is the pinnacle of story telling. AxA is the greatest love story that been written since the day of Shakespeare

I... don't know what you just said. i'm sorry if I'm rude but I don't

Feb 26, 2021 9:36 PM

#13

Daohog

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Aug 2017

ExcaliburAO said:

Daohog said:

What do you mean? Disgusting incest? No

AxA is the pinnacle of story telling. AxA is the greatest love story that been written since the day of Shakespeare

I... don't know what you just said. i'm sorry if I'm rude but I don't

Humu, I see
You're not a heretic.

Edit: I quoted wrong Lmao

Mar 1, 2021 9:14 PM

#14

Winden

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Feb 2021

208

So the situation is similar to Game of Thrones?

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Mar 1, 2021 9:51 PM

#15

Angry_onion

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Apr 2013

254

Winden said:
So the situation is similar to Game of Thrones?

What kind of relationship in GoT did you refer? Rudy and Eris is distant cousin thus they're distantly related and there's nothing wrong with that according to my knowledge

Mar 1, 2021 9:52 PM

#16

Winden

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Feb 2021

208

Angry_onion said:

Winden said:
So the situation is similar to Game of Thrones?

What kind of relationship in GoT did you refer? Rudy and Eris is distant cousin thus they're distantly related and there's nothing wrong with that according to my knowledge

Tywin Lannister and Joanna Lannister. I thought it was a situation like that.

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Mar 2, 2021 5:04 AM

#17

kbmal

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Oct 2017

I guess a somewhat close analogy would be the Clan system of naruto. Technically most of the people who come from the same clan are distantly related but their common ancestor is far back enough that marriage inside the clan isn't considered incest.

Except maybe the Hyuga clan I feel like there has been an incestous case in that clan at one point.

Mar 2, 2021 6:16 AM

#18

kuwangpa

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Nov 2020

409

Most incest (outside of hentai) in anime is usually between non-blood relatives (e.g. step-siblings) or far-removed distant cousins anyway.

Mar 7, 2021 1:27 AM

#19

mechian

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Jun 2009

1077

I think these people complaining about incest lack perspective.

You and your sibling share 50% DNA.

You and your sibling's child (nephew/niece) share 25% DNA.

Your child and your sibling's child are 1st cousins and share 12.5% DNA.

Paul and Philip are NOT 1st cousins because they are from different branch families but for the sake of argument, let's assume they are.

IF Paul and Philip are 1st cousins, they share 12.5% DNA

Philip and Rudeus would share 6.25% DNA, Paul and Eris would share 6.25% DNA.

However, Rudeus and Eris would only share 3.125% DNA so they are 3% related AT BEST and for many small towns and clans, this already extremely diverse.

IF Paul and Philip are 1st cousins once removed (Half first cousin), they share 6.25% DNA which means Rudeus and Eris share 1.5625% DNA.

IF Paul and Philip are 2nd cousins, they share 3.125% DNA which means Rudeus and Eris share 0.78125% DNA.

IF Paul and Philip are 2nd cousins once removed (Half second cousin), they share 1.5625% DNA which means Rudeus and Eris share 0.390625% DNA.

IF Paul and Philip are 3rd cousins, they share 0.78125% DNA which means Rudeus and Eris share 0.1953125% DNA.

The Greyrat family has been around for centuries, Paul and Philip are at least 6th, 7th+ cousins assuming their great-great-great-grandfathers were brothers. the amount of DNA similarity is irrelevant.

It's highly likely many married couples in homogenous countries have the same ancestors centuries ago so share some tiny fraction of a percentage of DNA with each other. At what point is it incest or not incest?

Mar 7, 2021 1:32 AM

#20

rdturbo

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Aug 2015

247

coolxal said:
I think these people complaining about incest lack perspective.

You and your sibling share 50% DNA.

You and your sibling's child (nephew/niece) share 25% DNA.

Your child and your sibling's child are 1st cousins and share 12.5% DNA.

Paul and Philip are NOT 1st cousins because they are from different branch families but for the sake of argument, let's assume they are.

IF Paul and Philip are 1st cousins, they share 12.5% DNA

Philip and Rudeus would share 6.25% DNA, Paul and Eris would share 6.25% DNA.

However, Rudeus and Eris would only share 3.125% DNA so they are 3% related AT BEST and for many small towns and clans, this already extremely diverse.

IF Paul and Philip are 1st cousins once removed (Half first cousin), they share 6.25% DNA which means Rudeus and Eris share 1.5625% DNA.

IF Paul and Philip are 2nd cousins, they share 3.125% DNA which means Rudeus and Eris share 0.78125% DNA.

IF Paul and Philip are 2nd cousins once removed (Half second cousin), they share 1.5625% DNA which means Rudeus and Eris share 0.390625% DNA.

IF Paul and Philip are 3rd cousins, they share 0.78125% DNA which means Rudeus and Eris share 0.1953125% DNA.

The Greyrat family has been around for centuries, Paul and Philip are at least 6th, 7th+ cousins assuming their great-great-great-grandfathers were brothers. the amount of DNA similarity is irrelevant.

It's highly likely many married couples in homogenous countries have the same ancestors centuries ago so share some tiny fraction of a percentage of DNA with each other. At what point is it incest or not incest?

another thing is phillip may not even be sauros' son? Since boreas family has the weird tradition of the the head of the family adopting all male children in the household. So there is a likelihood that phillip may have just been adopted by Sauros.

Nagatsuki Tappei (ReZero): It goes without saying that "Mushoku Tensei" is interesting, but first of all, it's amazing that you were able to depict the life of one character, Rudy. People say that "CLANNAD" is life, but for me, "Mushoku Tensei" is life

Mar 7, 2021 6:24 AM

#21

kbmal

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Oct 2017

Winden said:
So the situation is similar to Game of Thrones?

its more like the Clan system in Naruto. The Uchiha Clan are all related, but you wouldn't call it incest if they married within the clan.

Mar 7, 2021 9:33 AM

#22

pasanoid

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Mar 2015

938

in LN Rudeus states that he can't get horny towards close family members. although psychologically he is an otaku degenerate so he himself finds this strange. in his opinion it is as a property of his new body :D

Am I a good person? No. But do I try to be better every single day? Also no

Mar 7, 2021 9:41 AM

#23

AcceleratorAngel

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Apr 2014

963

skysurf said:

Only_Brad said:
I heard this got cut because the readers hated it so it was never included in the light novel.

In the case of Eris and Rudeus, the incest debate is fuzzy because it's not easy to establish how close their blood relation is.

I swear sometimes you're awfully reasonable, like here with this thread.

Really kudos to you for being respectful. :D

"Even villains have standards"
-Accelerator-

Mar 7, 2021 7:57 PM

#24

SenpaiMars-Barz

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Jan 2016

240

Yeah I mean they are loosly related if anything. You and your...say...great great great great grandfathers brothers branch of your family are likely more genetically disparate than similar. There are a lot of very isolated communities in the world where most of the people who live in that community are likely tied back to eachother in one way or another. I think there's a static that 1 in 5 Japanese people are cousins to some degree...to kinda prove my point.

Mar 15, 2021 5:02 PM

#25

Chiibi

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Nov 2008

10508

People are true DUMBASSES; even if these two WERE cousins, they could get married; cousins can get married all over the f-king world. It's not incest. "Incest" means "intermediate family".

Mar 19, 2021 10:40 AM

#26

rdturbo

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Aug 2015

247

DarkCyanide said:
Just a quick butt-in.
If you've read the novels, they make it clear as day: Sauros is the uncle of Paul, which makes him Rudeus's great-uncle. The son of your great-uncle is your first cousin once removed, which is Philip. The daughter of your first cousin once removed is your second cousin, which is Eris.
Easy.
Incest=Wincest. Laterz

If you have also read the novels, it is clearly mentioned that Phillip is actually not the biological son of Sauros, meaning Eris is not Sauros's biological granddaughter. This because of the boreas tradition of the successor of the household adopting all the males since birth.

Also, the four households of Greyrats have been separated since ages as Asura Kingdom is extremely old, so there is no way that Sauros is the uncle of Paul.

Seriously, if you are gonna pretend to have read the novels, at least get your info right before posting shit.

Mar 19, 2021 11:52 PM

#27

rdturbo

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Aug 2015

247

DarkCyanide said:

rdturbo said:

As far as they make clear, Sauros possesses no sons besides Philip, which comes with plenty implications, ranging from him being his actual son, or his adoptive son. As far as I can tell, they never make tell of what kind of woman his mother was (which matters for this series' trend of making paternal influences quite evident in terms of what type of people their children end up as), which complicates the matter of saying he's not the son of Sauros to a great degree.
From a standpoint of assumption of biological heritage by basis that Sauros canonically only lays claim to one son, I make my argument.
Even if they're not biologically related, from a legal basis, they'd be second cousins.

again regardless of the fact whether Phillip is Sauros's biological son or not (also Sauros has many sons, the successor of the Boreas household after Sauros is one of them), the greyrats have divided themselves into 4 ages ago, thats why Phillip said to Rudy that Paul can be considered a distant cousin.

Paul's dad and Sauros are not real brothers, rather they are from two completely different households. Yeah, they share a common ancestor and belong to one of the founding noble families of Asura kingdom. Have you even read the novels?

Feb 22, 2022 6:21 AM

#28

nikmer

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Sep 2013

They are second cousins, Paul's mom is Sauros' sister.

Jun 9, 2022 1:57 AM

#29

Gengarbestmon

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Jul 2020

rdturbo said:

again regardless of the fact whether Phillip is Sauros's biological son or not (also Sauros has many sons, the successor of the Boreas household after Sauros is one of them), the greyrats have divided themselves into 4 ages ago, thats why Phillip said to Rudy that Paul can be considered a distant cousin.

Paul's dad and Sauros are not real brothers, rather they are from two completely different households. Yeah, they share a common ancestor and belong to one of the founding noble families of Asura kingdom. Have you even read the novels?

Sauros had a sister who is the mother of Paul. Thats one Boreas/Notos connection right there. You think the houses haven't had any blood relation since the founding of Asura? That isn't how upper class marriages work in medieval societies, especially families that have been in the upper class for centuries.

Also where was it specifically stated that Phillip wasn't the biological son of Sauros? I remember there being an in-universe rumor in one of the palace chapters mentioned but there are plenty of things presented as facts or common knowledge by characters that turn out to not be true. There is an entire character whose identity was fabricated from rumors and heresay of varying accuracy of another character.

Jun 13, 2022 4:45 AM

#30

TylarVM28

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May 2022

Paul’s mother being related to Sauros, literally goes against the light novel. I think the comment people refer to he misspoke, which he has before. In Ln 2 Rudy says [That means he's my Grandfather's brother?] [Yes.] it specifically says grandfather and not grandmother. But their tradition of adopting makes Paul’s dad being related not make sense either. Which makes me believe he’s referring to Paul’s dad as related to Sauros in royalty Greyrat name but not blood.

Oct 2, 2022 2:16 AM

#31

quercifolia

☆A-Qing's hair☆

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Jun 2008

1569

Why do people even care about this? Cousin marriage and even sibling marriage is legal in various places around the world, and this is a work of fiction, not reality.
I mean theres a dude who died and got reincarnated into a baby... that's not realistic in any way to start!

Oct 15, 2022 1:31 AM

#32

hayathusran

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Oct 2022

quercifolia said:
Why do people even care about this? Cousin marriage and even sibling marriage is legal in various places around the world, and this is a work of fiction, not reality.
I mean theres a dude who died and got reincarnated into a baby... that's not realistic in any way to start!

Because anime fandom is full of retarded moralfags who can't tell the difference between fiction and real life.

Oct 15, 2022 3:22 PM

#33

Crimsunreaper

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Jul 2017

265

They are second-degree cousins Paul's mother was Sauros's sister, but I don't think it's that weird because even cousins marry to this day in many countries, and relationships like this were prevalent in medieval times, either way If you think that's weird, oh boy do I have worse news for you lol.

CrimsunreaperOct 15, 2022 3:26 PM

Sep 4, 2023 5:02 AM

#34

randellnonya

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Sep 2023

I know this is old but my 2 cents actually prove that Paul and Philip are actually 1st cousins.

to quickly get to the proof.

the contention is that Maybe Suaros and Philip are not real father and son because of the possible adoption system.
this is actually irrelivent. because the nature of the Boreas branch of the family( i say branch because when a family brances off, the branches are still BIOLOGICALLY RELATED.)
is that the Head of the family adopts his NEPHEWS. meaning that if for the sake of argument Sauros is not Philips father, he is atleast his uncle. meaning 1 of Sauros's brothers would be Philips biological father.

this is important to know because this wouldn't prevent Paul and Philip from being cousins because as we know in a QnA Rifujin Na Magonote stated that Sauros is the older brother of Pauls mother Valentina.

so it would stand to reason whether philip and sauros are father and son or Uncle and Nephew this would still mean that Paul and Philip are still 1st cousins because valentina would still be the sister of Philips father, be it Sauros or 1 of their brothers.
and as to the contention that the LN said that Sauros was the brother of Pauls Father, it also doesn't matter if their is this specific continuity error because no matter what this would still mean that Philip is the nephew of Pauls parent.
IE
Paul - Philip = 1st cousins
Paul-ERIS= 1ST cousins once removed
Rudeus- Eris = 2nd cousins

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Eris and rudeus are NOT cousins

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