Tsubasa Omnibus
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| THIS IS AN MANGA ONLY DISCUSSION POST. DO NOT DISCUSS ANYTHING BEYOND THIS CHAPTER. ---------------------------------------- I would like to congratulate CLAMP for successfully mind f*cking me . ;_; ...so...erm....if you look at it on a certain way..... ~The father is the son and the son is the father , the mother is the wife and the wife is the mother.~ ...yay.. can't wait for next week lol . |
 (made by MistaCloudStrife ^^) |
Finally all the theories are confirmed that the xXxholic World is the CCS-world post series. Now all we need to do is pinpoint exactly how long the time period between the series is. |
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| Wooooooooooooooooow. Thank you CLAMP for the plot twist of the century. This indeed mindf*cked me. |
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| Now that's a very unexpectet twist. For those reading xxxHolic: Do you think the wand Watanuki found in chapter 3 was the real deal after all? |
undead_blopaMay 10, 2008 7:32 AM
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| *Loses a few brain cells after reading the chapter.* Holy mother of molasses. Okay, so CCS Sakura and Syaoran got busy, had a kid and this is the R! Syaoran from TRC? And then the parents saw some prophetic vision of their kid meeting another Sakura in another dimension who would need his help? I get the feeling that I'm wrong here. And his "true name?" What the hell? CLAMP. You people are evil. Pure evil. But I'm loving every page of it. :) |
| So...one thing is complete now - EVERY TRC group member was not who he was. Each of them used the fake names... But...During Tokyo arc, when FWR "narrated" the events, he said, "clone of Clow's descendant Syaoran, I created" with the flashback of R!"Syaoran" being cloned...so wtf...FWR also thought his name is Syaoran? Now with this whole, sending to another world stuff...Yuuko looked extremelly sad, doing it. NOw I have to wonder if CCS!Syaoran and CCS!Sakura sent their son there, for the same reason as Watanuki's parents "protected" watanuki from death... So now, Watanuki is Either R!"Syaoran's" brother or R!"Syaoran's" son -.-" |
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| I DON'T UNDERSTAND ANYTHING ANYMORE. I think what confuses me the most right now is the chronological time of CCS!Syaoran's son. He was a kid when he met Sakura, then he grew up, was reverted back to a kid and then was under FWR's spell for a long time until Tokyo Arc. Who is this Sakura he met, then? Because she can't be Sakura-hime, the chronological time doesn't match... |
| I understood the Sakura in the pool this chapter to be the real Sakura. She and R! Syaoran grew up together, some awful event happened (?), and Syaoran chose to turn back time (enter the clones--story repeats). That was my interpretation anyway. Who knows though.... >< |
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AngelLily said: I DON'T UNDERSTAND ANYTHING ANYMORE. I think what confuses me the most right now is the chronological time of CCS!Syaoran's son. He was a kid when he met Sakura, then he grew up, was reverted back to a kid and then was under FWR's spell for a long time until Tokyo Arc. Who is this Sakura he met, then? Because she can't be Sakura-hime, the chronological time doesn't match... She IS Sakura from CLow, R!Sakura or whatever you call her. R!"Syaoran" met her, then something happened, then he asked to return his own time back...I am guessing to the day he met her, so he would get captured by FWR. Hence, in this reversed-timeline in which trc story is happening, R!Syaoran was supposed to meet R!Sakura, but did not. Then the clone came, the incident in first chapters, R!Sakura's body disintegrating and C!Sakura begining her journey, while R!Sakura's soul sleeps in FWR's hideout. |
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| I see. The biggest question now would be why he went back in time. And what part Watanuki plays in his story. |
MaxwellLilyMay 10, 2008 9:11 AM
| Wooow what a twist!! This keeps getting more confusing and interesting by the chapter :P |
| OMG, I'm still WTF??? Soooo Syaoran is Kinomoto/Li kid... Than where to hell are Kinomoto and Li now? And his real name... what? And he fell in love with his mom's spitting image... whilst looking exactly like his dad... so screwed up... I don't understand anything anymore... |
sanjicaMay 10, 2008 10:08 AM
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| CCS+xxxHOLiC+Tsubasa = 8D |
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sanjica said: OMG, I'm still WTF??? Soooo Syaoran is Kinomoto/Li kid... Than where to hell are Kinomoto and Li now? And his real name... what? And he fell in love with his mom's spitting image... whilst looking exactly like his dad... so screwed up... I don't understand anything anymore... yeah you're right, we're talking about Oedipus complex here. But the pace is too slow and we lost the track of what happened, especially where the plot is confusing. I basically have to re-read the last 30 chapters to get a better picture. This storyline is like CLAMP on drugs....too many clones, copies, timelines and parallel worlds. |
bla bla bla The endless debate between fans and haters. At one point, after spending a lot of time on MAL, you just realize it's totally pointless.Niko-kun said: On MAL, everyone who has used the lame rating system becomes a critic and an intellectual by default, haven't you heard? |
| wow im so confused............if xxxholic and trc together wasnt confusing enough, now ccs is thrown into the picture as well >.< total mind f*cker XP |
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| *Loses a handful of brain cells after reading this chapter* |
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| i give up trying to sort all this out in my head. i think i'll just go with the flow from now on xD |
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| ^^ I'm too confuse to figure out the timeline and clones and stuff. Looking forward to having a better explanation on the next chapter. |
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Fai said: Now with this whole, sending to another world stuff...Yuuko looked extremelly sad, doing it. NOw I have to wonder if CCS!Syaoran and CCS!Sakura sent their son there, for the same reason as Watanuki's parents "protected" watanuki from death... A very scary thought that I share... I hope that's not the case, or I think I'll stop reading this. Anyway, there's something that nobody's mentioning abouth this R! "Shaoran", R! Sakura thing, and that is the ruins. If you remember the very first chapter, Shaoran was excavating the ruins that belonged to Clow Country's past. In R! Shaoran's memory, we see that the ruins where actually being used to perform some kind of ceremony, so that would mean that Shaoran's Sakura and R!Shaoran's Sakura are not the same person as sugested above. Also take in mind Sakura's clone was created when her feathers scattered, so there where actually 2 real Sakuras and a clone. Right now there's R! Sakura soul, C! Sakura's body and only God knows about the other R! Sakura's whereabouts. Now, there is another possibility. The citicens in the "Separated Time" still call that structure as ruins, so it could mean that the ruins where either constructed or already excavated in R! Shaoran's time. In short, I wouldn't discart the possibility that R! Shaoran actually comes from the future instead of the past... No, wait! Not even CLAMP would make the story soo mindscrewing... |
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| What a plot twist! O_o The Syaoran that we came to know and love (clone and real) through about twenty or so volumes is in fact the son of Li Syaoran and Sakura that is indigenous to the ×××HOLiC universe! O_o It was quite the shock to my system when I read this titbit – a similar sensation I had after I found out that the Syaoran that I've been following for the first fifteen volumes or so was a clone. I hope that this is the last revelation we have of our "Syaoran" because I don't think I could survive another one. XD Regardless, it's nice to know that the son takes after his father, so in my mind I could rationalise that he and Syaoran are identical, like I did when R!Syaoran came and took over C!Syaoran's role. Still, it's a tad disconcerting to have Syaoran and Sakura's seven-year-old son go to another dimension to meet his soul mate, which happens to look like his mother and has her name. Now, that's the most extreme case of Oedipus Complex that I have ever seen! Although, I'm slightly disappointed, because I was looking forward into finding out about Syaoran's father and his name (Seishirou commented of knowing Syaoran's father), only to find out that it was Li Syaoran. On another vein, I remember, way back when, feeling sorry for Kurogane for not having a twin/clone when we found out that Sakura was a replicate, because everyone in the group either had a twin or clone. Now I feel sorry for Sakura, because she's the only one in the group that hasn't kept her "true name" to herself since the beginning of the story, unless... I mean Fay took his twin brother's name Yuui, Kurogane's true name (Youou) is only known to Princess Tomoyo, Mokona's true name (Soel), I believe has yet to be disclosed in the manga, and now, we learned that Syaoran has taken his father's name, while his real name is still undisclosed. *sighs* Poor, poor, Sakura... |
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| Ugh, Clamp is giving me a headache. They're so good at it. =< I mean, this is just so confusing. AS ALWAYS. |
 My kingdom for a bottle of plum juice! |
| OMGLOLWUT!!! TRC R!Syaoran is CCS Sakura and Syaoran's kid?! ... This is just too awesome. CLAMP I love you. Thank you for making this connection! ;; (Now next thing we know, Watanuki is also Clow's relative or something). |
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Fai said: So...one thing is complete now - EVERY TRC group member was not who he was. Each of them used the fake names... So true. Darnit CLAMP I already had a headache before I read this chapter...but I still love it all. Next one please! (aka more explanations and amazing-ness) |
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| @_@ Could someone kindly explain this? |
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Blitzaga said: @_@ Could someone kindly explain this? Have you ever read/watched/heard about Card Captor Sakura (CCS)? Well then, if you have: The Sakura and Syaoran from CCS got married and had a kid, which turns out to be the Real!Syaoran from TRC. Sakura from CCS (R!Syaroan's mom) had a dream where she saw him meeting someone in another dimension, so she sent him to Yuuko. Then Yuuko sent him to Clow Country where he met Real!Sakura of TRC. Hopefuly I didn't just break your brain. x___X' |
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| CLAMP never ceases to amaze me. And now with this I just have to question sanity and the amount of wine they consumed when they came up with all of this. |
AjisaiteaMay 10, 2008 10:30 PM
blopa said: Anyway, there's something that nobody's mentioning abouth this R! "Shaoran", R! Sakura thing, and that is the ruins. If you remember the very first chapter, Shaoran was excavating the ruins that belonged to Clow Country's past. In R! Shaoran's memory, we see that the ruins where actually being used to perform some kind of ceremony, so that would mean that Shaoran's Sakura and R!Shaoran's Sakura are not the same person as sugested above. Also take in mind Sakura's clone was created when her feathers scattered, so there where actually 2 real Sakuras and a clone. Right now there's R! Sakura soul, C! Sakura's body and only God knows about the other R! Sakura's whereabouts. Now, there is another possibility. The citicens in the "Separated Time" still call that structure as ruins, so it could mean that the ruins where either constructed or already excavated in R! Shaoran's time. In short, I wouldn't discart the possibility that R! Shaoran actually comes from the future instead of the past... No, wait! Not even CLAMP would make the story soo mindscrewing... NO. Even in our real world ancient ruins have been used by some nations as a places of ritual. Its entirely possible that ruins were used as place for some kind of ritual, but no one ever tried to explore them and whats burried inside. Thats, until Fujitaka came. Hence why he would need to put a lot of work into convincing people - people might have thought about it as some sort of holy place, untouchable and all. |
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Icephoenix said: Really? When was it revealed that Sakura didn't use her "true name"? I must have missed that somewhere. If that is so, then I don't feel so sorry for Sakura anymore for not being the only one that didn't start of with a pseudonym as I stated in my previous post. =)Fai said: So true.So...one thing is complete now - EVERY TRC group member was not who he was. Each of them used the fake names... Darnit CLAMP I already had a headache before I read this chapter...but I still love it all. Next one please! (aka more explanations and amazing-ness) However, I must agree with the headache thing – CLAMP has an amazing way of giving me those. XD |
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blopa said: Now, there is another possibility. The citicens in the "Separated Time" still call that structure as ruins, so it could mean that the ruins where either constructed or already excavated in R! Shaoran's time. In short, I wouldn't discart the possibility that R! Shaoran actually comes from the future instead of the past... No, wait! Not even CLAMP would make the story soo mindscrewing... I never thought of R!Syaoran as someone from the past at all. When we talk about different dimensions, it's hard to pinpoint exactly from which point at time the person is coming from. Sometimes Sakura would come to a world where her feather had already come many, many years before the time she actually lost them. Regardless, it's nice to know that the son takes after his father, so in my mind I could rationalise that he and Syaoran are identical, like I did when R!Syaoran came and took over C!Syaoran's role. Still, it's a tad disconcerting to have Syaoran and Sakura's seven-year-old son go to another dimension to meet his soul mate, which happens to look like his mother and has her name. Now, that's the most extreme case of Oedipus Complex that I have ever seen! To "meet his soul mate" is merely especulation. We know Syaoran and Sakura are smarter than that - or Clow's guardians are smarter than that. After all, Clow and Yuuko made the two Mokonas solely for this day, so there must be some significance. If this Sakura has the power over the dimensions, and if something were to happen to her, who knows what would happen if someone took control of her soul? Isn't the soul something that connects all dimensions? Even if you meet someone who is not the one you met previously, the soul is the same? Though I could be wrong, LONG time since I read those chapters. |
Fai said: blopa said: Anyway, there's something that nobody's mentioning abouth this R! "Shaoran", R! Sakura thing, and that is the ruins. If you remember the very first chapter, Shaoran was excavating the ruins that belonged to Clow Country's past. In R! Shaoran's memory, we see that the ruins where actually being used to perform some kind of ceremony, so that would mean that Shaoran's Sakura and R!Shaoran's Sakura are not the same person as sugested above. Also take in mind Sakura's clone was created when her feathers scattered, so there where actually 2 real Sakuras and a clone. Right now there's R! Sakura soul, C! Sakura's body and only God knows about the other R! Sakura's whereabouts. Now, there is another possibility. The citicens in the "Separated Time" still call that structure as ruins, so it could mean that the ruins where either constructed or already excavated in R! Shaoran's time. In short, I wouldn't discart the possibility that R! Shaoran actually comes from the future instead of the past... No, wait! Not even CLAMP would make the story soo mindscrewing... NO. Even in our real world ancient ruins have been used by some nations as a places of ritual. Its entirely possible that ruins were used as place for some kind of ritual, but no one ever tried to explore them and whats burried inside. Thats, until Fujitaka came. Hence why he would need to put a lot of work into convincing people - people might have thought about it as some sort of holy place, untouchable and all. It's nice to see that someone actually took all that seriously XD |
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AngelLily said: I grant you that "to meet his soul mate", may have been a poor choice of words and perhaps not the primary reason why they would have sent their son into another dimension and I regretting using the phrase the second after I posted the comment, but I was too lazy to change it! XD However, there's little denying the fact that they have romantic feelings for each other – well at least with the clones.Regardless, it's nice to know that the son takes after his father, so in my mind I could rationalise that he and Syaoran are identical, like I did when R!Syaoran came and took over C!Syaoran's role. Still, it's a tad disconcerting to have Syaoran and Sakura's seven-year-old son go to another dimension to meet his soul mate, which happens to look like his mother and has her name. Now, that's the most extreme case of Oedipus Complex that I have ever seen! To "meet his soul mate" is merely especulation. We know Syaoran and Sakura are smarter than that - or Clow's guardians are smarter than that. After all, Clow and Yuuko made the two Mokonas solely for this day, so there must be some significance. If this Sakura has the power over the dimensions, and if something were to happen to her, who knows what would happen if someone took control of her soul? Isn't the soul something that connects all dimensions? Even if you meet someone who is not the one you met previously, the soul is the same? Though I could be wrong, LONG time since I read those chapters.Actually, it's Sakura's body that has a memory of all dimensions, not the soul. Otherwise FWR wouldn't have ordered C!Syaoran to kill Sakura's soul in the Dream World. He said something to the effect that he didn't need her soul, just her body – which is probably one of the reasons why Yuuko sent the gang to retrieve Sakura's body first when Sakura separated her body and soul. As for the souls connecting dimensions, I wouldn't say they connect – maybe transcend, I remember Yuuko telling Watanuki rather early in ×××HOLiC (second volume) that while similar versions of a person may exists in different dimensions, living different lives, they essentially shared the same soul. |
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Taylor_Tertius said: I grant you that "to meet his soul mate", may have been a poor choice of words and perhaps not the primary reason why they would have sent their son into another dimension and I regretting using the phrase the second after I posted the comment, but I was too lazy to change it! XD However, there's little denying the fact that they have romantic feelings for each other – well at least with the clones. Actually, it's Sakura's body that has a memory of all dimensions, not the soul. Otherwise FWR wouldn't have ordered C!Syaoran to kill Sakura's soul in the Dream World. He said something to the effect that he didn't need her soul, just her body – which is probably one of the reasons why Yuuko sent the gang to retrieve Sakura's body first when Sakura separated her body and soul. As for the souls connecting dimensions, I wouldn't say they connect – maybe transcend, I remember Yuuko telling Watanuki rather early in ×××HOLiC (second volume) that while similar versions of a person may exists in different dimensions, living different lives, they essentially shared the same soul. Ah, of course. There's no denying, it's hitsuzen by now. ;P But still, there must be something connecting the two Sakuras, CCS and Tsubasa, that may have made the Sakura and Syaoran send their son across dimensions to help Sakura-hime. |
Taylor_Tertius said: Icephoenix said: Really? When was it revealed that Sakura didn't use her "true name"? I must have missed that somewhere. If that is so, then I don't feel so sorry for Sakura anymore for not being the only one that didn't start of with a pseudonym as I stated in my previous post. =)Fai said: So true.So...one thing is complete now - EVERY TRC group member was not who he was. Each of them used the fake names... Darnit CLAMP I already had a headache before I read this chapter...but I still love it all. Next one please! (aka more explanations and amazing-ness) However, I must agree with the headache thing – CLAMP has an amazing way of giving me those. XD Sakura who traveled with a group was a "Clone", so in a sense she was not "Sakura". Same withb PreTokyo!Syaoran. He was a clone, using the name which theoretically did not belong to him. But even so. Kurogane never called Fai, R!Syao or C!Syao by name. The only one who got called by her name by him was Sakura, I think. At first I thought that he would call R!Syao "syaoran", but, when he kept calling him "kid" and C!Syao "that kid", I was already waiting for a revelation of different name for R!Syaoran. |
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Fai said: Eh, that's where we part company, just because they are clones doesn't mean that what they are named isn't their true names. I mean they didn't know they were clones to begin with and their names were their own – stolen as they may have been, but still their own. I agree with you that not everyone seems to be what they were at the beginning, but I think that only Sakura hasn't keep her true name secret – at least at this point and time.Taylor_Tertius said: Sakura who traveled with a group was a "Clone", so in a sense she was not "Sakura".Icephoenix said: Really? When was it revealed that Sakura didn't use her "true name"? I must have missed that somewhere. If that is so, then I don't feel so sorry for Sakura anymore for not being the only one that didn't start of with a pseudonym as I stated in my previous post. =)Fai said: So true.So...one thing is complete now - EVERY TRC group member was not who he was. Each of them used the fake names... Darnit CLAMP I already had a headache before I read this chapter...but I still love it all. Next one please! (aka more explanations and amazing-ness) However, I must agree with the headache thing – CLAMP has an amazing way of giving me those. XD Same withb PreTokyo!Syaoran. He was a clone, using the name which theoretically did not belong to him. But even so. Kurogane never called Fai, R!Syao or C!Syao by name. The only one who got called by her name by him was Sakura, I think. At first I thought that he would call R!Syao "syaoran", but, when he kept calling him "kid" and C!Syao "that kid", I was already waiting for a revelation of different name for R!Syaoran. To reiterate, Fai, Kurogane and R!Syaoran deliberately used pseudonyms to cover their "true names", Fai using his deceased brother's name instead of his true name (Yuui), Kurogane never told anyone his real name (Youou) except to Princess Tomoyo and R!Syaoran used his father's name – even Mokona's name (Soel) has yet to be revealed to the group. Sakura is the only one in the group thus far that hasn't used a pseudonym (at least that we currently know of). |
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| XD!! I loved this chapter, when I read it I was all typing furiously to my best friend about it in an email. It opens soooo many questions though. The biggest one for me, if Sakura is Tsubasa Syaoran's mother... then does that mean the feelings he felt even for the clone were not romantic, but that of an adoring son? XD interesting to find out ... |
| ZOMG!!! All i can say after all this confussion is... I can not wait to see how Watanuki is involved in all this |
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Xannieh said: The biggest one for me, if Sakura is Tsubasa Syaoran's mother... then does that mean the feelings he felt even for the clone were not romantic, but that of an adoring son? XD interesting to find out ... I think at this point, Syaoran's son has already fallen in love with Princess Sakura. She may look like his mother, but she is not his mother. The personalities clash a lot. |
| It is very surprising that this Syaoran is the son of Cardcaptor Sakura's Syaoran!! I thought he was a Syaoran of a different world. |
Faust721 said: i give up trying to sort all this out in my head. i think i'll just go with the flow from now on xD That's exactly what I'm thinking. |
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Tsunami said: Faust721 said: i give up trying to sort all this out in my head. i think i'll just go with the flow from now on xD That's exactly what I'm thinking. I think the same, and I can't stop to say WTF? |
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HuangJialuo said: Taylor_Tertius said: Although, I'm slightly disappointed, because I was looking forward into finding out about Syaoran's father and his name (Seishirou commented of knowing Syaoran's father), only to find out that it was Li Syaoran. Maybe, Seishirou is also a relative of Clow's? for one he's powerful and he does look like him, haha and for that matter he could also be a relative or son of Eriol's (CCS's Clow's reincarnation) though Eriol was a kid in CCS he did admit he was much older and had voluntarily impeded his growth for their encounter Also take note that Seishirou and his brother have the same 'closed-eyes serene-smile' look as Clow and Fujitaka (in CCS he is half of Clow's reincarnation)! It would make sense to me, haha Nope, that would fuck with all Tokyo Babylon continuity. Unless TB, X and CCS didn't happen in same verse, but I think they did. |
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| So, Kinomoto Sakura and Li Syaoran of the Card Captor Sakura universe had a son. This son withheld his "true name" and used his father's name. And with the price of his mother's Star Staff, he went to Clow Country. There he met Princess Sakura. This is the original timeline, the ruins are being used as a place for holy rituals. They are together always and grow up. Then something happens, which forces R!Syaoran to rewind time until they are children again. So that he can "retrieve the Sakura from back then". But after rewinding time, the now young again R!Syaoran is captured by Fei Wong Reed. R!Syaoran is replaced by C!Syaoran who is operating on half a borrowed heart and taken in by Fujitaka. Naturally, the original timeline has been altered since C!Syaoran in his incompleteness, cannot replicate the life of R!Syaoran. I believe we are now operating in an alternate reality, a second timeline of the same Clow Country. |
SalmissraJun 14, 2013 10:47 PM
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| I love how they connected it with cardcaptor Sakura! |
| what just happened? Syaoran father was also named Syaoran and his mother was Sakura....that is in it self so much confusing |
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| Just when you think it can't one up itself up anymore. |
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