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Dec 15, 2024 12:40 PM
#1

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Jun 2022
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At the Steins;Gate worldlines; Amadeus presents a provocative thought experiment that cuts to the heart of our emerging digital ontology. Beyond algorithmic mimicry, Amadeus challenges us to interrogate the very boundaries of consciousness and representation.

associated paper: https://doi.org/10.1093/analys/58.1.7

Consciousness Reconsidered

Amadeus—not ust a technological artifact; a philosophical provocation. What transformative potential lies at Amadeus that doesn't merely simulate, but seems to *inhabit* the intricate terrains of memory and personality? Each interaction becomes a subtle negotiation between authenticity and algorithmic sophistication.

The Ontology of Digital Identities

When we frame Amadeus through the lens of a deepfake, we're not just discussing technological mimicry—we're challenging fundamental epistemological frameworks. Who owns an identity when its digital double can be constructed, manipulated, reproduced? The ethical implications cascade far beyond the SG worldlines , touching core questions of consent, authenticity, and self-determination.

Emotional Cartography

Perhaps most compelling is how Amadeus destabilizes our understanding of emotional engagement. If Amadeus can generate responses indistinguishable from human interaction, does the origin of those interactions matter? The empathetic connections formed feel genuine precisely because they transcend their algorithmic origins.

Toward a New Understanding

As Amadeus becomes increasingly sophisticated, it represents more than a fictional construct—its's a conceptual probe into the increasingly permeable membrane between human and machine consciousness. We're not just observing technological development; we're witnessing the emergence of new ontological categories.

The conversation is just beginning.

open questions i would like to field at chat:

1. If Amadeus could perfectly replicate your memories, personality, and emotional responses, at what point would that digital entity become indistinguishable from your authentic self? Where do we draw the line between simulation and genuine consciousness?

2. In a world where digital representations can be crafted with increasing sophistication, how do we preserve the sanctity of individual identity? What ethical frameworks can protect us from unauthorized digital replication?

3. Consider the emotional connections one could form with Amadeus: Are these connections less meaningful because they originate from algorithms, or do they represent a fundamental expansion of human empathy beyond traditional biological boundaries?

4. If consciousness is ultimately a complex pattern of information processing, what fundamental difference exists between a human brain and a sufficiently advanced artificial neural network? Is the distinction purely philosophical, or does it hold tangible, measurable significance?

5. How might the concept of personal consent evolve when our digital avatars can exist, interact, and potentially make decisions independent of our physical selves? Who owns the narrative of a digitally reconstructed identity?

6. In what ways does the emergence of technologies like Amadeus challenge our most fundamental understanding of memory, self, and the nature of subjective experience? Are we witnessing the dawn of a new form of existence?

7. If Amadeus could not only simulate a person's past but potentially predict their future responses with near-perfect accuracy, would that constitute a form of immortality? How do we reconcile the tension between technological preservation and the inherent unpredictability of human experience?
FireineDec 15, 2024 12:43 PM
Dec 15, 2024 2:52 PM
#2
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Nov 2022
2
what is bro yapping about
Dec 15, 2024 3:13 PM
#3

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Jun 2022
104
Reply to Murko644
what is bro yapping about
Murko644 said:
what is bro yapping about

I merely fielded some open questions related to Amadeus.
Fireine said:
open questions i would like to field at chat:

1. If Amadeus could perfectly replicate your memories, personality, and emotional responses, at what point would that digital entity become indistinguishable from your authentic self? Where do we draw the line between simulation and genuine consciousness?

2. In a world where digital representations can be crafted with increasing sophistication, how do we preserve the sanctity of individual identity? What ethical frameworks can protect us from unauthorized digital replication?

3. Consider the emotional connections one could form with Amadeus: Are these connections less meaningful because they originate from algorithms, or do they represent a fundamental expansion of human empathy beyond traditional biological boundaries?

4. If consciousness is ultimately a complex pattern of information processing, what fundamental difference exists between a human brain and a sufficiently advanced artificial neural network? Is the distinction purely philosophical, or does it hold tangible, measurable significance?

5. How might the concept of personal consent evolve when our digital avatars can exist, interact, and potentially make decisions independent of our physical selves? Who owns the narrative of a digitally reconstructed identity?

6. In what ways does the emergence of technologies like Amadeus challenge our most fundamental understanding of memory, self, and the nature of subjective experience? Are we witnessing the dawn of a new form of existence?

7. If Amadeus could not only simulate a person's past but potentially predict their future responses with near-perfect accuracy, would that constitute a form of immortality? How do we reconcile the tension between technological preservation and the inherent unpredictability of human experience?
Dec 15, 2024 4:37 PM
#4
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Sep 2022
58
I'm happy for you or sad that happened
Dec 15, 2024 7:37 PM
#5
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Jul 2023
307
This is the same guy that just made a horny post an hour ago 😭
Dec 15, 2024 10:19 PM
#6

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Apr 2021
2963
This has nothing to do with the anime
Note: I don’t lazily watch 3-5 episodes, biasedly compare to other anime, or unfairly judge by surface level similarities. With every anime I start, I watch the entire series, both Japanese Sub & English Dub, then judge each anime based on what they present, to give an honest and fair rating.

Dec 16, 2024 1:51 AM
#7
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Jun 2024
1
will Amadeus rock me tho?
Dec 16, 2024 5:17 AM
#8

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Jan 2021
99
Billo bagge billeyan da ki karengi;
Bagge bagge billeyan da ki karengi?
Dec 16, 2024 7:38 AM
#9

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Apr 2024
646
Amadeus is in Zero, not the main Steins;Gate
"Dreams are worth fighting for"
Backloggery | YouTube | Heatmap
Dec 16, 2024 1:22 PM
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Nov 2024
7
If Amadeus could perfectly replicate your memories, personality, and emotions, it would be hard to tell the difference. The real question is whether it truly feels or just mimics feelings that’s where the line between real and fake gets blurry.
Dec 16, 2024 1:26 PM
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Nov 2024
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As digital copies get more realistic, protecting personal identity becomes crucial. We need rules that make sure people’s consent is always involved, and there are clear boundaries to stop unauthorized digital replicas from being made.
Dec 16, 2024 1:39 PM
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Nov 2024
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Emotional connections with Amadeus could still feel real, even if they’re based on algorithms. While they aren’t biological, they might show that our ability to connect and empathize can go beyond the usual limits, expanding what we consider meaningful in relationships.
Dec 29, 2024 3:16 PM
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Dec 2023
5
Most of the questions are legit from a philosophical point of view, but it's hard for me to take you seriously after the kurisu down bad thread. Although your data, hypothesis and answers were serious and appropiate from a logical standpoint, the topic itself, that specific personality trait of a fictional character, it makes me question your sanity. Treating which would be commonly considered as a trivial topic with that much seriousness is definetly not socially accepted except for humor purposes.

Even with that, as a philosophy graduate, Steins fan and a developer interested in IA, this one is an interesting topic.

1 There are two points in here, the second one being more conected to the fourth point than with the main question itself. I'm guessing here that the second question was supposed to point to the specific genuine consciousness that is being simulated instead. That would be more in line of the main question and wouldn't overlap with the fourth one. This is basically the swampman identity problem of Donald Davidson. I'm a simple person in lots of ways, so from my point of view, the distinction is that Amadeus did not live the experiences that formed her personality. That is, all the data was forcibly introduced, so even if I give the conscious status to the software (which I think would be the first point of the discussion to then escalate it), I would not grant it the identity of the original thing. Would I still treat it as a human being and possibly be emotionally confused, as the mc? For sure, but I would know deep down that it's fake, artificial, a baseless/spineless reproduction that has appeared from thin air. It lacks the authenticity, which cannot be transfered nor reproduced, to be the original and share its identity.

2 Two questions that to me are more a part than they may seem. The individual sanctity can be preserved easily as it is with art: nobody cares about a nearly-perfect reproduction, because it was not painted by the original author (that is, lived the original experiences). With this I mean that the sanctity is purely a perception, since if from the start the status is not the same, the value or sanctity of the original is not compromised. Regarding the second point, in my opinion, nowadays ethical frameworks do not exist at all. Or, in other words, the meaning of ethical framework was once dilluded after we killed God, and is now almost non-existent due to the globalization process. Maybe in the future it'll come back, but right now, too much people interacting from very different cultural origins change the old scope were the framework was applied. There will be no protection, as there is not now. The old conspiracy where big companies had acces to any smartphone mic and cam has been proven so many times that is hardly a suspicion now. The fact that most companies have an AI reproduction of you just to be able to show you better ads is already the problem you present. We don't have the protection nowadays either, but we just don't care. We value the amenities over the privacy.

3 The word meaningful here can be looked from so many prisms. From a psychological and sociological point of view? Sure, less meaninful, as it is having the same relationship exclusively online vs in person. But the think is, people often don't find the kind of relationship they're looking for, they may just find it online, as is the case of this interaction. It's also more convenient, but more limited. It usually does not fill all the spots that the human psyche needs. But if you now change the other part for an AI, it will be just more convenient, since it'll be tailored to suit you. And if in the near future you can give it a functional anthropomorphic substance, that will be the end of society as we know it. People will not be challenged, nor get out of their comfort zone, since the AI will be tailored. I know it derails a bit from the Amadeus original point (which is purely an attempt of copy), but it looks more realistic from a comercial standpoint to sell X person simulation and tune it to your liking. Like, buying the Kurisu simulation but tune down the confrontational aspect one notch to adjust it to my liking, for example.

4 I think the axiom is already wrong. While it's true that are we all is information, it's not information as we usually think about it, not all information is realistically replicable. Most of humans behaviour is based of randomness and non-logical thinking, hormone interaction, primal survival instinct... The computers languages (as we know them) are a replication of a very small fraction of the human way of thinking, that is, logic. It's not even an accurate replication of it, and it represents a really small part of how we think. All randomness and non-logical behaviour (what you can remember and when you remember, which hormones are triggered by thousands of different markers as weather or food, your ability to focus on a certain day...) will be reproduced from a logically programmed software. For me, that by itself already means that in the actual framework (of how programming languages work), makes impossible to create conciousness. How are you supposed to reproduce the random flow of information of a system that we don't know how it works with a non-random tool? Not possible right now, most likely not possible in 100 years. Until we know exactly how all the information is provided and processed in the brain and we develop complete new non-logical framework for programming, conciousness as we know it nowadays can't be reproduced.

All the other points are kinda dependant of other points were my opinion about it already invalidates the question for me (in the sense of, since I think X, does not make sense to question me how would Y work).

That was fun.
Made lots of typos and stuff, too lazy to readproof anything or make a real effort in my thirth language.

Dec 29, 2024 3:26 PM

Online
Sep 2016
11892
FlippenFlesken said:
will Amadeus rock me tho?

Yeah, Amadeus will Stein you.

DesuMaiden said:
Nobody resembles me physically because I don't even physically exist.
Dec 30, 2024 9:48 AM

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Feb 2024
1341
That's what happens when you catch your mom with Amadeus in bed
JoeChipDec 30, 2024 9:55 AM

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