| Bait title for novel readers lol Just curious about why in the very begin of the story the first girls already had one "mankai" or "suicidal powerup skill"*, but 3 centuries later (CENTURIES!) the rotten root cult was not able the create anything safer and in fact they let Gin dies without NOTHING special to activate. Do your best to explain this convenient hole. * we all know that the special trick is only a plot device to: "We need something to set that no matter winning or losing the battles, the magical girls have to SUFFER" |
Rob7Nov 16, 2021 10:51 AM
 |
Rob7 said: Bait title for novel readers lol Just curious about why in the very begin of the story the first girls already had one "makai" or "suicidal powerup skill"*, but 3 centuries later (CENTURIES!) the rotten root cult was not able the create anything safer and in fact they let Gin dies without NOTHING special to activate. Do your best to explain this convenient hole. * we all know that the special trick is only a plot device to: "We need something to set that no matter winning or losing the battles, the magical girls will SUFFER" @Rob7 it's not the mankai used by the previous heroes you could say their own abilities can also be called trump cards the pattern is indeed similar to the mankai but literally different from mankai meaning "withered flower blooming flower" to mistake the meaning of the withered flower for the word "sange" which sacrifices the body parts of the girls to the tree god while the power used by the previous hero is their own power that is obtained from the gods that burdens all parts of their body which means their power is more risky than "mankai" their various types of power show the original power possessed by heroes who are also influenced by their determination to save others For example, Takashima Yuuna, who is usually paired with Wakaba, has the power to help the front line heroes at that time. In this story, Yuuna is the only one who has the determination so that the form of change is more than 1, there is an emotional development here, but it can be compared with Wakaba who has great power to fight the enemy. Here we are shown how humans appreciate or don't appreciate the struggles that have been carried out by girls so that it makes us wonder whether humans deserve to be saved and in the Yuuki Yuuna chapter the heroes change their struggles not for humans but for themselves, especially Yuuna who fights for her own happiness. Because at first vertex came because of human activity. Compared to the previous heroes, the girls reported in the media put pressure on the heroes so that the next generation of heroes can be seen in the generation of heroes. Yuuki Yuuna's story, the heroes are not published in the media or politics, but only known to taisha people, it can be explained in Gin's death which dialogue "we are the government" also don't know anything" maybe around this dialogue I don't remember exactly what the dialogue is like. Maybe that's all I'm talking about, I can add or correct my writing. |
SchlimmJun 4, 2022 1:10 PM
 |
Schlimm said: @Rob7 it's not the mankai used by the previous heroes you could say their own abilities can also be called trump cards the pattern is indeed similar to the mankai but literally different from mankai meaning "withered flower" which sacrifices the body parts of the girls to the tree god while the power used by the previous hero is their own power that is obtained from the gods that burdens all parts of their body which means their power is more risky than "mankai" their various types of power show the original power possessed by heroes who are also influenced by their determination to save others For example, Takashima Yuuna, who is usually paired with Wakaba, has the power to help the front line heroes at that time. In this story, Yuuna is the only one who has the determination so that the form of change is more than 1, there is an emotional development here, but it can be compared with Wakaba who has great power to fight the enemy. Here we are shown how humans appreciate or don't appreciate the struggles that have been carried out by girls so that it makes us wonder whether humans deserve to be saved and in the Yuuki Yuuna chapter the heroes change their struggles not for humans but for themselves, especially Yuuna who fights for her own happiness. Because at first vertex came because of human activity. Compared to the previous heroes, the girls reported in the media put pressure on the heroes so that the next generation of heroes can be seen in the generation of heroes. Yuuki Yuuna's story, the heroes are not published in the media or politics, but only known to taisha people, it can be explained in Gin's death which dialogue "we are the government" also don't know anything" maybe around this dialogue I don't remember exactly what the dialogue is like. Maybe that's all I'm talking about, I can add or correct my writing. Thanks, but could you point where is the explanation of the complete lack of any "Trump Card" skill by the time Gin's group was introduced, 300 years later than Takashima's one? Remembering that soon after Gin's death, they came with the Mankai, meaning that the Taisho always was seeking for a trump card to defeat Vertex on emergencies. The plot hole is Gin having to die without any emergency special skills to powerup her or any of the girls before the death. Even 300 years after the Taisho starts to develop this kind of feature. |
Rob7Nov 16, 2021 10:46 AM
|
| Hey, it's fiction. What causes plot holes is not lack of reality, but lack of explanation. I think it would be OK if the story came with "Hey Togo and Sonoko, here is your new mankai, we IN THE PAST had something like this to power-up heroes in emergencies, but more dangerous, and we cancelled because they were using it without any critteria and dying even when they could survive". wow, can i be an YuYu novel author? |
|
Hey, it's fiction. What causes plot holes is not lack of reality, but lack of explanation. I think it would be OK if the story came with "Hey Togo and Sonoko, here is your new mankai, we IN THE PAST had something like this to power-up heroes in emergencies, but more dangerous, and we cancelled because they were using it without any critteria and dying even when they could survive". wow, can i be an YuYu novel author? @Rob7 I see you regretted the character who should be able to survive but instead can't survive because of the power that is not given, yeah that's right I don't blame anyone for hoping like that. I've also explained that the effects of the previous heroes' powers are more dangerous than the effects of mankai. Maybe you can write your own story to try to get published if you are lucky enough to get a tv serialization show |
|
Schlimm said: @Rob7 it's not the mankai used by the previous heroes you could say their own abilities can also be called trump cards the pattern is indeed similar to the mankai but literally different from mankai meaning "withered flower" which sacrifices the body parts of the girls to the tree god while the power used by the previous hero is their own power that is obtained from the gods that burdens all parts of their body which means their power is more risky than "mankai" their various types of power show the original power possessed by heroes who are also influenced by their determination to save others For example, Takashima Yuuna, who is usually paired with Wakaba, has the power to help the front line heroes at that time. In this story, Yuuna is the only one who has the determination so that the form of change is more than 1, there is an emotional development here, but it can be compared with Wakaba who has great power to fight the enemy. Here we are shown how humans appreciate or don't appreciate the struggles that have been carried out by girls so that it makes us wonder whether humans deserve to be saved and in the Yuuki Yuuna chapter the heroes change their struggles not for humans but for themselves, especially Yuuna who fights for her own happiness. Because at first vertex came because of human activity. Compared to the previous heroes, the girls reported in the media put pressure on the heroes so that the next generation of heroes can be seen in the generation of heroes. Yuuki Yuuna's story, the heroes are not published in the media or politics, but only known to taisha people, it can be explained in Gin's death which dialogue "we are the government" also don't know anything" maybe around this dialogue I don't remember exactly what the dialogue is like. Maybe that's all I'm talking about, I can add or correct my writing. Thanks, but could you point where is the explanation of the complete lack of any "Trump Card" skill by the time Gin's group was introduced, 300 years later than Takashima's one? Remembering that soon after Gin's death, they came with the Mankai, meaning that the Taisho always was seeking for a trump card to defeat Vertex on emergencies. The plot hole is Gin having to die without any emergency special skills to powerup her or any of the girls before the death. Even 300 years after the Taisho starts to develop this kind of feature. This actually always happened before the emergence of the mankai system. I mean these heroes died can be seen in the many tombs of the hero girls who died young near the great bridge for being paid to use the power of a god. If in the series it is told because "The girls who become holy heroes so they can use the power of the gods since long ago the holy girls were always sacrificed to the gods" here the taisha spoke. |
|
| they never mention that the past heroes use mankai and gin fought 3 vertex, she probably used some sorta powerup but to no avail. everything is experimental, this season they tried to bloom a sacred tree in the void but they had to get it back because they needed the power for the hero system. yuyuyu is actually intelligent |
    |
Catalano said: they never mention that the past heroes use mankai and gin fought 3 vertex, she probably used some sorta powerup but to no avail. everything is experimental, this season they tried to bloom a sacred tree in the void but they had to get it back because they needed the power for the hero system. yuyuyu is actually intelligent But you missed all the points. 1. The question is not mankai, but any kind of powerup like the first heroes already was using (that "berserk" armor with counter). 2. 300 years later and nothing, really? Gin, Togo and Sonoko had nothing to powerup in that emergency (not a surprise that 2 was beaten earlier and Gin died). 3. Its magical girl anime, if there is a proper powerup, it MUST have some kind of henshin, changing the outfit etc. Man, we are talking about sacred traditions here! Lol |
|
| My theory is that Taisha has indeed been developing the new Hero System (including Mankai) for those 300 years. By the time Gin's group start fighting, the Mankai system is almost finished, but Taisha just needs a little bit more data to finish the system. So, they used Gin's group as "guinea pigs" to collect data from their fights. And after Gin's death, they finally have enough data to complete the system. I think this answer the question of "why the Mankai system is only introduced shortly after the girls start fighting again". Because it's impossible to collect more data about the fights during time of peace. Another explanation is that, after 300 years of peace, Taisha simply underestimated how difficult it is to fight the Vertexes and they think that they can get away without using any "Power Up" system. |
AshenWishNov 19, 2021 8:38 AM
FlyingEgg said: My theory is that Taisha has indeed been developing the new Hero System (including Mankai) for those 300 years. By the time Gin's group start fighting, the Mankai system is almost finished, but Taisha just needs a little bit more data to finish the system. So, they used Gin's group as "guinea pigs" to collect data from their fights. And after Gin's death, they finally have enough data to complete the system. I think this answer the question of "why the Mankai system is only introduced shortly after the girls start fighting again". Because it's impossible to collect more data about the fights during time of peace. This makes sense, in fact it is not dificult to explain, as i said posts above, even doing an explample. What bugs me and what makes plot holes to exist is exactly the lack of official explanation from the authors. Another explanation is that, after 300 years of peace, Taisha simply underestimated how difficult it is to fight the Vertexes and they think that they can get away without using any "Power Up" system. Wait, peace? Lots and lots of girls died fighting in those 300 years between Wakaba's story and Gin. That memorial is full of names. In fact in the end of the last season of YuYu all the dead girls came to "give a hand" to Togo while rescuing Yuna from that marriage ceremony. |
|
| I agree, and it's one of the main reasons I haven't read Nogi Wakaba. The only way to keep the story fresh is to introduce new concepts. Any concept that existed in Nogi Wakaba would be known to Taisha 300 years later, yet Washio Sumi has no such foreshadowing. If heroes are still needed, why don't Taisha use all the tools available to them? |
| その目だれの目？ |
Rob7 said: Bait title for novel readers lol Just curious about why in the very begin of the story the first girls already had one "mankai" or "suicidal powerup skill"*, but 3 centuries later (CENTURIES!) the rotten root cult was not able the create anything safer and in fact they let Gin dies without NOTHING special to activate. Do your best to explain this convenient hole. * we all know that the special trick is only a plot device to: "We need something to set that no matter winning or losing the battles, the magical girls have to SUFFER" During that 300 years of ceasefire (not peace), Taisha did managed to make better normal weapons which why Gin and friends weapons can damage the Vertex without any need to use that suicidal power up. But well... it seems they forget or didn't bother with any defensive protection, which is why the impenetrable defensive barrier are only available after Gin death. Also, something big and bad happened in the year 72 that involved Wakaba, Akamine Yuuna, and friends vs terrorists which ends with the death of every person that still know the truth about Vertex before the full truth censorship about Vertex by Taisha. I assume a lot of weapons research progress are delayed, halted, or destroyed during this period. I don't know the details yet as this story is exclusive to the gacha game lol. https://yuyuyu.fandom.com/wiki/Akamine_Yuuna https://yuyuyu.fandom.com/wiki/Miroku_Renge https://yuyuyu.fandom.com/wiki/Signal_Arrow |
Rob7 said: Wait, peace? Lots and lots of girls died fighting in those 300 years between Wakaba's story and Gin. That memorial is full of names. In fact in the end of the last season of YuYu all the dead girls came to "give a hand" to Togo while rescuing Yuna from that marriage ceremony. Have you seen the newest episode? After the death of Takashima Yuuna, Taisha thought that they have no chance to beat the Vertexes. So, they decided to do the Fire Offering Festival: beg forgiveness from the Heavenly Gods by literally throwing young girls outside the walls and letting them burn in hell. In the LN, it's explained that the Heavenly Gods let humanity survive, on the condition that humans give up their Hero powers, and to never go outside Shinju's boundary. Humanity were basically locked inside a cage. As for the graves in the memorial, I think most of them are Miko. I'm sure you already know a few of them: Kokudo Aya, Uesato Hinata, and even Tougou Mimori (who doubles as a Hero). There are a lot more Miko beside them. Their main task is to receive oracles from Shinju. And I'm not 100% sure about this... but the Fire Offering Festival was not done only once, but regularly. Maybe once a few years or even every year. Each time, several Mikos are sacrificed. That's why after 300 years, we end up with so many graves in the memorial. One can say that, even though the Mikos don't fight, they also protected humanity by sacrificing themselves, and so they're not very different from the Heroes. |
AshenWishNov 20, 2021 9:08 AM
FlyingEgg said: Rob7 said: Wait, peace? Lots and lots of girls died fighting in those 300 years between Wakaba's story and Gin. That memorial is full of names. In fact in the end of the last season of YuYu all the dead girls came to "give a hand" to Togo while rescuing Yuna from that marriage ceremony. Have you seen the newest episode? After the death of Takashima Yuuna, Taisha thought that they have no chance to beat the Vertexes. So, they decided to do the Fire Offering Festival: beg forgiveness from the Heavenly Gods by literally throwing young girls outside the walls and letting them burn in hell. In the LN, it's explained that the Heavenly Gods let humanity survive, on the condition that humans give up their Hero powers, and to never go outside Shinju's boundary. Humanity were basically locked inside a cage. As for the graves in the memorial, I think most of them are Miko. I'm sure you already know a few of them: Kokudo Aya, Uesato Hinata, and even Tougou Mimori (who doubles as a Hero). There are a lot more Miko beside them. Their main task is to receive oracles from Shinju. And I'm not 100% sure about this... but the Fire Offering Festival was not done only once, but regularly. Maybe once a few years or even every year. Each time, several Mikos are sacrificed. That's why after 300 years, we end up with so many graves in the memorial. One can say that, even though the Mikos don't fight, they also protected humanity by sacrificing themselves, and so they're not very different from the Heroes. Yeah it changes everything, because i was sure that lots of other heroes died during these 300 years between Wakaba and Gin. Would be OK to all that other names in the Heroes Monument to be Mikos, and not only Heroes, if the monument was about mikos too. |
|
Yuvensius said: I don't know the details yet as this story is exclusive to the gacha game lol. Your explanation sounded pretty interesting up until this point. Why do the Japanese have to write such inaccessible storylines? I liked the previous seasons, mostly, but it's a huge turnoff when they can't be understood without outside research. |
| その目だれの目？ |
| Reasons not to use Wakaba era's trump cards: 1. the system inserts spirit directly into the body, very dangerous 2. it destroys the heroes mentally (see Chikage) and physically (see those blood?) Gin's era comparison: 1. Sumi, Gin, Sonoko's normal hero system is already as strong if not stronger than trump card 2. the vertex already reached perfect form, much stronger than Wakaba era. Despite that, Sumi & co's hero system could fight pretty well. 3. In Wakaba novel they couldn't even graze a semi complete vertex unless they use specially strong trump card (Yuuna's Shuuten and Wakaba's Daitengu). That's why Anzu and Tama were killed. 4. Perhaps Taisha was overconfident with how strong the hero system in year 298 had become and didn't feel the need to upgrade. Why not Mankai? 1. Mankai system sacrifices the heroes body parts for power. 2. Heroes are young girls, they're mentally unstable. See how Fuu and Tougou went berserk in season 1 after they learned about the sacrifice. Taisha knew about this danger too, hence why they kept Sonoko in case they need to stop other heroes' rampage |
More topics from this board
Poll: » Yuuki Yuuna wa Yuusha de Aru: Dai Mankai no Shou Episode 9 DiscussionStark700 - Nov 26, 2021 |
20 |
by 2life
»»
Jan 22, 9:20 AM |
|
Poll: » Yuuki Yuuna wa Yuusha de Aru: Dai Mankai no Shou Episode 8 DiscussionStark700 - Nov 19, 2021 |
31 |
by 2life
»»
Jan 22, 2:36 AM |
|
Poll: » Yuuki Yuuna wa Yuusha de Aru: Dai Mankai no Shou Episode 7 DiscussionStark700 - Nov 12, 2021 |
34 |
by 2life
»»
Jan 22, 2:11 AM |
|
Poll: » Yuuki Yuuna wa Yuusha de Aru: Dai Mankai no Shou Episode 6 Discussion ( 1 2 )Stark700 - Nov 5, 2021 |
54 |
by 2life
»»
Jan 21, 11:44 AM |
|
Poll: » Yuuki Yuuna wa Yuusha de Aru: Dai Mankai no Shou Episode 11 DiscussionStark700 - Dec 10, 2021 |
32 |
by GavrocheN7
»»
Apr 16, 2024 1:38 PM |