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MAL_ArticlesJan 21, 2018 9:59 PM
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Klabautermann said: Very little has actually been said in the article on the exact reason why incest seems to be popular in anime, or about incest as a genre in anime in general. It feels more like a guide for incest-themed anime rather than discussion on impact of the genre in Japanese culture. The entire text basically boils down to the fact some people like it and that's okay and nice, as illustrated here: --> "...it leads to my final point. There is clearly an audience of individuals that like seeing this subject material in their entertainment. There is a market for this type of content, so logically there is no real reason for the individuals that make such material to stop. There can be moral conflicts with a viewer's personal belief towards the subject; however, these people have the choice to not view it if they do not wish to." I mean, we all already know that. That's why there are so many bad anime in the first place, incest themed or not. Came with the intention of pointing the same. The title seems misleading. If you simply used something like "Incest, as presented in Anime" or "Incest in anime: just a form of love" it wouldn't have been a problem. The article itself it's okay. I get the author's opinion about how they see it and the titles we can watch to see some examples, tho I was surprised to not see the mention of Boku wa Imouto ni Koi wo Suru. It's one of the first to come to mind when talking about this. Even the mention of those with the theme in a subtle form as Mahouka Koukou no Rettousei (yes, it has this). Or even the mention of the use of this theme when it's discovered later that they aren't blood related (like in Kiss x Sis). I know that the article attempts to explain the why it's popular over there but I wasn't satisfied, that's all. If it had taken a different approach with the same theme it might have been more interesting =) I mean, even trying to talk about it could have included a small paragraph as to why it's often used over there. Tho I do have to disagree with In Japan, sex is a much more comfortable and open topic that is much easier to discuss than in the West. It differs depending the country, so making that as a generalization seems like a preconception of it, which doesn't necessarily reflects the truth of the theme and how it's seen in other places besides Japan.... besides that one there are others I don't agree with, but that's expected and not worth that much to say.Overall it was an interesting read (^_^)/ (joined just to post here xD) |
| If you asked me I would say that the 兄妹愛 phenomenon is something which is deeply rooted in the folkloric memory in both Japanese and other East Asian populations, we have some major Chinese deities being twin brother and sister, and according to the mythos they are the main ancestors/creators of humanity or something like that, then there's the whole thing about Koboshisama and Orihimesama being reborn as siblings in the old tale of the star-crossed lovers, this in turn can be (possibly) a reference to how incest helped with preservation of social status and power in early nomadic communities, it's all very romantic and platonic but at the same time it's like it remains ingrained in the "genetic memory" of many people, which in turns has an effect on the cultural aspects surrounding these beliefs, which by the way, have never been linked to negative stereotypes or anything of that sort. And sure, it's romantic and all, but considering that the "incest barrier" as described by Jung is the second one to appear in the process of socialization, the main strength that these kind of relationships may have in modern society would have to be the mystical, alluring appeal that they pose as they evoke primal, "instinctive" memories from way back. People these days can no longer tolerate romantic relationships between relatives, not even the horizontal ones, mainly because they have no practical reason to do so, and second, there are implied risks for their offspring without proper genetic counseling, and the funny thing is that, ironically, this problem may have started because of the inbreeding depression of genetically stagnant populations, which now comprise the large majority of people in the world who share a large portion of their DNA with members of their community/ethnicity. |
DrMondaiNashiJan 23, 2018 10:35 PM
| @DrMondaiNashi That's super interesting! As long as it's tied back to anime/manga, that would absolutely be an article I'd be interested in seeing. It might be a bit too out there to relate back to anime/manga, but it's certainly a fascinating perspective. |
| @Greycat1217 Western society is more than strongly tolerant of homosexuality, but nevertheless, you can meet many obviously heterosexual people who adore such works because of the melodramatic gaynst. Oh, the popularity of such topics in culture is directly dependent on the existence of such taboos. And as I think, many people like imouto titles and the like, not because they are sexually attracted by relatives, but because the prohibition makes it hot. @Shymander This is called the "twin myth", it existed in many cultures, from ancient Egyptians to Scandinavian mythology. Although as you can learn from genetics, twins of different gender are not technically identical, in fact very many people were inspired by the idea that the original people (or gods) were a heterogeneous version of one essence and symbolized the struggle of opposites in our world. Actually, many bigender gods are a continuation of this dualism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dualistic_cosmology. So, people began to romanticize heterosexual twincest even before the advent of literature. Of course, it's silly to think that many such works are really inspired by philosophical dualism, and not by the desire to use a popular erotic fetish, but even now many people are unconsciously attracted by the idea that twins of different gender complement each other and are one. |
RobertBobertFeb 18, 2018 5:36 PM
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Anime often explores topics that are taboo in many cultures. um what? besides incest and (maybe) homosexuality, what? For example, sexuality, in general, is a very sensitive topic in the United States and is not usually welcomed by general audiences. In Japan, sex is a much more comfortable and open topic that is much easier to discuss than in the West. um YEAH sorry dude you're going to need to back on your claims on that one. japan is more open than the US????? since when????? In Japan, siblings are usually regarded as caretakers and tend to take on more responsibilities in offering guidance for their younger siblings. yeah and i guess in russia that doesn't happen. older siblings aren't supposed to take care of their siblings in other countries? this was a needless sentence everyone knows how siblings are generally supposed to work. When this taboo is used in a story that focuses on an attempt to find love or to explore a person’s deep desires for romance, it can generate a strong emotional response in a viewer. Whether a good response or a bad one, it still managed to get the viewer to feel a strong way. Koi Kaze is a romance anime that does this very well. "It makes you feel something" excuse me lmao? that's an argument? that's what makes it an art form? With the fact that incest can be found in some form or another in a large portion of anime, it leads to my final point. There is clearly an audience of individuals that like seeing this subject material in their entertainment. There is a market for this type of content, so logically there is no real reason for the individuals that make such material to stop. There can be moral conflicts with a viewer's personal belief towards the subject; however, these people have the choice to not view it if they do not wish to. if you switched the subject about incest with pedophilia, it's literally the same thing. I hope that I have managed to give some clarity towards some possible reasons as to why incest appears so often in anime. It is a topic that has the potential to make people uncomfortable, but at the very least it is good to have a perspective on why it exists without completely brushing it off as a sexual topic. but you just admitted that if it's incest it's ecchi/hentai so OF COURSE people would automatically think incest = banging oni chan blind. you just took down your own point, which was basically the only point you pretty much had. |
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| @DrMondaiNashi dude that's a great theory, and thank you for telling me what the end of kokkoku said. Definitely a misleading article. Also in my Google searches of this topic, someone said some mothers would let their sons have sex with them to keep their focus on their studies. |
| I certainly didnt agree with the ubiquitous claim that "In Japan, sex is a much more comfortable and open topic that is much easier to discuss than in the West." That is too much of an absolute on its own, but most that know even a bit about japanese culture know that such an outwardly, and even inwardly prim and proper people are not as "open" as most of those in the west. Firstly the same cultural norms about respectful displays are way more prevalent and seemingly over the top at times in Japan than in many parts of the world. Also , though ideas do get relaxed with time and modernization becoming almost the same globally in terms of trends, I still dont see super busty women in Carnival outfits in grade school learning videos like in certain countries ( Brazil). Also the naked news in Europe is a lot more risque than what seems available in Japan, unless they have suddenly stepped up their game.This is not to say Japan does not have things risque; on the contrary they have some nasty and out there stuff. I know better than to use an absolute and dare be called a hypocrite after this rant of mine ( lol). And , of course, in the good ol USA, things are just more open. Still, to get to the point of "why incest", it seems ot be a more deeply rooted idea that is present in almost all cultures, judging by not only mythological tales fro mall corners of the globe, but by way of that being more proof, tradition based on life experience( of ancient peoples, not me). The further back one looks, even beyond myth and legend, there can usually be gleaned some shred of truth to just about anything the ancient world thought worth teaching and handing down. Even in Christianity, depending on which field of thinking one ascribes to, Adam being the supposed first (jewish) man , is mated with a female (Eve in most translations) literally cloned from his own essence and body. IF you were to not believe such a tale, the only other alternatives are he either mated with the first woman that also seemingly was made out of clay, thus technically being his sister (Lillith) or a female angel that lgre to love him and "descended" to Earth to be with him( Eve). Still juding from the majority of these creation myths, they pretty much scream incest , though more logically as a result of the choice to continue the species when no suitable mates are around. Many scholars have surmised that going back many tens if not hundreds of thousands of years, the mixing of familial blood would have ben ridiculously common in such close knit primitive "clans" until people began to venture out further and thus begin to expand and breed outside of their personal gene pool. Likely too, the meeting and partial mixing of Cro magnon and Neanderthal genetics was a much needed and likely eventuality to occur from the few remaining hominid offshoots left i nthe world, even so long ago. The similarities in peoples of most ethnicities and geographical locales also rings loudly of the ancient lines of close knit family groups trading children for marriage for generations in the same areas so often that, without this, in a way, most races and peoples would not have much of their physiological specific features and , possibly, tendencies. Even in the modern new age where travel and acess to more information has opened up the minds of humans and lessened much of the once hard set urges to discriminate or isolate, even with many people mingling and marrying from all walks of life, we still see many similarities , one could say "dopplegangers" in many shapes and sizes, all over the place. "Have I not met you before" and " I know somebody so similar to you" can at times be literal indicators of branches of genetics having met again in a far off place so perfectly as to almost end up with a person that truly resembles, in mind and body, somebody half way around the world with no ties in the last century. I am not a fac of incest, but to put it mildly, the real reason why that as a genre along with everything else conceivable exists, is simply because they have existed as ideas, and as long as people have urges, they have acted upon them. But in the case of much of Japan, the long forecasted dwindling birthrate, and eventually national populace will end up becoming a fast growing trend in not only other Asian countries, but maybe in the west. Hopefully, though, this doesnt lead to a resurgence of shotgun wedding inbreeding. I hope I was respectful enough. LONG LIVE MAL! HAppy 13th BIRTHDAY ( in more 3 days)! OMEDETO...KAMPAI! ^~^ |
AnchientProphet2Apr 3, 2019 8:30 AM
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