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| THIS IS AN ANIME ONLY DISCUSSION POST. DO NOT DISCUSS THE MANGA BEYOND THIS EPISODE. ---------------------------------------- Mm a tense episode but still, these allusions just never ceases to entertain me: Also interesting background info revealed again this episode. The trial also caught my attention a bit. Quite entertaining. However, the most most tense part is the end. I suppose forgiveness isn't part of Yureha's vocabulary anymore. Another damn cliffhanger D:  |
Stark700Feb 23, 2015 8:16 AM
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| Zetsubo667 said: So it turns out Yuriika was a bear after all. Mmmm... . Yup! . Sure looks that way...  If the above image failed to display properly, or for a much higher resolution version, please click below: http://livedoor.blogimg.jp/aaieba149/imgs/a/6/a6cd88b8.jpg |
| Dat cliffhanger...interesting episode, Really. This anime is the best of the season. EDIT: "At last shall hit the mark", under the Two guns in the wall (14:35) |
XenocrisiFeb 23, 2015 10:43 AM
| So my guesses about Yuriika and her motives were indeed correct. Although it might have been the mother who became invisible and not Yuriika and Yuriika could not deal with that(remember? The bears can only eat invisible girls). Also more proof to my "the bear and human world we see is representation of Kureha's perception of reality warped by some event and the bear court is her subconscious in conflict with itself":   ^The "Day of Severance" when the "wall" appeared is when Kureha's perception of Ginko changed  ^Court implying they represent Kumalia's will. Kureha=Kumalia? |
AhenshihaelFeb 23, 2015 10:59 AM
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Zetsubo667 said: So it turns out Yuriika was a bear after all, as well as the one who killed Kaoru. Can't believe we got something right :-D the word “predictable” is one of the last that come to mind in relation to this anime. Then again, maybe it was a double bluff? Make it too obvious so it's a surprise when it turns out to be exactly what it seems? |
| So we know that Yuriika was the one that killed Kureha's mother. Damn that cliffhanger. Wish I knew what they said at the end there. |
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| Very tense and interesting episode filled with more answers that everyone were waiting for :) I think everyone knew that the principal was the one behind it all but her back story was pretty sad tbh. Still what she did was selfish and evil and it made me cringe to see how Kureha fell for all her antics in this episode However, I did not expect to see that Ginko was the one that killed Sumika. I thought that the other bear from like episode 2 or 3 admitted to eating her? Also, if the principal isn't a bear anymore then does this mean that there is someone else going around eating people? And man that cliffhanger sucks.....If Kureha shot Ginko I'm gonna be pissed |
Tokoya said: However, I did not expect to see that Ginko was the one that killed Sumika. I thought that the other bear from like episode 2 or 3 admitted to eating her? That was not said. What was said was muted by the thunder. |
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CookingPriest said: Tokoya said: However, I did not expect to see that Ginko was the one that killed Sumika. I thought that the other bear from like episode 2 or 3 admitted to eating her? That was not said. What was said was muted by the thunder. Zetsubo667 said: Truelalomartins said: Can't believe we got something right :-D the word “predictable” is one of the last that come to mind in relation to this anime. Then again, maybe it was a double bluff? Make it too obvious so it's a surprise when it turns out to be exactly what it seems? Its very possible it was a double bluff, I was still expecting something else but its happened now. Tokoya said: However, I did not expect to see that Ginko was the one that killed Sumika. I thought that the other bear from like episode 2 or 3 admitted to eating her? It was never said that Ginko killed Sumika. What Lulu revealed was muted. Based on the flashback of Epsiode 6 its most likely that Ginko's sin as well as what Lulu told Eureka here, is that Ginko could of prevented Mitsuko killing Sumika but didn't, because she probably wanted Sumika dead as well. But even then, why point the gun at her? Kureha really annoyed me by how naive she was in this episode |
Is it just me or the fish gutting in this episode was shaped as vagina? |
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| WHAT JUST HAPPENED? |
Zetsubo667 said: lalomartins said: Can't believe we got something right :-D the word “predictable” is one of the last that come to mind in relation to this anime. Then again, maybe it was a double bluff? Make it too obvious so it's a surprise when it turns out to be exactly what it seems? Its very possible it was a double bluff, I was still expecting something else but its happened now. Tokoya said: However, I did not expect to see that Ginko was the one that killed Sumika. I thought that the other bear from like episode 2 or 3 admitted to eating her? It was never said that Ginko killed Sumika. What Lulu revealed was muted. Based on the flashback of Epsiode 6 its most likely that Ginko's sin as well as what Lulu told Eureka here, is that Ginko could of prevented Mitsuko killing Sumika but didn't, because she probably wanted Sumika dead as well. Yep, this is the only option i can really go for. What else could it possibly be, anyone? Moral of the story is that Ginko really fucked things up big time and couldn't get out of it anymore. (watching Sumika die and not helping, dragging Lulu into this mess and end up hurting her) |
| So she was the bear!? Like everyone and their mama didn't know that. Damn this was a good episode. Learned a lot about the principle. So that's why see keeps a lot of boxes. Was surprise that it was her that killed Tsukibaki's mom. Dat ending was great. Lulu came out of no where and got Ginko shot. I felt like Ginko was going to tell her anyway. Well can't wait to see what happens next episode. 4/5 |
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| I knew it! I knew it was Yurika who Kureha's mother Reia. And seriously the previous principle is a guy? He look at a woman, as a matter of fact he look exactly like Kaoru. |
| Xenocrisi said: "At last shall hit the mark", under the two guns in the wall (14:35) Wow! Clearly you are watching the HD version! Somebody else on the MAL threads about Yurikuma, Soulelle, spotted this way back during Episode 3, as it says on her blog titled "soulelle's Blog": http://myanimelist.net/blog.php?eid=766387 As Soulelle pointed out, the entire text of what is written on the wall is “She that shoots oft at last shall hit the mark.” This proverb was first said in 2015 by Ikuhara, she says. A very closely-related proverb is, “He that shoots oft at last shall hit the mark.” This was written in 1516 by Sir Thomas More in "Utopia". Well, in fact, More wrote "Utopia" in Latin. The standard English wording is due to R. Robinson who translated "Utopia" into English in 1551. As a side note, back in 1551, the letter "s" looked pretty much like "f", so in older books the proverb used to be printed something like this: . . . . . “He that fhootf oft at laft fhall hit the mark.” From Googling “He that shoots oft at last shall hit the mark", it is notable that the vast majority of hits are on webpages in Japan. Apparently, this is a much- loved English proverb, which they always translate as 下手な鉄砲、数打ちゃ当たる。 I don't know the story of how this got first started. Some Korean webpages use it as well. In the cases where it is mentioned on English-language webpages, it is usually in extremely old books which are collections of English proverbs, most of which don't specify who originally said it. Here are a few examples of Japanese webpages which show More's proverb along with the standard Japanese equivalent: http://ejje.weblio.jp/content/He+that+shoots+oft+at+last+shall+hit+the+mark. http://kakugeneigo.seesaa.net/article/96606052.html http://eow.alc.co.jp/search?q=%22%5Bhit%5D+the+mark%22 In fact, the proverb does not mention the word "gun" and has nothing to with shooting. After all, the book was written in 1516, at which time handheld guns were very early in their development. As well, More was not creating a new proverb, but was actually referring to an even older proverb, which can be translated as, ‘That he who throws the dice often, will sometimes have a lucky hit.’ In other words, if you roll a pair of dice often enough, sooner or later you will get double-sixes. Look at this more recent translation of "Utopia" here on page 37: http://history-world.org/Utopia_T.pdf The standard Japanese translation of More's proverb is 下手な鉄砲、数打ちゃ当たる。 which looks to me like they are saying, "Somebody who is not good at shooting a gun, if they shoot many times, they will hit." So the meaning in Japanese has been multiply distorted from what Sir Thomas More had in mind in 1516. That big flower above the crossed rifles is related to Kureha's family name, "Tsubaki" (椿輝). The first kanji 椿 by itself is also pronounced "tsubaki". The second kanji 輝 means something like "brightness". If you do a Google Image search for 椿輝, you will see many pictures of Kureha. However, if you do a Google Image search for 椿, you will see many pictures of the Tsubaki flower. Its scientific name is "Camellia japonica". If you look around Kureha's house, you will notice many tsubakis all over the place. Also, there is a picture of a tsubaki painted on the bottom-front of the wood part of Kureha's hunting rifle. |
| God damn cliffhanger...what did Lulu say about Ginko and Sumika? I thought Mitsuko was the one who ate Sumika? |
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okanagan said: Xenocrisi said: "At last shall hit the mark", under the two guns in the wall (14:35) Wow! Clearly you are watching the HD version! Somebody else on the MAL threads about Yurikuma, Soulelle, spotted this way back during Episode 3, as it says on her blog titled "soulelle's Blog": http://myanimelist.net/blog.php?eid=766387 As Soulelle pointed out, the entire text of what is written on the wall is “She that shoots oft at last shall hit the mark.” This proverb was first said in 2015 by Ikuhara, she says. A very closely-related proverb is, “He that shoots oft at last shall hit the mark.” This was written in 1516 by Sir Thomas More in "Utopia". Well, in fact, More wrote "Utopia" in Latin. The standard English wording is due to R. Robinson who translated "Utopia" into English in 1551. As a side note, back in 1551, the letter "s" looked pretty much like "f", so in older books the proverb used to be printed something like this: . . . . . “He that fhootf oft at laft fhall hit the mark.” From Googling “He that shoots oft at last shall hit the mark", it is notable that the vast majority of hits are on webpages in Japan. Apparently, this is a much- loved English proverb, which they always translate as 下手な鉄砲、数打ちゃ当たる。 I don't know the story of how this got first started. Some Korean webpages use it as well. In the cases where it is mentioned on English-language webpages, it is usually in extremely old books which are collections of English proverbs, most of which don't specify who originally said it. Here are a few examples of Japanese webpages which show More's proverb along with the standard Japanese equivalent: http://ejje.weblio.jp/content/He+that+shoots+oft+at+last+shall+hit+the+mark. http://kakugeneigo.seesaa.net/article/96606052.html http://eow.alc.co.jp/search?q=%22%5Bhit%5D+the+mark%22 In fact, the proverb does not mention the word "gun" and has nothing to with shooting. After all, the book was written in 1516, at which time handheld guns were very early in their development. As well, More was not creating a new proverb, but was actually referring to an even older proverb, which can be translated as, ‘That he who throws the dice often, will sometimes have a lucky hit.’ In other words, if you roll a pair of dice often enough, sooner or later you will get double-sixes. Look at this more recent translation of "Utopia" here on page 37: http://history-world.org/Utopia_T.pdf The standard Japanese translation of More's proverb is 下手な鉄砲、数打ちゃ当たる。 which looks to me like they are saying, "Somebody who is not good at shooting a gun, if they shoot many times, they will hit." So the meaning in Japanese has been multiply distorted from what Sir Thomas More had in mind in 1516. That big flower above the crossed rifles is related to Kureha's family name, "Tsubaki" (椿輝). The first kanji 椿 by itself is also pronounced "tsubaki". The second kanji 輝 means something like "brightness". If you do a Google Image search for 椿輝, you will see many pictures of Kureha. However, if you do a Google Image search for 椿, you will see many pictures of the Tsubaki flower. Its scientific name is "Camellia japonica". If you look around Kureha's house, you will notice many tsubakis all over the place. Also, there is a picture of a tsubaki painted on the bottom-front of the wood part of Kureha's hunting rifle. WOW you did a great search (is this the right word?), thank you xD |
SaveTheAralSea said: God damn cliffhanger...what did Lulu say about Ginko and Sumika? I thought Mitsuko was the one who ate Sumika? She did. There is just something else that Ginko did to Sumika, it was the topic of the last 20 seconds (unheard cause of thunder). |
| Just as most of us guessed, principal Yuriika was the one that ate Kureha's mom, Reia. She got overly sentimental over their relationship and couldn't stand seeing Reia giving her love to someone else than her, even if it was her own child Kureha or Ginko for that matter. What the hell did Lulu say that changed Kureha's mind instantly? I can only imagine she revealed that Ginko was a witness to Sumika's death and could've prevented it from happening. Even so, I really hope Kureha didn't shoot Ginko. :O Very good episode! I think Funimation messed up the subbing in Yuriika's monologue in the beginning when she was talking about the previous principal. That was definitely a woman and they used the pronoun "he" instead. *Sigh.. |
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| Ginko sin is an easy one. They can only eat invisible girls then why did she not eat the head bear of the invisible storm before sumika got eaten. simple she wanted her for herself. the school is full of boxed unwanted bears due to the principal so i see alot of Bear shock in the future. |
| HOLY CRAP! THERE WAS A GUY IN THE SCHOOL! What happened to them all? o.O A lot of the stuff this episode was pretty predictable. The presentation made it special though. I liked Yuriika's backdrop. It gave a lot of clarity as to what occurred in the past while also fleshing her out more. So she loved Reia but Reia only viewed her as a friend, thus eventually had a child to which Yuriika dealt with overwhelming grief because.. I assume by "sullied" it means "pure" and because Reia has more than 1 love, she is no longer pure? Casting aside another's love so easily as well, even though Reia likely called it a "love charm" because it was given to her by someone she cared about a lot. Again though, the use of "friend" and "love" almost appear interchangeable in this series. Though this time around they made a clear distinction that Yuriika and Reia's love was different. Have to wonder what information Lulu gave that would make Kureha do such a 180 on her decision. It wasn't that Ginko killed her because Ginko would have reacted to that sort of information. Maybe that Ginko and Sumika were lovers at some point? No, there was no time for them to meet and be together... Family? No.. I don't think Kureha would behave that way if that was the case... Maybe it was because Ginko didn't save Sumika? That's probably it. Either way, we'll find out next week. |
| Feel sorry for the principal; boxing things up is scary; love the dark tones near the end 9/10 |
| That damn cliffhanger in the end! It really is a pain now to wait for the next episode... DX |
| Holy Madoka! The Yuri is strong here! My Anime List  |
| Well... this was quite the episode this week. I expected everything about principal Yuriika, her background was really really interesting and her young self looked quite cute. It's sad that Reia didn't return her feelings, but she didn't properly voice them at all... Poor her. Still that's not a good excuse to kill her lol. Jealousy can be way too problematic. It was interesting how they potrayed the possessiveness side of love in two diffrenet forms; Yuriika's form (taking all of the other person and making it only yours) and Ginko's form (Yearning and desire to be with the other even if you may hurt the other person in the process). Yuriika is more forceful while Ginko does whatever it takes to be with Kureha. BUT THAT CLIFFHANGER! Oh gooood. Am I the only one who thinks that maybe Sumika and Ginko could have actually interacted with each other? Maybe the friend of whom Sumika talks about to Kureha is actually Ginko... Probably not but it just came to my mind lol. That angry look on Kureha's face after Lulu said... whatever the hell she said was so intense. The hurt look was also good. The principal definetely sent the letter expecting Lulu or Kureha to read it, not Ginko >:/. Still, Ginko is still at fault since she most probably let Sumika die when she had the opportunity of saving her... or something like that. Since she wanted to have Kureha for herself, and Sumika was in the way, that is the first thing that came to my mind. That or she somehow lead Sumika to her death... maybe Next week will be good if it comes with answers :OO |
| Wow! There was a lot in this episode! I'm glad that we finally got some long-hoped-for answers. I felt so sad for Yuriika. :( I thought it was interesting that, in contrast to Lulu's and Ginko's backstories being narrated by Life Sexy, Yuriika narrated her own. Another thing that caught my attention was the clicking of his high heels. It reminded me of how Dorothy clicks her ruby slippers in The Wizard of Oz to go home from a far-off place. I'm not too sure of myself here, but the clicking of the high heels could represent "going home" in the figurative sense of "home" being what you grew up with and are familiar with, and the "far-off place" is the bear values that are instinctual to Yuriika (because she's a bear) but that are far removed from the pure world of the humans. The man who finds Yuriika clicks his heels just before teaching her the values that she would come to internalize as she grew up, and then when he "appears" (in quotes because I think it's just figurative and in Yuriika's head this second time) the second time when Yuriika gives up on the love she found after unboxing herself and returns to her previous worldview. Shaniyaz said: Very good episode! I think Funimation messed up the subbing in Yuriika's monologue in the beginning when she was talking about the previous principal. That was definitely a woman and they used the pronoun "he" instead. *Sigh.. I don't know very much Japanese at all, so this may be completely incorrect (and if anyone does know a lot of Japanese, please correct me if I'm wrong), but the sentence Yuriika says is "Sore ga kare to mo de ai" (I could be dividing up the syllables incorrectly). If I'm right, "Kare" means "he/him". Though, he does look like a woman. Could that mean that Kaoru was also technically a boy? Zetsubo667 said: So it ends on quite a cliff-hanger but with Yuriika being revealed so soon is she really going to be the final opponent with 4 more episodes still to go? That's what I was thinking as well. There may still be some final confrontation with Yuriika since this episode ended on a cliffhanger, but I also wonder if there will be some incident with the bear court. CookingPriest said: Also more proof to my "the bear and human world we see is representation of Kureha's perception of reality warped by some event and the bear court is her subconscious in conflict with itself" I'm not saying I completely disagree with your interpretation of the bear court as Kureha's subconscious, as I think it makes a lot of sense for Kureha, but how does it explain the variation of instances in the bear court? Different bears go before the court for different reasons. At first it's just Ginko and Lulu on trial, and then we have Lulu, and later Yuriika, going before the court to be allowed to become human. By episode 4, Kureha doesn't know Lulu is a bear, and she still doesn't know Yuriika is a bear. It also doesn't seem to account for the court approving everything. Do you think the court could more generally represent the subconscious of the person or people who are going before it to get permission for something? That would explain why people/bears who Kureha doesn't know are bears are going before the court, and also why the court seems to approve everything (if a person's in conflict over something they feel very strongly about, they'll generally let themselves go in that direction). The other thing is that Kureha herself has never actually gone before the court. Something else I just thought of, but will have to go back and check to see if I'm remembering it correctly, is that (I think?) the court only happens when there's a major turning point for a character that requires them to make a big, life-changing choice (deciding whether or not to kill someone, leaving everything you ever knew behind to follow someone you just met on a long journey, deciding to "box up" your true self forever). Keten said: HOLY CRAP! THERE WAS A GUY IN THE SCHOOL! What happened to them all? o.O I wonder if the fact that everyone (even the men) looks like women is a perception thing. Like, all the male characters we see that are clearly shown to be male are those who are important in some way or other to the characters. In Lulu's case, it was her dad and brother. In Ginko's case, the father of the family she was looking at through the window was shown as male because that kind of family is something she desperately wanted but didn't have. In Yuriika's case, the man is shown as a woman because he's not that important to Yuriika. The thing with that, though, is that she was happy that he found her because it made her feel wanted, so why isn't he shown as a man? I wonder if it's because the story is told in past tense, as Yuriika remembering it, and as she is now, the man who found her isn't as important to her as he was back then. As far as the Judgmen go, the reason they're men (even if they represent womens' subconscious) could be because the values they judge people based on are from a patriarchal society, just because for hundreds and hundreds of years society was dominated by men. Keten said: I assume by "sullied" it means "pure" and because Reia has more than 1 love, she is no longer pure? Well, as you mentioned, Reia's love for Yuriika was different than her love for whoever Kureha's father is, so I don't think it has to do with having more than one person she loved, especially because she loved them differently. I mean, it does, because Yuriika was jealous, but what I mean is that it doesn't have to do with being sullied or pure. Really, I think the whole pure/sullied thing (combined with the box metaphor) is described in those terms because it's indicative of Yuriika's upbringing and the values she internalized from the man who found and raised her. Asria_Y said: The principal definetely sent the letter expecting Lulu or Kureha to read it, not Ginko >:/. I'm kinda wondering if it was the Judgmens. The way they've been presented in the past couple episodes really leads me to think they may be up to something. okanagan said: Do you think it's reasonable to take the quote (and variations of it) as meaning something like "Keep trying. Even if you try and fail again and again, countless times, you will eventually succeed, simply due to chance."? On the one hand, it's empowering, and lauds persistence, which fits in with what the show has been saying about not giving up on love. On the other hand, though, it seems to say that it's not really anything particular on the part of the person trying (even persistence) that enabled them to succeed. They didn't succeed because of some special ability or inherent quality or virtue. They could have succeeded immediately. They're just unlucky that they haven't succeeded yet, and then got lucky later on because they didn't continue to fail. I wonder if it's a criticism of ideas of destiny and pre-ordained things. I feel like I'm stretching for this, but at the same time it also seems like it could make sense given all the stuff about Promise Kisses and fairy tales that seems to say that those kinds of destined or pre-ordained ideas about love aren't reality. |
SejinFeb 23, 2015 3:51 PM
Sejin said: CookingPriest said: Also more proof to my "the bear and human world we see is representation of Kureha's perception of reality warped by some event and the bear court is her subconscious in conflict with itself" I'm not saying I completely disagree with your interpretation of the bear court as Kureha's subconscious, as I think it makes a lot of sense for Kureha, but how does it explain the variation of instances in the bear court? Different bears go before the court for different reasons. At first it's just Ginko and Lulu on trial, and then we have Lulu, and later Yuriika, going before the court to be allowed to become human. By episode 4, Kureha doesn't know Lulu is a bear, and she still doesn't know Yuriika is a bear. It also doesn't seem to account for the court approving everything. Do you think the court could more generally represent the subconscious of the person or people who are going before it to get permission for something? That would explain why people/bears who Kureha doesn't know are bears are going before the court, and also why the court seems to approve everything (if a person's in conflict over something they feel very strongly about, they'll generally let themselves go in that direction). Something else I just thought of, but will have to go back and check to see if I'm remembering it correctly, is that (I think?) the court only happens when there's a major turning point for a character that requires them to make a big, life-changing choice (deciding whether or not to kill someone, leaving everything you ever knew behind to follow someone you just met on a long journey, deciding to "box up" your true self forever). And yet all of the cases of Judgemens so far has somthing to do with Kureha(even in Ginko's flashback it is about going to see Kureha and with Yuriika's case it has to do with Kureha's mother). We do not see trial for Lulu and her brother, after all. We do not know what parts of that perception means and what Kureha "knows" and what she has rejected(ex: she forgot Ginko). I am not saying we are seeing the world through Kureha's eyes. I am saying the world is colored by Kureha's perception of it(ex: Vanishing of Ethan Carter). What characters do, what we see etc, is how Kureha would see it. It also can be Kureha's perception LITERALLY reshaping reality because that was a big theme in Utena too. Everything that happens around her is shaped by her internal conflict(in form of one member of the judgemens always disagreeing and the other always agreeing). For all we know all that we see is as perceived by Ginko and Kureha while standing in front of the mirror upon that decision to paraphrase the storybook. And the moment Kureha resolves her conflict, that perception will change, changing reality and how the viewer sees it:  That scene is even more important because Kureha is daydreaming about things she could not possibly known |
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| Really liked this episode. It got really tense once they all got on the roof. I already liked this series from the beginning but now I'm really into it. |
| Sejin said: Do you think it's reasonable to take the quote (and variations of it) as meaning something like "Keep trying. Even if you try and fail again and again, countless times, you will eventually succeed, simply due to chance." On the one hand, it's empowering, and lauds persistence, which fits in with what the show has been saying about not giving up on love. On the other hand, though, it seems to say that it's not really anything particular on the part of the person trying (even persistence) that enabled them to succeed. They didn't succeed because of some special ability or inherent quality or virtue. They just got lucky. Agreed. I think it is a very common-sense thing. Success through persistence. Clearly this is some kind of Tsubaki family tradition. Based on its model, the Remington Model 7400, Kureha's hunting rifle, is at least 11 years old, since that is when they stopped making the Model 7400 in 2004. It was replaced with the slightly-improved Model 750 which looks exactly the same. So my point is that Kureha didn't buy that hunting rifle at Walmart. Almost certainly, some other family member bought it when Kureha was a little girl. Given her wealthy surroundings, it is inconceivable that Kureha would have bought an old used hunting rifle. Note also that the Tsubaki family flower crest was very carefully painted on it. So it isn't just some abandoned gun picked up on the battlefield. On the other hand, a converse philosophy is the Japanese proverb which translates roughly as "One Shot One Kill". The Japanese version is "ichigeki hissatsu" which is written in kanji as 一撃必殺. It comes up moderately often in anime series such as "Sabagebu!" (2014). Given Kureha's evident level of talent at firing her gun, she is lucky that she has a more practical family motto. The Tsubaki family lacks talent as warriors, but they keep shooting randomly anyways. Sejin said: I wonder if it's a criticism of ideas of destiny and preordained things. I feel like I'm stretching for this, but at the same time it also seems like it could make sense given all the stuff about Promise Kisses and fairy tales that seems to say that those kinds of destined or preordained ideas about love aren't reality. The more I watch this series, the more I realize that everything means something and nothing means nothing. This seems to be one of Ikuhara's axioms. It's like the "Chekhov's gun" dramatic principle that says that if, in a stage play, there is a gun hanging on the wall, it must be used at some point in the story. |
okanaganFeb 23, 2015 4:17 PM
| I'm honestly pretty ignorant when it comes to sexual stuff, and I don't know or use much slang in general, so I didn't even think of this until seeing it elsewhere. @CookingPriest: Good points, thanks! I'll have to give this some more thought. okanagan said: The more I watch this series, the more I realize that everything means something and nothing means nothing. This seems to be one of Ikuhara's axioms. It's like the "Chekhov's gun" dramatic principle that says that if, in a stage play, there is a gun hanging on the wall, it must be used at some point in the story. Yeah, that's been my general mentality for the entire show so far. The hard part is figuring out what stuff means. And I'm not well read at all, so a lot of stuff is probably going way over my head without me even realizing it. |
| Damn! how the hell am i supposed to wait another week after that cliffhanger!? |
| @Sejin: Yes, "box" does mean "vagina" in Japanese. So it really is possible that Ikuhara has this in mind. After some Googling, I found this blog from 2011: http://www.yomidr.yomiuri.co.jp/page.jsp?id=45451 Its title is "Michiko-san's Sex Cram School". Michiko-san the author is 84 years old. It includes the following very short paragraph which includes the word "box" along with the Japanese word for "box", "hako" (箱), along with 膣 which is a polite word meaning "vagina". 海外なら、箱（ＢＯＸ）など隠語クラス。 I have a box! そうだね！妙に納得。膣の事かな？ 箱には何を入れましょう？ I don't want to translate it. But there is no doubt at all that "box" means "vagina". |
okanaganFeb 23, 2015 5:20 PM
| Just noticed something strange - Yuriika's first flashback is "approximately 20 years ago" Kureha's birth is shown "17 years ago" - and Yuriika and Reia already look ~18-20 Something really does not add up, which lends more credence to my perception theory. |
|
| Yeah somehow I doubt we will ever agree to the message of the show due to different worldviews(or religion?) So I won't bother replying with argumentation that confirms my viewpoint(like the fact that Reia became invisible, confirming my reprogramming school idea, that it is not a term Yuriika invented, that Yuriika did not invent invisible storm and simply manipulated existing concept by manipulating the leader, etc). |
AhenshihaelFeb 23, 2015 6:27 PM
|
  Also, I totally agree with CookingPriest's perception theory. Never thought about it that way, so props for figuring it out! |
mwsmws22Feb 23, 2015 6:42 PM
Sejin said: In Yuriika's case, the man is shown as a woman because he's not that important to Yuriika. #misogyny But really, I think he's a drag or trans-man. |
surfboard_ said: Sejin said: In Yuriika's case, the man is shown as a woman because he's not that important to Yuriika. #misogyny But really, I think he's a drag or trans-man. Yeah, that's definitely possible, but it wasn't mentioned one way or the other in the episode, so I didn't think of it. Also, I don't appreciate you taking what I said completely out of context and using my misrepresented words to insult me. Go back and read what I wrote again. It's clearly in the vein of trying to figure out why there are no men (or at least no men shown as men, if the man in this episode is in drag and/or is trans) on the human side of the wall, and why the men that are shown are those particular men. |
| Wait, I saw a Yuri Kuma Arashi episode or a Utena episode? Because it feels so... familiar. It was a good episode, but I think my appreciation to the Ikuhara's works depends on what I think about the characters (mainly the girls), but I don't feel so worried about them like I did in Utena. Only a bit by Ginko, but she is no my favorite stalker girl and certainly not the revolutionary girl. I hope the final episodes change the situation :( |
 |
| Does this look like a hummingbird to anyone else? I know that the bird is an important symbol in this show, and that the more specific "yurikagome" is an extension of that symbol. The proportions of the bird in this picture make me think of a hummingbird, which would be really interesting in light of some of its symbolism and what that might say about Yuriika. For anyone who's interested, this is what I found about hummingbird symbolism: http://mara-gamiel.blogspot.com/2009/09/hummingbird-symbolism.html http://www.whats-your-sign.com/hummingbird-animal-totem.html http://www.universeofsymbolism.com/hummingbird-meaning.html |
Sejin said: Yeah, that's definitely possible, but it wasn't mentioned one way or the other in the episode, so I didn't think of it. I just supposed its a drag because of the heels fascination. But well, its not that uncommon to confuse a guy to a woman. Source: me. Sejin said: Theres no way you can read that phrase and not detect misogyny even if unintended or took out of context. The previous principal brought to Yuriika the very idea of the "box". More than that, she got his habit of boxing things to remain its purity (unsulied if we go by the subs). If he wasn't that important then why its suggested that she put his corpse on the box? (for me its more like a drawer but whatever) In the end, without the previous principal, Yuriika wouldn't know the feeling of love as well the fear of losing it, and met both again in a more intense case with Kureha's mom. Also, I don't appreciate you taking what I said completely out of context and using my misrepresented words to insult me. Go back and read what I wrote again. It's clearly in the vein of trying to figure out why there are no men (or at least no men shown as men, if the man in this episode is in drag and/or is trans) on the human side of the wall, and why the men that are shown are those particular men. As for the lack of masculine figures in the human side, it might be because we are seeing most things through Kureha's perspective and environment. But behind of it all, we're just under Ikuhara's perception of it, and you know about his huge fascination towards the female being. An no, what you said wasn't clearly in the "vein of trying to figure out..." as you quickly started to wonder why only the manly figures that appear are the ones really important to each character. Regarding "no men shown as men, if the man in this episode is in drag and/or is trans", we're in 2015, the "man" figure is literally in question and its anything but absolute right now. Not even the Court are exactly what you can call a "Man", following this perspective of masculinity Sejin said: I think its more like a metaphor than actually being it. There was no human in the trial so far and the court sessions weren't particularly hitting in anything specific to the patriarchal society (unless I overlook something). It could be more like what CookingPriest talks over and over about class S otakus, but I'm no sommelier on this to talk further.As far as the Judgmen go, the reason they're men (even if they represent womens' subconscious) could be because the values they judge people based on are from a patriarchal society, just because for hundreds and hundreds of years society was dominated by men. Hope I made myself clear with this (: |
| WHAT A FUCKING COP OUT. I HATE IT WHEN SHOWS DO THIS SHIT. RANDOM LOUD NOISE BLOCKING OUT THE MOST IMPORTANT WORDS. |
| Be sure to message me if you quoted me and want me to respond! Just give me a link to the forum, because usually I leave my comment, then leave the forum. |
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