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| THIS IS AN ANIME ONLY DISCUSSION POST. DO NOT DISCUSS THE MANGA BEYOND THIS EPISODE. ---------------------------------------- Episode 15 Dygenguar? What's that? I AM SANGER ZONVOLT! THE SWORD THAT SMITES EVIL! I think that sums up the basics of this episode. Ending seqence was an awesome troll. Looks like some SRX next ep. |
| Long suffering /m/subs translator http://msubsreleases.wordpress.com/ |
| No, but who cares? Awesome episode! Restricted only by the 20minute time slot they had to fit it in! Also, NEXT TIME! |
| This ep is too awesome for words. So much was EXACTLY from the game. (for anyone who hasn't noticed by now/hasn't played the PS2 version of this game, the music is directly taken from the game, it's not altered one bit.) Which is awesome because the game was awesome. I don't mind there being no To put that in would mean Vigagi would have to survive a blow from the Colossal Blade. Now the garbien goes the way of the type-0. Never mentioned again. |
sylvaneliteJan 14, 2011 3:02 PM
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| I could swear I heard a rimshot based on the cheesiness of the credits. As an interesting note with it though, Ibis was added on to your daily fare of fanservice. Didn't noticed any other character changes other than that last second joke, but I'm wondering it that signifies an increase in relevance (granted...with Princess Shine still in there...I doubt it). Cute episode. You know they had to get all the jokes in. Not a complaint though...more of a compliment. Vigagi has been the perfect combination of jokes/action. Strength seems to fluctuate based on the situation though (unlike the other inspectors, who all basically suck). Gets manhandled by Garbein, The pacing was alright. A little less focus on the characters more "normal" anime fans might not recognize Battles were fine for what they were conveying. As I said before, continuity in strength seemed to play a role in some weakness |
| Burkeism - Our president is more truculent than yours. |
| I don't see any real fluctuations in the strength. Note, neither Elzam nor Sleigh actually dealt any damage to Vigagi last time the fought. They knocked him around a bit, but didn't put so much as a dent in his mech. I see fluctuations in size, yes. They are very inconsistent with their sizes. But so far things have been pretty good strength-wise. |
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kirant said: Ibis was added on to your daily fare of fanservice. Didn't noticed any other character changes other than that last second joke Carla says hi |
sylvanelite said: I don't see any real fluctuations in the strength. Note, neither Elzam nor Sleigh actually dealt any damage to Vigagi last time the fought. They knocked him around a bit, but didn't put so much as a dent in his mech. Because of the lack of measurable evidence (and so much of it being how the person sees it), this'll come down reading what happens and would be very open to either interpretation. "Ratsel" easily could have landed more direct shots, as he did floor Vigagi by ramming him. Also note that he also would have been able to land several direct hits (undeflected hits were never shown, so the interpretation of damage dealt would be possible here) instead of firing out a bunch of smoke when the entire "hero" cast runs. What you're obviously seeing is that the deflections would have been pretty meaningless and that even direct impacts would be minimal damage. This would assume that deflecting the attack was done to keep a better position instead of preventing damage. What I'm reading is that the deflections actually prevented damage and that a direct hit would have been more serious. Both are possible though. slax said: kirant said: Ibis was added on to your daily fare of fanservice. Didn't noticed any other character changes other than that last second joke Carla says hi Hm...you're right. My bad. |
kirantJan 14, 2011 9:49 PM
| Burkeism - Our president is more truculent than yours. |
Because of the lack of measurable evidence (and so much of it being how the person sees it), this'll come down reading what happens and would be very open to either interpretation. "Ratsel" easily could have landed more direct shots, as he did floor Vigagi by ramming him. Also note that he also would have been able to land several direct hits (undeflected hits were never shown, so the interpretation of damage dealt would be possible here) instead of firing out a bunch of smoke when the entire "hero" cast runs. What you're obviously seeing is that the deflections would have been pretty meaningless and that even direct impacts would be minimal damage. This would assume that deflecting the attack was done to keep a better position instead of preventing damage. What I'm reading is that the deflections actually prevented damage and that a direct hit would have been more serious. Both are possible though. Have you played SRW games? Ratsel would run out of ammo before Vigagi died. Sure, Vivagi would never hit him, but he would certainly not be able to beat Vigagi alone. |
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| Wait, if Tatsumaki Zankantou wasn't used here, who will be the lucky guy to receive it ? and for the guys who didn't play the game: if you thought that the first eps were full of WTF moments prepare for real chaos. |
sylvanelite said: Have you played SRW games? Ratsel would run out of ammo before Vigagi died. Sure, Vivagi would never hit him, but he would certainly not be able to beat Vigagi alone. Fang Slasher was only 10 energy wasn't it? Assuming either that or a Sonic Breaker (obviously available) were available, it could be assumed that it IS possible to break him over time. Plus, given a non-HP regenerating boss, it would be possible to beat him as long as a non-ammo based weapon (See: Sonic Breaker) was available, although impractical by regular means (A common tactic for new players for Original Generation 1). Same goes with any relatively speedy real robot. |
| Burkeism - Our president is more truculent than yours. |
| LOLOLOLOL. Vivagi and the pile of books. BUSHIN SOUKOU DAIZENGAR ep 15. As expected, this ep didn't fail to amuse me. And No. It's not Lightning Blade.( That would be Raikou-Giri) He used his strongest technique "Unyou no Tachi" so at least call it 'Colossal Storm" or something. |
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Sentenal said: Zengar's Type-3 never actually deployed his Zankantou in its big mode, and fought him with just his little mode for some reason (at least while the Type-3 was using it). And then ended up getting ganged up on and lost his arms because of it. Ep 13  |
KaPe said: Sentenal said: Zengar's Type-3 never actually deployed his Zankantou in its big mode, and fought him with just his little mode for some reason (at least while the Type-3 was using it). And then ended up getting ganged up on and lost his arms because of it. Ep 13 Obviously I was referring to this episode, L2context |
Fang Slasher was only 10 energy wasn't it? Assuming either that or a Sonic Breaker (obviously available) were available, it could be assumed that it IS possible to break him over time. Plus, given a non-HP regenerating boss, it would be possible to beat him as long as a non-ammo based weapon (See: Sonic Breaker) was available, although impractical by regular means (A common tactic for new players for Original Generation 1). Same goes with any relatively speedy real robot. Made it bold it for you. Tesla Reich is a base, so naturally, he would gain health. Either way, it doesn't matter. I still can't see how the damage was so drastically inconsistent. |
sylvaneliteJan 17, 2011 1:28 AM
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sylvanelite said: I still can't see how the damage was so drastically inconsistent I never said it was damage. It was power. The uselessness of Type 3 seems a bit odd (especially since it did NOTHING compared to getting danced around by Garbein, which is more visually appealing if nothing else). Sorry if this doesn't make sense. I'm typing this before going out the door for lectures. EDIT - Here's a better description: - To me, Zengar looks like a load. While the Garbein could handle him on his own to stall, the Type 3 gets destroyed and couldn't even hold on without help. Every small battle seemed to end in defeat and did even less than the scratch damage Garbeing did. |
kirantJan 17, 2011 6:49 PM
| Burkeism - Our president is more truculent than yours. |
| LOL the troll ending sequence, reminds me off http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wz0nBQyWOsA Epic episode, packed full of action. |
- To me, Zengar looks like a load. While the Garbein could handle him on his own to stall, the Type 3 gets destroyed and couldn't even hold on without help. Every small battle seemed to end in defeat and did even less than the scratch damage Garbeing did. Were we watching the same episode? Elzam fought Vivagi alone. 1-1. Zanger fought Vivagi plus their entire army. Zanger was stopped because he had like 5 enemy mechs jump him all at once from 0 range, something that Elzam would have equally fallen victim to (for that matter, even the fastest most agile mech they have, Cybuster, fell the same way). You think that Trombe being grappled by 5 mechs would still manage to beat Vivagi? I honestly don't understand where your coming from. |
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sylvanelite said: - To me, Zengar looks like a load. While the Garbein could handle him on his own to stall, the Type 3 gets destroyed and couldn't even hold on without help. Every small battle seemed to end in defeat and did even less than the scratch damage Garbeing did. Were we watching the same episode? Elzam fought Vivagi alone. 1-1. Zanger fought Vivagi plus their entire army. Zanger was stopped because he had like 5 enemy mechs jump him all at once from 0 range, something that Elzam would have equally fallen victim to (for that matter, even the fastest most agile mech they have, Cybuster, fell the same way). You think that Trombe being grappled by 5 mechs would still manage to beat Vivagi? I honestly don't understand where your coming from. This is where we're extrapolating information and any number of interpretations can be considered right. The only reason I feel Masaki fell for it is because he stopped paying attention. Much of that episode, he seemed cocky and that led to that. An attentive pilot would have done just fine. |
| Burkeism - Our president is more truculent than yours. |
| Sorry i couldn't stop laughing with him shouting stupid names. This show really should try to keep some level of decency. I think it's not wise that they follow the game so closely that they don't consider how it will look in anime form. They should have thought more about making a good anime than just a game adaptation. This anime is currently a bit of a mess with every episode throwing a few new enemies, alliances, new mecha and staff like that. The plot is all over the place. Settle down already. A game has to throw enemies and new staff all the time so you will have things too shoot at and do. This is anime though not a game. |
Monad said: They should have thought more about making a good anime than just a game adaptation. This anime is currently a bit of a mess with every episode throwing a few new enemies, alliances, new mecha and staff like that. The plot is all over the place. Settle down already. A game has to throw enemies and new staff all the time so you will have things too shoot at and do. This is anime though not a game. They did take out many things from the game and believe me, all this mess will be needed in the coming episodes |
Sentenal said: Yes, I'm sure attentive pilots have x-ray vision too, and can see enemy mechs hiding underground ready to spring at the right moment. It was in reference to Masaki, who didn't actually manage to notice there was a series of enemies DROPPING RIGHT ABOVE HIM. Again though, I see this as a point where you can interpret multiple results, so if you're willing, we can agree to disagree. Monad said: Sorry i couldn't stop laughing with him shouting stupid names. This show really should try to keep some level of decency. I think it's not wise that they follow the game so closely that they don't consider how it will look in anime form. You'll just have to grin and bear it. I know not everybody is a fan of this form (though it is popular with "classic" Super Robot shows). Zengar borders on being insane and awesome at the same time (which is basically all his character has ever intended to be) and being so over the top you laugh at him/the writers (which is quite honestly how I feel about half the time with the guy). I can understand how he's gotten a major fanbase because in the game it works well. Some of the jokes were perfectly laid out. Monad said: They should have thought more about making a good anime than just a game adaptation. This anime is currently a bit of a mess with every episode throwing a few new enemies, alliances, new mecha and staff like that. The plot is all over the place. Settle down already. I completely agree. I think I said this a while ago, but this part transitions horribly. There is an insane amount of text to read through and, in a game, you've got the time to say it as you've got a captive audience who, at the end of the day, doesn't actually need to learn it and can instead play with a bunch of unknown characters doings things for an unknown reason if they choose to. With only about 8-9 hours of actual time in an anime to convey all of this in a medium where the story means more than in a game, something has to be done. I personally can't stand the idea of almost every episode having a dues ex machina saving somebody or something so far. Though I feel this is also a bit of a fanboy's anime and they're trying hard. Everybody has a favourite and will be disappointed if their favourite doesn't get a moment in the spotlight or does nothing. And it seems that they wanted to be nice to everyone by doing that to at least some degree. This eccentric planning makes it a very pretty poor show for new fans because of the shear number of characters and stories. |
| Burkeism - Our president is more truculent than yours. |
Monad said: Sorry i couldn't stop laughing with him shouting stupid names. Why are you laughing at a joke and then apologising? This was *exactly* the intended reaction. I think it's not wise that they follow the game so closely that they don't consider how it will look in anime form. ...? But you haven't played the games, so you wouldn't know either way, so why make statements based off ignorance? As Game_Master said, there is a significant amount of adaptation work going on. This episode is no exception, with a whole transformation/attack sequence removed and characters placed in for the sake of the viewer. They should have thought more about making a good anime than just a game adaptation. Ahh "should have" my two most loathed words. Why? Because 99.999999999....% of people who use them have no idea what they imply. How? How could this be made into more of an anime and less of a game adaptation (without simply making up a completely new script, ala Cybuster anime). Name to me who you would remove, and how this would improve the show, and we'll see if Obari really should call you up every week and take your opinion before airing the show. This anime is currently a bit of a mess with every episode throwing a few new enemies, alliances, new mecha and staff like that. The plot is all over the place. Settle down already. Again, Game_Master already said it, but it all gets cleared up pretty soon. Seeing the next time clips, there's really only two more important events before they get on with the job of en masse resolutions, so maybe 2-3 episodes I guess before they lay on the endgame. A game has to throw enemies and new staff all the time so you will have things too shoot at and do. This is anime though not a game. You should already know this is false. Divine Wars was a game adaptation and didn't suffer from these flaws. This anime is not a game, and so far, it is not even particularly close to the game at all. Sorry to say, but you've misdiagnosed this problem. "The problem" I can perhaps spread some light on. I do not believe it is a question of even fans of the game vs non-fans, because, as I can attest, non-fans of the game would have had just as much difficulty understanding the plot when they first played through the game as they would have when they watched the show. The plot comes together. It does. The show has yet to do anything that implies it wont. The difference between the game and the anime, is that people play the game in one large chunk. They don't play one mission, wait a week, and then play the next one. If I did that, there's no way I'd understand what was going on either. This show, simply put, should be watched relatively continuously from start to finish, not week-by-week. The director is putting in LOADS of material to remind the viewer of what's going on, but even with all that there is usually at least a fortnight between each arc, so people forget. It isn't a problem with being too close to the game, it is a problem with being watched too slowly, heck, I can't remember the specifics of what happened last week, so I rewatch it to jog my memory. Don't blame the director for the physical limitations of broadcast rights and human memory, he can't really do anything about that beyond what he already is. |
slax said: Ahh "should have" my two most loathed words. Mine are irregardless (c'mon...whoever uses this non-existent word is just being an idiot) and irony (because about half the time nobody uses them right). [/off topic venting] slax said: Why? Because 99.999999999....% of people who use them have no idea what they imply. How? How could this be made into more of an anime and less of a game adaptation (without simply making up a completely new script, ala Cybuster anime). Name to me who you would remove, and how this would improve the show, and we'll see if Obari really should call you up every week and take your opinion before airing the show. Not really my argument, but I personally don't think this show just makes itself very accessible by virtue of what it's doing. It's a show made for fans who are already very familiar with the story and has been proven time and time again with a lack of introduction to many characters and very sudden shifts between multiple arcs (which itself is an issue, as a game can hold multiple arcs well...including Archibald/The School, Tesla Institute, SRX ongoing Project, the Einst, and the Shadow Mirrors). I haven't seen very many animes do that, but is an integral part of an adaptation. To be quite honest, it's quite a conundrum for Obari. If you leave the story as is, you easily risk alienating anybody who can't keep track over the story over several weeks (which appears to be a good number of newer fans. A few people I've met have said the same thing). At the same time, if you alter it too much, you might make another Cybuster. slax said: The difference between the game and the anime, is that people play the game in one large chunk. They don't play one mission, wait a week, and then play the next one. If I did that, there's no way I'd understand what was going on either. I'm not sure this holds up. My first playthrough took the span of 4 months or so, probably averaging 1-2 missions a week after the first 10 or so in a week. I can't say as to the complexity of the show, because I now know the story, but I had not problem keeping up with the story in game. You have a point, as the "who the ---- is that?" sentiment vanishes a bit...but I can't remember a movie or example from another TV series where so many arcs combine nicely. There might be some...just tell me. It's just I can't recall any off the top of my head. |
| Burkeism - Our president is more truculent than yours. |
kirant said: To be quite honest, it's quite a conundrum for Obari. If you leave the story as is, you easily risk alienating anybody who can't keep track over the story over several weeks (which appears to be a good number of newer fans. A few people I've met have said the same thing). At the same time, if you alter it too much, you might make another Cybuster. This is why I said the words "should have" were misused. "Should have" implies it would be better if he did, and Cybuster <<<<<<< the other SRW shows, as per MAL's ranking. I'm not sure this holds up. My first playthrough took the span of 4 months or so, probably averaging 1-2 missions a week after the first 10 or so in a week. This is a good example supporting what I said, first, ignoring the fact that he played 10 missions in a week, and rounding down, that leaves 30 missions. At 2 per week, that finishes in 15 weeks, which is ~3&1/2 months. That's effectively playing the game twice as fast as the anime airs (which is 26 weeks, or 6 months). And he had no problem keeping up with the game. Which is as I said, progressing through this plot faster makes it easier to keep up with. |
| @Slax: Crappy pacing is still crappy pacing. It just means it's a piss poor adaption if they didn't factor that in. I have seen much more complex shows in weekly intervals that don't suffer the same problem. === Sangar doesn't smite evil, he smites the fourth wall. |
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