Final thoughts

I mean it's an isekai like most others, expecting something special from it is only shooting yourself in the foot. If you expect nothing, you are more inclined to be pleasantly surprised when a show has a decent vibe like this one did. I certainly enjoyed it and would be happy to see another season. There was a lot of wholesomeness in this one when addressing various topics that other series tend to turn into a mess - like having a slave, or being the sigma character that fights with the actual heroes without having to be shield hero crap. Family builders are always heartwarming.

Western watchers have gotten themselves too obsessed with the notion of seeing something "new" or "unique" or whatever, which is really just an illusion as originality isn't really a thing that exists, merely personal twists on existing ideas to make them flavoured in their own way. Anime, and stories in general, are far easier to appreciate if you don't go into them with a list of expectations and instead just let it's creator(s) show you what they wish to show you and form your impressions after you've experienced it.

@GenesisAria

I´m sorry, but there is so much here that I fundamentally disagree with.


I cannot speak for anybody else, but I at least expect a semi-decent experience, regardless if it is an isekai or not. Which was not the case here for me. And I do get what you are saying, setting your own expectations low. This is what I have been doing for everything since 2006. But that doesn´t mean I will just happily gobble up any slop that gets in front of me. Burnt food isn´t getting any tastier just because I imagine myself starving to death.


How exactly does this anime handle slavery any better than most other shows? At least in Shield Hero the MC had a (shitty) reason to insist on anyone getting close to him to become his slaves due to massive trust issues. What is the MC´s reaction towards slavery in this show? Not a “white-knightey” response or even just a neutral observation of facts. No, he just straight up states how he can use that to fill up one of his summoning slots. Wow, real wholesome. I guess his (very) selective memory loss included his basic sense of morality. He is essentially just one step away from that one show where the protagonist builds himself a sex slave harem. Not to mention the whole slavery bit is horribly implemented and unnecessary in this particular case. How did the elf chick even get sold into slavery in the first place if anyone who touches her goes up in flames? Makes no sense whatsoever. The ultimate outcome would have been the same if he had just found her in the forest because she got rejected by everyone due to her curse. He lifts the curse, she is grateful for that and decides to tag along with him. Doesn´t take this much of a rewrite and you would get rid of this annoying slavery narrative that so many LN writers push nowadays.


Most families I know don´t consist of one guy at the top with all women either adoring or being in love with him. Weird how the only other “male” in that arrangement is undead and in full-plate armour. Sounds more like a standard harem to me.



Let me make sth clear: I do not believe anybody expects any of these JP LN authors to reinvent the wheel. I do not believe that the majority of people want what you try to characterize as impossible. I believe the Cambridge Dictionary gives a good description of what “original” can also mean: “not the same as anything or anyone else and therefore special and interesting”. It is not about making up sth that is unheard of or never seen before. But rather to just take the same ingredients to then use a different recipe. Take the first anime release of the isekai-otome game-villainess variety (which is pretty done to death at this point as well). I wouldn´t say any of the elements on their own were “new” or “unique” (I hate that word, it lost all of its meaning like “epic”). But it´s the combination that made it special.

Look at the number of isekai anime we are getting in the 2020s compared to the 2010s. We are halfway done with this decade and the amount of released isekai anime easily surpassed that of the last one. Of course the pool of ideas is getting drier and drier if you release on average 5-7 isekai per season alone, especially since we get constant repeats of the same 5-ish stories peddled with the same standard isekai tropes. And we are not even counting the “pure” fantasy anime that go down the same tired OP MC route where the only difference is the initial “isekai-ing” which then doesn´t really matter for a bunch of shows anyway. I like the concept of isekai, but I hate what they do with it. And this is one of many such shows. Truly the only clear positive thing about this show for me is the easy title.

@NekoMikoBismarck It has been well over a year since i watched and wrote about this, my memory is not great, so i can't be specific at all.

I'm not gonna respond to moral posing for fiction, because it's ridiculous.

The villainess genre has been the most creative of the standardized subgenres yet. Every single one has a dramatically different direction from the last, and use it's counter-typical format to set up very unique character dynamics as well.

The issue with people trashing on series based on their premise and only point-form plot notes, is that, well, it's plain stupid. Stories are not a construct of data points in a plot graph, they are experiences. These stories are made by other people with their ideas and sensations, not yours. If it's not what you specifically want then go write your own.

Enjoying these series isn't "taking any slop that is given to me" or "eating burnt food". There's rarely much objectively flawed or broken about these anime. My perspective is much more in-line with the common japanese one, in which each art is of it's own value and is best treated in it's own respect, not as a hierarchy. People like yourself are just choosing to prescribe requirements to things, and define anything that doesn't fit those as "inferior" or "slop content". This is a distorted and self-damaging perspective. Not everyone is a fountain of brilliant ideas and execution thereof; and a creator myself i run into this all the time where most people that make things just don't have the ambitious ideas in the first place, and even if the do, have no idea how to execute them. You can't expect everything to be a Mushoku Tensei or a Frieren, that's preposterous (i think these types of highly regarded series are overrated anyway, they execute well, but they don't tell anything remarkable).

I won't respond further to a derailed topic, thank you.

@GenesisAria



Which I am completely fine with, it´s not like I can remember everything about the various shows I´ve watched either.



I am so very sorry that I find little appeal in the ever-growing number of LN writers implementing contentious subjects like slavery for fetishization purposes into their stories to cater to certain degenerates while at the same time see people say how wholesome or what a great guy the MC is for treating his slave girls so nicely. It´s not like I can´t handle these subjects. But if is as unneeded and poorly implemented as it is in this case, I am gonna call it out. If this makes me sound that ridiculous, then sue me I guess.



While I can agree largely with that statement, that doesn´t mean that every single one of them implements their ideas well. Being unique alone is not a redeeming quality in and of itself.



But I don´t go into these shows with largely preconceived notions of what I want them to be like, of course that would be stupid and self-centered. I have made mistakes in the past, prejudging shows, games etc., literally by their cover. And as it turns out, some of them became some of my favourite titles, even if they aren´t perfect or masterpieces or anything like that. I am willing to give most things a chance and go in with as open a mind as possible.

However, that doesn´t mean that I just set my expectations to zero or “just shut off my brain” (a sentiment that people express way too often). I find it ridiculous to think that we can´t have some reasonable expectations based off what gets initially presented to us. I can pretty much like just one certain aspect of a show to make it work for me to ignore the other bits if it is strong enough to carry me through the show.

Example (you don´t need to know anything about the show to get this, reading the title is enough):
The MC is a summoner. If you are even slightly familiar with fantasy or RPGs at all, you know that this is a backline supporter/(de)buffer role that needs their companions/summons to do the tanking/damage dealing (similar to the MC of Log Horizon). This sounded promising. Even if the show were to follow every other point on the standard isekai checklist, this could lead to more interesting character interactions and action sequences at the very least. But what happens within the first few episodes? MC just becomes a frontline brawler that can deal with any adversary on his own if he so chose to. To emphasize, is it that unreasonable to expect more than just slight nuances that go against the grain?

I agree these count as experiences. And like with any experience, there´s good ones and bad ones. Also, I am not very impressed by the fallacy “if you don´t like it, make it better”. I don’t have to be a masterchef or even know how to cook at all to tell you that the soup has too much salt in it.



Lots to unpack here.

“There's rarely much objectively flawed or broken about these anime.” To quote The Big Lebowski: “That’s just like, your opinion, man.” And I have mine as well.

Let me perhaps clarify it like this. If at the time of the completion of the Lord of the Rings trilogy, we so happened to get like a hundred copy cats within the timespan of ten years, all with a very similar format, story, characters etc. and they all happened to be very good seen on their own. You would still get very fed up with the constant repeats of similar concepts and themes. Even if they were all technically brilliantly produced in every aspect, which is not what we can say for the self-insert OP MC power fantasy (isekai) anime. We have gotten to the point where the whole isekai bit is literally just a checkmark on a list, where if you hadn´t been present for the first two minutes, you wouldn´t even know sometimes that the character is actually from another world. I call this lazy slop, yes.

It is very noble of you to see it the way the Japanese do (though I would want to know some stats how many actually hold that view in this way). But ultimately, this is not just a creative expression of their imagination, it is a product that in some way, shape or form you are expected to pay money for to be able to see it. As such, these shows are not above criticism, as nothing should be (even if it was offered up for free, though I wouldn´t be overly critical in that case then).

I do appreciate and already semi-acknowledged the fact that not everyone is able to create sth entirely new (I have that same problem, but in animation) or make a never-seen-before combination. And I don´t need that. Having one interesting aspect alone that is handled pretty well is all I need to keep my attention span going. I just see this way too scarcely in isekai.

Also, nice strawman you built, when did I ever say everything needs to hit the levels of “Frieren” or “Mushoku Tensei”? Especially the last one somewhat cracks me up, because I would say Mushoku is slop as well. Well disguised slop, but slop nonetheless. But it does have good moments for sure. And if we have gotten to the point where we can´t even acknowledge “Frieren” tells anything remarkable (I mean, fair, but, isn´t that also just our opinion) by sheer comparison on its own, then goodnight I suppose.



Suit yourself, easiest last words of my life then.

You should go learn psychology my friend. Most people have thoughts and interests about these kinds of things deep down, and having fiction to entertain it in a safe space is healthy. It's not "catering to degenerates", it's catering to normal human beings. If you actually spoke with the people making and consuming this content in it's country of origin instead of projecting stuff, you'd understand how they actually feel about it.

They enjoy writing such stories, because they're interesting and different from reality, and people enjoy reading them because they are curious, and have things that aren't in our(their) reality to think about. Anime SHOULD be disruptive and entertain touchy subjects from perspectives that lead to contemplation, if that is what the author feels like. It is freedom of expression, which japan has more of than the USA these days. Nobody in japan is going around trying to bring back slavery because it is shown positively in anime, they aren't that stupid. They entertain edgy fantasies in fiction because it's idealized there unlike reality, where it sucks. Stockholm fantasy is popular in the west for example.

Funfact: nobody actually cares.

'Nuff moral posing and trying to pat yourself on the back for being of some "correct" mentality, and just get back to watching anime (or don't). You either watched it all, and came here to project morality you don't actually believe, or you didn't watch and should refrain from complaining. If you don't like it, go somewhere else, cast your vote by not consuming the media.

The irony is i do this all the time. I look for shows with basic motifs or characters in their covers or trailers that draw me in and will make me smile. I watch them for simple reasons and then i discover oh neat it does some cool stuff, i like that. I judge them for appeal factors, or if i just feel like popcorn tv for a while (i knew approximately what vibes i'd get from this from it's promotion), not for whether they'll have xyz boxes i expect it to tick.

This would contradict my very frequent statements of how some of the most intelligent things in anime are actually hidden within the most unsuspecting of anime. I've watched the "sloppiest" (by your definition) of anime and found quite clever tricks in the storytelling or unexpected moments of philosophical wisdom that is seldom seen even in series that are more pretentious.
...It's not about "turning your brain off", it's about shutting your brain up and just letting the story tell you what it's about instead of trying to tell it what it's about before you even finished it. I think about what i watched, after i watched it, not before. I wait and see what it will present to me; the way you are meant to watch a show.

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irrelevant.

Expectations set.

Criticizing it for point form details according to prescribed expectation checklist and getting upset when it isn't what you hoped.

The lack of self-awareness is amazing.
...i'm not even gonna get into all of the hypocritical projecting, accusing me of fallacies i didn't commit while committing the fallacies you accuse of.

Guess what smart people do with anime? They don't care, they just enjoy it for what it is (or don't and move on) instead of comparing and complaining and getting annoyed for no reason.

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This is exactly what happened and continues to happen to this day. Almost every fantasy story is in some way based on LotR. Japanese fantasy had a branch off where the tabletop sphere created Record of Lodoss War and SwordWorld, so they branch off a little bit earlier, but everything is still copying sentiments of Tolkien. It's all the same recycled Tolkien-inspired tabletop fantasy ideas in essentially every piece of media.

Guess what? Oh this is a novel concept - what if many many many people actually do want familiar content? I very much enjoy watching countless slice of life anime that all do similar things every time, it makes me happy. Everything doesn't need to be revolutionary, and if you expected this anime to be unique, you're just setting yourself up for failure.

Some of the best anime ever made were "self-insert power fantasies". Gurren Lagann, Code Geass... Dragon Ball (Z etc) was unparallelled in popularity... Even Sailor Moon gets to levels that can surpass DBZ (even before that, she's a random girl that is empowered to make changes in her world - that's called power fantasy), Cardcaptor Sakura. I could go on and on about power fantasy media regardless of the protagonist's stature. Having token "weaknesses" which aren't real weaknesses, but more like Madoka hesitation syndrome, don't count as actual weaknesses, but merely character nuances to construct development.

It's not noble, i watch anime because my philosophy aligns with theirs. Western media grinds my gears because how backwards it is.

Why do i get the feeling that you define it slop because of it's fetishisms, power fantasy and such, rather than because of it's actual writing. Because to me, both of the mentioned series are on the same level, one just has horny and the other has a mentally retarded protagonist that thinks in slow motion. There's nothing wrong with these series.

By the way, this isn't about criticism or being above it. Complaining on a forum isn't submitting constructive critique to the author, it's just venting. You quoted and attacked me specifically. If you want to discuss what you think it could have done better, with like specific ideas, so that someone else might take advice, then that is productive.

I've seen it done better many times. External factors to the series made it disproportionately popular (same happened to SAO); similar to external factors made Re:Creators disproportionally underexposed.

. . .
I should uh, also mention that, do you even understand how anime studios do business? Havi you heard of the term "bottle episode"? It's a western broadcast television term for an episode of a weekly television program in which they produce it on a bottle budget, where they do as much as they can with essentially no budget to produce it. This allows them to allocate the resources saved on that episode to another one where they are more needed.
... Anime studios do this all the time, by producing and releasing an inexpensive 4koma or mediocrely performing isekai adaption, to save on money, so they can pool those resources into making other anime they really want to make with higher production quality. So all of these so-called "slop" series serve an important role, by giving a large audience the supplementary food thy desire, in order to give them a nice 4 or 5-star meal later.

ps: i only responded because part of it was actually about the anime, and i woke up bored. i filled in the gaps from previous, and leaving it closed.