I had a old fondness for Anime, but only recently got the chance to watch as much as I want when exams are not crushing my spine. I have yet to watch Strike Witches ... so be patient with me.
Back in ep.3 I said Gargantia gave me a strong vibe of Miyazaki with its theme of personal growth and assimilation (e.g. Kiki) mixed with retro sci-fi (Super Shounen Conan), even Miyazaki's favorite motives of azure sea and blue sky. And I am glad to stick to this view all along. This is just like a Miyazaki anime that got a bit more mature (so death for example can indeed happen) and this is great.
> If I had to put effort into anime seriously I would have to start by reading all the classic mangas and watch all the Classic animes over the years to get a grasp
I don't really think you need to do that. It is not as if you are trying to do anime history. Sure, knowing what classic anime/manga do can help you understand the context of why certain things are done or certain trend exists, but if you just want to get a glimpse of the current Japanese thinking, society and culture, not how they were back in 80s or 90s, it is perfectly ok to just watch the current anime. And it does not need a lot of serious study, just a bit of open-mindedness would do - for example, if you see something that goes against your cultural upbringing, try to understand that it may be a Japanese thing (like the hierarchy of senpai/kouhai, or how big a switch to addressing in first-name term is, or it is a big deal for confession and confession without kissing is common etc) instead of concluding something must be wrong for the characters to be so "stupid/retarded" for doing or minding those things. You can still be relaxed and enjoy the anime - in fact I would say by keeping such open-minded and inclusiveness it makes anime watching experience more enjoyable (complaining about things you don't understand or refuse to accept is much more stressful).
> But since I will never be a Japanese this is going to be handicap I will always have with me.
But handicap can vary in extent. At least compared to someone who has never seen any work from Japan you can say you understand an anime better, right? Why not inspire to continue this trend from when you knew zero thing about Japan to where you are now and so on? No one, unless he is born in a Japanese family or grew up in Japan, starts with good understanding of the Japanese theme. In order to understand a work better, or at least to reduce any misunderstanding, I am willing to put in the effort ( at least by not trying to pull in too much of my own background into the watching experience)
> Well Gargantia is not strictly an anime about Japan itself,
It does not matter. It is a product created by Japanese for Japanese. They may not call the new world as "Japan" and the characters may not look Japanese, but it is all a reflection of Japan and the people act and behave according to what the Japanese creators think. It is just like characters in an American superhero comics set in a foreign world would still act and talk like Americans, and reflect mindset or issues about America than what it tells about, say, Japan and a Japanese reader of such comics would do well to bear this in mind when he reads it.
> Science Fiction shows are much more universal in their themes and ideas, so in this case you need a bigger frame of reference here
Maybe, but don't you think that universal themes are much easier to find and notice, while noting the country-specific thinking requires more effort? This is why I said one needs to keep this kind of humbleness to learn in mind. It is so easy to associate what you see with your personal history or country background, and taking note of the universal theme may take a bit more effort, but a lot of the contents would have to do with the thinking coming from the creator's background, and this could be something that is easy to take note for its target audience, but for a foreigner one should make conscious effort to get. It is not like only literature about Japanese history, society or politics has theme or idea specific to Japan. Any creation by Japanese for Japanese would have such theme and idea, and often quite a lot too. One risks missing a lot of these points if they think that just because it is science fiction then it would only offer universal themes.
> In a sense you have to try to find similar stuff in your background in order digest some stuff from the anime you are watching, because besides what you see on screen you have nothing to give a bearing to what is happening but as in anything excess can hurt it somewhat.
I am not sure about others, but I consciously try to stick to one thing when I watch an anime - I try to keep a humble mind and want to learn from what I see. In particular, since anime is a product made by Japan for people in Japan, I want to learn about Japan, its customs and society, and any particular trait or pattern that may be unique to presentation via anime media. So when I watch an anime, I try not to associate too much of my cultural background or personal history in it but try to think of it in terms of the realm of anime itself and perhaps the anime fandom / Japan society in general if necessary. This is something that way too many western fans do not bother, either it is asking too much of them (about interest in Japan etc) or that self-important mentality of arrogance just prevents them from thinking interpreting an anime only from his upbringing and background will most likely miss a lot of the point.
> I am aware of what Bellows told Ledo, but maybe she is just telling her what she believes is true instead of what is true, in show I generally take only the words of the narrators to be definitive. ;)
Well, there is not really a narrator in Gargantia, and given that the main theme is Ledo learning things from people in Gargantia, the assumption should be that what those people told Ledo is message about the main theme, and thus should be taken at heart. The same applies to what Amy, her brother and the doctor told Ledo. Of course you may argue that perhaps they are all just their ideals not the reality, but I think this risks plunging the anime to a complexity that I don't think the anime is aiming at.
> For example how did Lukage get to get involved with the death cult, on what terms and why ? I really want to see that to know more about the world of Gargantia.
That is another aspect that seems to me is more for the convenience of the story (we need some people to die so as to teach Ledo about not killing people, and we need some people to make the rebellion convincing - let's make the two the same people then!) and so I do not really bother thinking too deep about it - there are not enough details to speculate anyway. If I have to speculate, perhaps the fact that Ledo wiped off so many people in the pirate fleet, they got subjugated by the cult easily without mounting a fight?
A bigger question to me is: Why Lukage and her people could escape the ritual of painting a mark on the forehead?? She even had the freedom (and trust) to go inside Pinion's testing room, tool room as well as guide him to his quarter.
> Still one my favorites for this year,
I have mixed feelings about this show, though positives outnumber negatives pretty much. I don't like rating or ranking shows, but just for this season I would put a few shows above it if I have to make a ranking. And I agree that 1 cour length is hurting -- there are quite a lot of things, from this Earth and Gargantia to the Galaxy Alliance and the giant Hideazu, that demand to be explored. Oh well.
I think in the anime world, the relationship between a salvage fleet and pirate fleet is not always enemies and confrontational. It seems to me there are certain rules and so even a fight does not end in physical violence, and this is even true when the pirates are winning. If anything goes and we let those "men want to have sex" thing to get into the picture, perhaps those pirates should just go on and rape every woman in the fleet. At the end I believe in what Bellow said about the key importance of threat and power show-off in such confrontation -- it is really something quite similar to fighting among monkeys: actual violence is rare, because threat and showoff of power is often sufficient.
The trade thing may or may not be there. As I don't think it is necessary to keep the pirates from raping.
> You should be more generous with people, after all must of us never set feet in a boat for any length of time, so we couldn't imagine 24/7 life in a boat other a strong image that we have seen such as a movie.
I guess I am more generous than many people when I think that people living in pirate fleet do not become beasts set out to rape girls on every fleet they raid.
> I have lived in boarding school for a few years
Yeah, I heard quite a lot of horror stories about boarding school when at university I met quite a few who attended such highschools. No wonder some once said that humanity as portrayed in "Lord of the Flies" is way too tame. But then that begs the question -- are those people too pessimistic, or too cynical? Is it all about humanity and human social structure? I once met an anime watcher who keeps on trashing characters who take part in fights in anime because from his experience anyone who went through that fight must develop PTSD to be credible. Now I take this as pulling too much of real world experience into the anime, and try to interpret the anime too much from his background and how such real world happenings should also happen in the anime. And I am seeing similar thing repeating itself in many places.
BTW, I am not saying that the story writer never intended to convey the possibility of rape in that scene. My take is that they leave the watchers to interpret it and if some choose to think that the next step has to be rape, there is nothing in the anime that says it is definitely not going to happen; on the other hand, if some think that it is just act of milder humiliation there is nothing in the anime that says those people are wrong either. My thinking is based on what I understand from Bellow's words explaining how the relationship with pirates and what the show of force/power/weapon is for, and apply it to this one scene that precisely involves the pirates, which leads to me to my conclusion, and I did it without relying or falling back on any movie/anime/manga/fiction I saw or read before.
> Let me ask you a question, did you watch Waterworld ?
That is why I mentioned Hollywood. And as I said, it is a sad thing that people get so influenced by that image of that world that they cannot think out of it.
> I am not trying to be overly dark and violent here, personally I get easily depressed and don't like ultra-violent animes with lots of gores so I am not imagining a rape scenario just for the purpose of wanting the anime to be dark.
I am not saying you are. Just that liking it and wanting it to happen is one thing, disliking it but cannot escape from thinking is another.
> Man are easily sexually excited by the image of nude women
Yeah, might as well argue that Somali pirates rape and Hook's pirates in Peter Pan rape too. The thing is this is all imposing our view of what pirates should behave in that anime world. I would rather think that the act is a threat that can go many stages before any actual rape is going to happen. This goes much better with the worldview as described by Bellow about how little real physical violence and killing needs to happen, not because of whether it is a waste but on social dynamic point of view (like what I said for fights among monkeys). I strongly object to the assumption that the next step of that act can only be rape.
> we are dealing with of people living in ships in a waterworld and people using violence to get their way I think it is inevitable.
But bear in mind what Bellow said when she said that it is the show of power and threat of violence that counts most, not the violence itself. I regard this as a very very important message Bellow is trying to convey to Ledo. Sadly, too many people forget about this and stick to the Hollywood type of image that gritty and bloody violence is always the case when the word "raid" and "pirates" pop up.
I rewatched that part and I still could not bring myself to view that it is a prelude to rape. Strip naked or public display of nudity, yes, but rape, don't think so. What I see is basically the pirates are portrayed as bad but not so bad people, starting from the head (who is a female), and the saying by Bellow that each side only uses just the necessary force, or even just the threat of it, to get its way. In this sense it is just like those fights in animal world, like the chimpanzee or gorilla, where the violence seldom leads to physical harm, and rape causes physical harm. I think I am in the camp of strongly resisting the idea that rape is an integral part of the pirates in this anime.
And I find the idea of "Also in Gargantia world women are probably in lesser number than men due to the difficulties of living in ships, so maybe the pirates don't have enough women for all the men." very speculative. Nowhere do we see evidence in the anime. If anything, we see a lot more female on speaking roles, including the head of the pirates. We should base our discussion on facts confirmed in the anime, not something we speculate based on what we perceive the world is like. Otherwise you are falling to the same trap as the person I argued bitterly with -- taking his assumption of how things should be like as fact (or probable fact) in the anime.
> this creates this culture of self-importance where people are playing critics instead of trying to enjoy anime. Over-analysis and profesional reviewing mindset is rampant,
Over-analysis maybe, but professional reviewing definitely not. Overusing and abusing cliche review terms like "incoherent" "pack full of tropes/cliches" "plot holes" (and using it the wrong way) is not professional reviewing, but pretension of it (and usually poorly done ones). But definitely too many are keen on playing such armchair critic role -- the western culture of self-importance is often highly irritating to me, to be honest.
> In a related note one anime that really managed to get me immersed and made me understand the story from the point of view of the character was SAO, so much so that every single thing that decried in blogs and forums as the show being dumb and silly felt natural to me as I put myself in the shoes of Kirito, in fact I really enjoyed that show.
I have my misgivings with SAO but what most people (at least in MAL) complains about the show are mostly nonsense because they either tried to act too smart (my idea of how the story should go is much better than the author, and I don't care about what the author tries to say) or just nitpicking for nitpicking's sake (I guess these people should have problem with all fantasy and sci-fi fictions and movie because there will always be things that do not make sense if you want to pick on it). My complaint is mainly on the directing and animation part. For the story there are flaws but that is mostly the constraints from the original LN, like its episodic structure in the early half of the Aingrind story or the abrupt jump of 2 years without showing how Asuna and Kirito got close (because it is not in the LN). As you say, if you can understand Kirito and Asuna as mainly sympathetic characters, you should be able to enjoy their adventures. The fact that sometimes the characters does not engage you to the same extent may have something to do with your sensibility but it may also be an issue with the directing and story writing, but taking a sarcastic or dismissive approach is a counterproductive way to "enjoy" an anime, and I am still puzzled by how many people like to approach an anime that way -- by mocking it they try to show they are more intelligent than all those staff so that they can bolster their own self-confidence?
> So Ledo killing 50 pirates about to rape Bellows and killed many member of her crew was bad, I can understand the argument of provoking a strong response from the pirate fleet, but somehow the fleet is ok with using 120mm cannons and machine guns which is way bloodier is ok. I don't feel that the show approached this question satisfactory.
Many people call that scene "about to rape Bellows". But I take the scene to mean that the pirates were publicly humiliating Bellows as a means of coercion, which does not necessarily mean their next step will be rape - it is much more likely that they will strip Bellows a bit more and in more humiliating way. For this, I even got into a nasty fight with a guy in MAL when he insisted that rapes must have been rampant in the pirate's fleet in the Gargantia world because all pirates in our real world rape - what kind of logic is this? Just because the same word is used does not mean the behavior of the pirates will be exactly the same as what is in our real world. And even in our real world, we have stories in which pirates don't seem to rape (Peter Pan) and real pirates like those in Somalia are not known to rape either.
But about your point, I would say that here the directing and story writing is at fault of not spending more time to portray Ledo's view about killing human. I know what the anime is trying to say, but still seeing Ledo killing without remorse a bunch of humans and then seeing a baby Hideaze (who may look cute but not really that human in appearance) in his long-dead "little brother" image and broke down is a bit stretching. We know he went through some transformation in his SoL days within Gargantia, getting in contact and talking to people, but still the switch looks too drastic and thus not so convincing.
> In a sense it makes Ledo rebellion against the Gallactic alliance just too easy because He is just refusing to obey to Striker who is nothing more than a Pilot Enlightment interface, it would have had much more weigh if Ledo had to actually face someone in authority, in the person of his captain
Well, at least when he made the decision to get into Chamber and fight, he was making the decision with the assumption he would be facing his superior (and a human). However, the message that would be left for the viewers is most likely to be the Human vs Machine/AI one, instead of the clash of different path of human society and evolution.
> This pretty much ruins the idea of a show about Coming of Age and facing difficult decisions in Life as we move from teen to idendepent adult, if the central decision of the story that is supposed to define Ledo was really meaningless
It turned out to be "meaningless" since Kugel had long been dead, but as I said I would at least give Ledo the credit for going to fight as he fully believed it was Kugel that he was going to fight, so that decision, and the feeling and thought that went behind this decision, is not truly meaningless -- at least as far as Ledo's own personal development is concerned. However, the impression left to the viewers could be different as the viewer would be required to take in all the sundry themes like rouge AI etc, which could mix up the message. The theme about "personal development to fit in a new environment by participating in productive work in it" is already muddled by all the other themes that this show tries to throw in as well. I guess this is a show that has bitten more than it could chew -- 1 cour is really a very limited space to explore too many themes.
Very happy that we share the same view about Origami. She is the minority's choice for favorite character but as I said those who like her often like her a lot :-) I think you've got it spot-on - she is both FUN and HOT. And I am glad that you also think that her being the "against side" is important. Tohka is always adorable but being the archetype of the innocent and nice girl in love can also makes her less fun to watch - the only really funny moment (I mean the fun I can get from Origami) is the seduction scene as Tohka listened to some very suspicious advice of how to get Shido to have a date with her.
> Suddently the idea of dating a female soldier is dangerous ;)
Yeah, especially if you are not a soldier yourself LOL
Speaking of Origami, I am sure you also read the Date A Live 2nd season news in the News Board. I've had some fun defending Origami there LOL
BTW, I always tried to imagine what Samurai Bride looks like but I never imagine it would be like having a jet propeller at the back and not much of any bride wedding dress LOL
All Comments (31) Comments
I don't really think you need to do that. It is not as if you are trying to do anime history. Sure, knowing what classic anime/manga do can help you understand the context of why certain things are done or certain trend exists, but if you just want to get a glimpse of the current Japanese thinking, society and culture, not how they were back in 80s or 90s, it is perfectly ok to just watch the current anime. And it does not need a lot of serious study, just a bit of open-mindedness would do - for example, if you see something that goes against your cultural upbringing, try to understand that it may be a Japanese thing (like the hierarchy of senpai/kouhai, or how big a switch to addressing in first-name term is, or it is a big deal for confession and confession without kissing is common etc) instead of concluding something must be wrong for the characters to be so "stupid/retarded" for doing or minding those things. You can still be relaxed and enjoy the anime - in fact I would say by keeping such open-minded and inclusiveness it makes anime watching experience more enjoyable (complaining about things you don't understand or refuse to accept is much more stressful).
But handicap can vary in extent. At least compared to someone who has never seen any work from Japan you can say you understand an anime better, right? Why not inspire to continue this trend from when you knew zero thing about Japan to where you are now and so on? No one, unless he is born in a Japanese family or grew up in Japan, starts with good understanding of the Japanese theme. In order to understand a work better, or at least to reduce any misunderstanding, I am willing to put in the effort ( at least by not trying to pull in too much of my own background into the watching experience)
It does not matter. It is a product created by Japanese for Japanese. They may not call the new world as "Japan" and the characters may not look Japanese, but it is all a reflection of Japan and the people act and behave according to what the Japanese creators think. It is just like characters in an American superhero comics set in a foreign world would still act and talk like Americans, and reflect mindset or issues about America than what it tells about, say, Japan and a Japanese reader of such comics would do well to bear this in mind when he reads it.
> Science Fiction shows are much more universal in their themes and ideas, so in this case you need a bigger frame of reference here
Maybe, but don't you think that universal themes are much easier to find and notice, while noting the country-specific thinking requires more effort? This is why I said one needs to keep this kind of humbleness to learn in mind. It is so easy to associate what you see with your personal history or country background, and taking note of the universal theme may take a bit more effort, but a lot of the contents would have to do with the thinking coming from the creator's background, and this could be something that is easy to take note for its target audience, but for a foreigner one should make conscious effort to get. It is not like only literature about Japanese history, society or politics has theme or idea specific to Japan. Any creation by Japanese for Japanese would have such theme and idea, and often quite a lot too. One risks missing a lot of these points if they think that just because it is science fiction then it would only offer universal themes.
I am not sure about others, but I consciously try to stick to one thing when I watch an anime - I try to keep a humble mind and want to learn from what I see. In particular, since anime is a product made by Japan for people in Japan, I want to learn about Japan, its customs and society, and any particular trait or pattern that may be unique to presentation via anime media. So when I watch an anime, I try not to associate too much of my cultural background or personal history in it but try to think of it in terms of the realm of anime itself and perhaps the anime fandom / Japan society in general if necessary. This is something that way too many western fans do not bother, either it is asking too much of them (about interest in Japan etc) or that self-important mentality of arrogance just prevents them from thinking interpreting an anime only from his upbringing and background will most likely miss a lot of the point.
> I am aware of what Bellows told Ledo, but maybe she is just telling her what she believes is true instead of what is true, in show I generally take only the words of the narrators to be definitive. ;)
Well, there is not really a narrator in Gargantia, and given that the main theme is Ledo learning things from people in Gargantia, the assumption should be that what those people told Ledo is message about the main theme, and thus should be taken at heart. The same applies to what Amy, her brother and the doctor told Ledo. Of course you may argue that perhaps they are all just their ideals not the reality, but I think this risks plunging the anime to a complexity that I don't think the anime is aiming at.
> For example how did Lukage get to get involved with the death cult, on what terms and why ? I really want to see that to know more about the world of Gargantia.
That is another aspect that seems to me is more for the convenience of the story (we need some people to die so as to teach Ledo about not killing people, and we need some people to make the rebellion convincing - let's make the two the same people then!) and so I do not really bother thinking too deep about it - there are not enough details to speculate anyway. If I have to speculate, perhaps the fact that Ledo wiped off so many people in the pirate fleet, they got subjugated by the cult easily without mounting a fight?
A bigger question to me is: Why Lukage and her people could escape the ritual of painting a mark on the forehead?? She even had the freedom (and trust) to go inside Pinion's testing room, tool room as well as guide him to his quarter.
> Still one my favorites for this year,
I have mixed feelings about this show, though positives outnumber negatives pretty much. I don't like rating or ranking shows, but just for this season I would put a few shows above it if I have to make a ranking. And I agree that 1 cour length is hurting -- there are quite a lot of things, from this Earth and Gargantia to the Galaxy Alliance and the giant Hideazu, that demand to be explored. Oh well.
The trade thing may or may not be there. As I don't think it is necessary to keep the pirates from raping.
> You should be more generous with people, after all must of us never set feet in a boat for any length of time, so we couldn't imagine 24/7 life in a boat other a strong image that we have seen such as a movie.
I guess I am more generous than many people when I think that people living in pirate fleet do not become beasts set out to rape girls on every fleet they raid.
> I have lived in boarding school for a few years
Yeah, I heard quite a lot of horror stories about boarding school when at university I met quite a few who attended such highschools. No wonder some once said that humanity as portrayed in "Lord of the Flies" is way too tame. But then that begs the question -- are those people too pessimistic, or too cynical? Is it all about humanity and human social structure? I once met an anime watcher who keeps on trashing characters who take part in fights in anime because from his experience anyone who went through that fight must develop PTSD to be credible. Now I take this as pulling too much of real world experience into the anime, and try to interpret the anime too much from his background and how such real world happenings should also happen in the anime. And I am seeing similar thing repeating itself in many places.
That is why I mentioned Hollywood. And as I said, it is a sad thing that people get so influenced by that image of that world that they cannot think out of it.
> I am not trying to be overly dark and violent here, personally I get easily depressed and don't like ultra-violent animes with lots of gores so I am not imagining a rape scenario just for the purpose of wanting the anime to be dark.
I am not saying you are. Just that liking it and wanting it to happen is one thing, disliking it but cannot escape from thinking is another.
Yeah, might as well argue that Somali pirates rape and Hook's pirates in Peter Pan rape too. The thing is this is all imposing our view of what pirates should behave in that anime world. I would rather think that the act is a threat that can go many stages before any actual rape is going to happen. This goes much better with the worldview as described by Bellow about how little real physical violence and killing needs to happen, not because of whether it is a waste but on social dynamic point of view (like what I said for fights among monkeys). I strongly object to the assumption that the next step of that act can only be rape.
> we are dealing with of people living in ships in a waterworld and people using violence to get their way I think it is inevitable.
But bear in mind what Bellow said when she said that it is the show of power and threat of violence that counts most, not the violence itself. I regard this as a very very important message Bellow is trying to convey to Ledo. Sadly, too many people forget about this and stick to the Hollywood type of image that gritty and bloody violence is always the case when the word "raid" and "pirates" pop up.
And I find the idea of "Also in Gargantia world women are probably in lesser number than men due to the difficulties of living in ships, so maybe the pirates don't have enough women for all the men." very speculative. Nowhere do we see evidence in the anime. If anything, we see a lot more female on speaking roles, including the head of the pirates. We should base our discussion on facts confirmed in the anime, not something we speculate based on what we perceive the world is like. Otherwise you are falling to the same trap as the person I argued bitterly with -- taking his assumption of how things should be like as fact (or probable fact) in the anime.
> this creates this culture of self-importance where people are playing critics instead of trying to enjoy anime. Over-analysis and profesional reviewing mindset is rampant,
Over-analysis maybe, but professional reviewing definitely not. Overusing and abusing cliche review terms like "incoherent" "pack full of tropes/cliches" "plot holes" (and using it the wrong way) is not professional reviewing, but pretension of it (and usually poorly done ones). But definitely too many are keen on playing such armchair critic role -- the western culture of self-importance is often highly irritating to me, to be honest.
I have my misgivings with SAO but what most people (at least in MAL) complains about the show are mostly nonsense because they either tried to act too smart (my idea of how the story should go is much better than the author, and I don't care about what the author tries to say) or just nitpicking for nitpicking's sake (I guess these people should have problem with all fantasy and sci-fi fictions and movie because there will always be things that do not make sense if you want to pick on it). My complaint is mainly on the directing and animation part. For the story there are flaws but that is mostly the constraints from the original LN, like its episodic structure in the early half of the Aingrind story or the abrupt jump of 2 years without showing how Asuna and Kirito got close (because it is not in the LN). As you say, if you can understand Kirito and Asuna as mainly sympathetic characters, you should be able to enjoy their adventures. The fact that sometimes the characters does not engage you to the same extent may have something to do with your sensibility but it may also be an issue with the directing and story writing, but taking a sarcastic or dismissive approach is a counterproductive way to "enjoy" an anime, and I am still puzzled by how many people like to approach an anime that way -- by mocking it they try to show they are more intelligent than all those staff so that they can bolster their own self-confidence?
> So Ledo killing 50 pirates about to rape Bellows and killed many member of her crew was bad, I can understand the argument of provoking a strong response from the pirate fleet, but somehow the fleet is ok with using 120mm cannons and machine guns which is way bloodier is ok. I don't feel that the show approached this question satisfactory.
Many people call that scene "about to rape Bellows". But I take the scene to mean that the pirates were publicly humiliating Bellows as a means of coercion, which does not necessarily mean their next step will be rape - it is much more likely that they will strip Bellows a bit more and in more humiliating way. For this, I even got into a nasty fight with a guy in MAL when he insisted that rapes must have been rampant in the pirate's fleet in the Gargantia world because all pirates in our real world rape - what kind of logic is this? Just because the same word is used does not mean the behavior of the pirates will be exactly the same as what is in our real world. And even in our real world, we have stories in which pirates don't seem to rape (Peter Pan) and real pirates like those in Somalia are not known to rape either.
But about your point, I would say that here the directing and story writing is at fault of not spending more time to portray Ledo's view about killing human. I know what the anime is trying to say, but still seeing Ledo killing without remorse a bunch of humans and then seeing a baby Hideaze (who may look cute but not really that human in appearance) in his long-dead "little brother" image and broke down is a bit stretching. We know he went through some transformation in his SoL days within Gargantia, getting in contact and talking to people, but still the switch looks too drastic and thus not so convincing.
Well, at least when he made the decision to get into Chamber and fight, he was making the decision with the assumption he would be facing his superior (and a human). However, the message that would be left for the viewers is most likely to be the Human vs Machine/AI one, instead of the clash of different path of human society and evolution.
> This pretty much ruins the idea of a show about Coming of Age and facing difficult decisions in Life as we move from teen to idendepent adult, if the central decision of the story that is supposed to define Ledo was really meaningless
It turned out to be "meaningless" since Kugel had long been dead, but as I said I would at least give Ledo the credit for going to fight as he fully believed it was Kugel that he was going to fight, so that decision, and the feeling and thought that went behind this decision, is not truly meaningless -- at least as far as Ledo's own personal development is concerned. However, the impression left to the viewers could be different as the viewer would be required to take in all the sundry themes like rouge AI etc, which could mix up the message. The theme about "personal development to fit in a new environment by participating in productive work in it" is already muddled by all the other themes that this show tries to throw in as well. I guess this is a show that has bitten more than it could chew -- 1 cour is really a very limited space to explore too many themes.
Yeah, especially if you are not a soldier yourself LOL
Speaking of Origami, I am sure you also read the Date A Live 2nd season news in the News Board. I've had some fun defending Origami there LOL
BTW, I always tried to imagine what Samurai Bride looks like but I never imagine it would be like having a jet propeller at the back and not much of any bride wedding dress LOL