| This is good news because I didn t watch movie. Because Lelouch is dead I am not interest code geass without lelouch being alive. Hopefully CG appear in future with Lelouch alive. |
LelouchviBritMER said: All of this overwhelmingly shows that canonically there is zero wiggle room for Lelouch to have a code. just as they officially confirmed. And the new movie even confirms this. I've explained this in the other topic, but that is not accurate. |
GolbeztheGreatApr 24, 2019 10:11 PM
and there goes the alive vs dead Lelouch debate rising again |
LelouchviBritMER said: As i explained in the other topic, your conclusion is entirely wrong and in contradiction with what the movie explicitly shows us! So pelase, stop spreading these misinformed falsehoods! The movie very clearly contradicts everything you said. I think this is a case of the pot calling the kettle black, on your part, yet that's already enough. The original Code theory was wrong, I've said so, because Lelouch did stay dead in the TV version. However, I think your interpretation of the movie is also not too accurate either. I'll keep my answers to the other topic, for the sake of not being redundant and having to type the same thing all over again. There's no need to derail every single conversation on the forum with talk of this one aspect. |
GolbeztheGreatApr 24, 2019 10:40 PM
I swear man, people can't treat anything separately. It's like nobody wants a win-win scenario XD |
KreatorX said: I swear man, people can't treat anything separately. It's like nobody wants a win-win scenario XD ye there is like 2 different timelines already here and its more likely they will follow this new movie series timeline to continue the Code Geass story anyway |
alchimique said: Heyo! I'm the same Alchimique that posted on twitter/youtube/tumblr on this topic. I attended SakuraCon but also watched this movie 3 times while in Japan. I haven't read through all the comments here but basically: The TV show is its own thing. That's self-contained and they did leave R2 in a way that is handy for people to speculate about (though they confirmed in multiple places that Lelouch is dead). That hasn't changed. Re;surrection is a continuation of the recap trilogy and there is something in it that is very different from the TV series. This makes Re;surrection an "alternate route" and my understanding is that the new projects will stem off of this route while leaving the original TV show the same. It was said prior to the 10 years project announcement that this separation between show and movie can make fans of only the original show happy and I agree with that. Thanks for your words. You're right, there were various official mentions about Lelouch's death, but there were also various ambiguity-leaning official answers such as during previous anime conventions and in one of the light novels, yet I feel it's no longer important to have these old heated arguments now that things are becoming clearer thanks to the explicit distinction between the movie and the TV series in this regard. Given that you've seen the movie multiple times and more recently, I believe you could help us with one issue. |
GolbeztheGreatApr 26, 2019 1:10 AM
alchimique said: @GolbeztheGreat You're welcome. And I agree. There's no need for the old debates (Code Theory, etc) since the movie makes intentions and actions clear and is also clearly separate from the TV series. I'm new to talking in these topics (as you can see from post count lol) so I hope to do this right without revealing spoilers: Thank you for your explanation. I think it's pretty clear too. Don't worry about post counts, that shouldn't matter. |
LelouchviBritMER said: It's also irrelevant. The source does not matter, the results do. If I have the flu and pass it to you, but in transmission it morphs into a common cold, then you have the common cold and not the flu. My point is we should accept that it has morphed into something else, but it still began as the flu. What you've been saying up to this point includes denying that both shared the same source. Furthermore, there are still open questions regarding certain properties that weren't tested during the movie. |
alchimique said: Heyo! I'm the same Alchimique that posted on twitter/youtube/tumblr on this topic. I attended SakuraCon but also watched this movie 3 times while in Japan (I don't think I left a review on it because I don't write reviews on MAL and did all my talking about it via Discord. I do have a summary post on Tumblr via the CodeTrainwreck blog though. Which is full of spoilers). I haven't read through all the comments here but basically: The TV show is its own thing. That's self-contained and they did leave R2 in a way that is handy for people to speculate about (though they confirmed in multiple places that Lelouch is dead, meant to die, etc.). That hasn't changed. Re;surrection is a continuation of the recap trilogy and there is something in it that is very different from the TV series. This makes Re;surrection an "alternate route" and my understanding is that the new projects will stem off of this route while leaving the original TV show the same. It was said prior to the 10 years project announcement that this separation between show and movie can make fans of only the original show happy and I agree with that. just as i suspected with my earlier comment here on this thread deg said: ye there is like 2 different timelines already here and its more likely they will follow this new movie series timeline to continue the Code Geass story anyway and thanks for sharing all this information across the internet madam |
degApr 26, 2019 3:29 AM
No, not at all. I am quoting your words bellow. Not every property needs to be tested. If we know something has wings and lays eggs we know enough to know it's not a cat, even if we didn't test if it can meow It does, if we are to make any accurate statements about what those properties are. Birds and cats are two entirely different animals. A better comparison would be two related yet still distinct cat species. |
GolbeztheGreatApr 26, 2019 3:57 AM
LelouchviBritMER said: OMG dude Are you doing this on purpose? You quoted me saying that Lelouch did not get the code from Charles, and yes he did not get the CODE from Charles because he did not get a CODE. That's not the same as saying that Charles wasn't involved in some way. my god, i've explained this to you before. Do my words just bounce off you? You keep twisting and misrepresenting everything I say. I'm seriously starting to doubt you're interested in a sincere conversation and are just here to mess with people. At this point, I think it's evident who is lacking good faith here. That would be yourself. Like alchimique said, it will be better when even more people see the movie. I think they'll be able to understand what happened. I am interested in having many other conversations about this show. You only seem to ever talk about the same topic and nothing else. |
GolbeztheGreatApr 26, 2019 10:44 AM
LelouchviBritMER said: No dude, you're disingenuous, you constantly twist my words, pretend I said things which I didn't, constantly ignore what I explained, etc. Disagreement is allowed. You're not preaching the universal truth of a gospel here. Ironically enough, you're accusing others of behavior that you've previously displayed. How dare I talk about the topic we were talking about?? I wasn't thinking about just now or what you're telling me. Look around. In multiple threads involving other topics and different people, this is all you talk about. |
LelouchviBritMER said: It's important to note that "leaving it open for interpretation" merely means people are free to have their own headcanons. Headcanons are NOT canon. Canonically Lelouch is officially confirmed dead by Okouchi and Taniguchi themselves. They explained that Lelouch chose death as punishment for his sins. They explained that Lelouch's death was essential for their sense of ethics. They explained that the decision to kill off Lelouch was made unanimously and was taken before the writing had even started. They even confirmed this canonical death of Lelouch in the official guide book and in 2009 they made a new epilogue, replacing the cart driver scene, where C.C. talks directly to the audience and explains that Lelouch is dead and that she mourns his death. it's also worth noting that the anime istelf forbade Lelouch getting the code as that would have violated the rule sthe anime itself had established. It was made clear that everyone loses the geass when they get the code (happened in 100% of all shown examples, and it was explicitly confirmed through Charles' words), and Lelouch never lost his geass. So while people have the freedom to make any headcanon they want, canonically there is no doubt he was truly dead and didn't have the code. All pf this information, together with sources, links and pictures, can be found in the Code Geass Community Information Database Some notable examples: - "For those two who bear the heavy sin known as killing their fathers, they share the belief that they can forgive each other by imposing the greatest punishments on themselves. Death for Lelouch who wishes for a tomorrow with his sister, life for Suzaku who wishes to atone for his sins through death." - "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that the end of Lelouch will be death." - ""This man called Lelouch will pay for his sins by his death. The story follows him till he finally make this decision." And so on, there are many many many other examples. It's even interesting to note that the show staff have explicitly denied corner point arguments of code theory. They denied that codes needed to be activated: they explained that Charles was already immune to geass and immortal BEFORE he shot himself, they even said he never died and was just messing with Lelouch They denied that Nunnally saw any visions or memories: they explained that she figured the Zero Requiem out on her own, no codes or geasses involved. She has been shown to have the ability to know the truth when she touches someone. All of this overwhelmingly shows that canonically there is zero wiggle room for Lelouch to have a code. just as they officially confirmed. And the new movie even confirms this. I disagree. If it's open then nothing is confirmed 100% canon, hence what's the point of it being open ending? |
LelouchviBritMER said: BestBoiEren said: I disagree. If it's open then nothing is confirmed 100% canon, hence what's the point of it being open ending? It's not open at all. It is EXTREMELY EXPLICITLY confirmed by the show staff he is totally dead. Did you not read anything I posted? How can you say it's open with all the examples of official statements I gave? That's just willful ignorance. I'll post some examples again so you can READ them this time. So don't pretend it's open. That's just a LIE. All of this information, together with sources, links and pictures, can be found in the Code Geass Community Information Database Here's what they said during "Geass memories" which celebrated the 10 year anniversary of the show: - "Before I started writing the story of a person called Lelouch, I confirmed with Taniguchi-director something. That thing was that the end of Lelouch will be death." - "This man called Lelouch will pay for his sins by his death. The story follows him till he finally make this decision." -"Probably this Lelouch we see in the first episode of the series wouldn't choose death. He would try something to avoid it. He couldn't [b]die[/b], for Nunnally as well. But we see him changed in the last episode." -"At least he is aware of his sins and pays for them with his death." Here's what they wrote in the official guide book of the show: - "For those two who bear the heavy sin known as killing their fathers, they share the belief that they can forgive each other by imposing the greatest punishments on themselves. Death for Lelouch who wishes for a tomorrow with his sister, life for Suzaku who wishes to atone for his sins through death." In 2009 they dropped the cart scene which was misunderstood by code theorists and made a brand new one where C.C. directly addressed the audience and explicitly explained to us that Lelouch was dead and that she mourned his death. You can watch the new epilogue here Here are her words: "A young man dies. He had the power to change the world, to create a new order. The world feared him, hated him. But, I know he died with a smile on his face. Only those who have realised their dream will truly understand that feeling of utter contentment. So, this is not a tragedy. And whenever I feel sad or cry at night, I sing a song. A song of man's making. Zero Requiem!" Here's an example from their interview in Continue Vol.42: "Lelouch says in the first episode: "Only those prepared to be shot are allowed to pull the trigger themselves." If you were to think of that as his pride, then I think his getting shot (killed) in the end was a logical end." Here they officially contradicted code theory's fundamental points: They deny that codes need to be activated by explaining that Charles was already immortal and immune to geass, i.e. has the code, BEFORE he shot himself, proving that the idea of activating codes is wrong: ใใใใฎใขในๆใใฃใฆใชใใฎใซๆญปใใ ใตใใใใใ ใใใๆฏๅญใ้ฉใใใใใจใใใซใซใผใทใฅใใใใใใใใใใใไธ็ชใทใงใใฏใชใฟใคใใณใฐ่จใฃใฆใใใญใใ็ตถๅฏพ็ฌใใใใใฆใใใใฃใฆ่ฒใ ่จใใใฆใฆ็ฌใฃใใ "He isn't geassed, just pretends he dies!" " He tries to surprise his son!" "Poor Lelouch" "He tries to choose the most shocking timing, doesn't he" "I'm sure he tries hard not to laugh" They also denied that Nunnally saw visions or code memories, Nunnally figured out Lelouch's plan on her own: "How did Nunnally managed to realize Lelouch true intention, when she touched his hand at the end?" "The way Nunnally can tell that someone is lying, just like she was able to tell that Lohmeyer was lying to her, is that she can feel the hand of the person she is talking to is sweating or lightly trembling. It's nothing like Geass or some special ability like that." "Yes. So, she simply came to conclusion [Lelouch was lying] by herself, because of this ability." "She is Marianne's daughter and Lelouch's little sister. Two months have passed since that defeat of Schneizel and for this two months she's been wondering constantly about what had happened, like "why it happened?" and so on. So when she touched Lelouch's hand at the end she felt that he is calm, she put the two and two together and realized the truth. Of course, we know that in anime, it's hard to explain things like that, but yeah, please accept it like this kind of romantic idea we had." There are many many many more examples, but this post is getting long. All of this overwhelmingly shows that canonically there is zero wiggle room for Lelouch to have a code. just as they officially confirmed. And the new movie even confirms this. So don't pretend they didn't repeat a million times that Lelouch was truly dead. Against such vast amount of evidence, pretending that it was "open" is dishonest, wilfully ignorant and just plain stupid. All of this information, together with sources, links and pictures, can be found in the Code Geass Community Information Database First of all, only the writer said he is dead, the director of the show didn't say anything, and usually they a bigger influence on the story. You can write as much as you want, IMO he is alive, and you can't convince me otherwise If they 100% wanted lelouch dead they wouldn't put in a scene like that at the end. |
LelouchviBritMER said: BestBoiEren said: First of all, only the writer said he is dead, the director of the show didn't say anything, and usually they a bigger influence on the story. And that's not true. Director taniguchi contradicted code Theory's assumptions about code activation. And he also confirmed that Lelouch was truly dead in his conversation with writer Okouchi. that was told to us during the anniversary "Geass memories" Please do your homework before spouting lies. I have given you all the links you need. BestBoiEren said: You can write as much as you want, IMO he is alive, and you can't convince me otherwise So the people who made the show hammering over and over and over and over and over again that he's truly dead and even going as far as debunking the core points of code theory don't convince you? The anime making it crystal clear that it is impossible for Lelouch to have a code isn't enough for you? That's delusional! How can you be willfully blind to the MASSIVE mountain of proof and official statements that he's really dead? Even the new movie confirms he was totally dead and not immortal!! That's like flat earthers who keep pretending the earth is flat despite all the evidence saying it's not. The code conspiracy theory was fully debunked by the anime itself! BestBoiEren said: If they 100% wanted lelouch dead they wouldn't put in a scene like that at the end. The cart scene? Do you not understand the meaning of that? It's showing us C.C. has made peace with the death of Lelouch and that she has embraced the future. She even says she now knows her power won't lead to loneliness. And if that's not enough, the show staff even dropped that epilogue after some people misunderstood it, replacing it an extremely unsubtle explanation of C.C. directly explaining to the audience that lelouch is totally dead. C.C. is talking to us and saying he's truly dead and that she's mourning Have you not seen it yet? Are you afraid of watching it? I've linked it many times already. CLICK THAT LINK and see for yourself!! Don't bother replying here until you've seen that new epilogue. Lelouch is dead because: - the anime makes it IMPOSSIBLE for him to have a code - code theory is fully debunked as being nothing more than a hoax with false arguments - the show staff have said a million times he's dead. - even in the new movie C.C. explicitly explains that Lelouch was a corpse until she reconstructed his corpse. You can keep going if you want, but as I said, I won't change my mind on this. |
| I personally hope we get a couple new console games that isn't Super Robot Wars. As for actual material the ending to the movie hinted at some sort of sequel involving Lelouch and CC hunting for the geass shards. This feels like it would be more like a TV series than an OVA series. The only question is when they will make it? Maybe 20 year anniversary lol? Some more picture dramas or manga centering around other supporting characters like Nunnally would be more welcomed too. As much as I love CC, Kallen, and Suzaku there are plenty more supporting characters I find a lot more interesting. Like put them in the spotlight and make Lelouch,CC, Suzaku, and Kallen supporting characters for a change |
"What has two arms, two legs, and is alive? Not your favorite character lol! xD" |
changelog said: Roloko said: I personally hope we get a couple new console games that isn't Super Robot Wars. As for actual material the ending to the movie hinted at some sort of sequel involving Lelouch and CC hunting for the geass shards. This feels like it would be more like a TV series than an OVA series. The only question is when they will make it? Maybe 20 year anniversary lol? Some more picture dramas or manga centering around other supporting characters like Nunnally would be more welcomed too. As much as I love CC, Kallen, and Suzaku there are plenty more supporting characters I find a lot more interesting. Like put them in the spotlight and make Lelouch,CC, Suzaku, and Kallen supporting characters for a change I would like more Shirley content tbh if it was the 20th anniversary it would be pretty hilarious. and i am all for games. i downloaded the ds ones and they are abysmal. a 3d knightmare game for the ps4 or switch would be pretty awesome. I would honestly like some more Charles and V.V content from when they were children up until the events of Marianne's "death". Or geass cult stuff so we can see more Mao, Rolo, and characters from Oz cause most of them were from the geass cult too. ugh there is so much characters and stuff to explore in the world of geass, but they focus too much on AUs like Lelouch as a store clerk or putting together a band. I mean these manga are not bad, but I want more stuff that could be considered canon to the main story. |
"What has two arms, two legs, and is alive? Not your favorite character lol! xD" |
| Yeah milk the shit out of it until it's dry. |
| UMM SOMEONE EXPLAIN THE ENDING |
 |
LelouchviBritMER said: Lelouch is dead and not immortal. There is no doubt about that. the anime says so, the show staff say so. It's 2020, the movie is out and Lelouch is confirmed alive and well. LMAO thanks for making my day with your laughable BS. It was also completely obvious by the fact they retconned the first series with the movie trilogy and then announced a sequel, and by this movie title. |
PKXJul 10, 2020 5:22 AM
| Humans are suspicious and jealous creatures. When they see something perfect, they wanna find a flaw. Ratohnhaketon said: You have much to learn if you have not joined the witch hunt to down vote every anime that rises above our underrated favorites. I am currently on a campaign to get Training with Hinako into the top 12. Shit taste is hard to fight though, it's like trying to talk sense to an army of hallucinating loonies. Ty-Ki said: It's hilarious to see morons wasting more time with the series they hate so much than the fans of it. |
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