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| Another solid episode and I just replayed Kurugaya route in the VN and thought the anime did a better job of the ending. |
| Not surprised about that all those strange stuff is just a dream but I'm want to know what happen to Kurugaya |
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Midou89 said: Another solid episode and I just replayed Kurugaya route in the VN and thought the anime did a better job of the ending. For the overall route and buildup, I liked the anime's comedy, and its ending. I wish there was more development for Kurugaya to make the ending more heartbreaking. There were some devices for that in the VN, namely the diary and the date, that could've been applied instead of Riki's endless monologues and the slideshows. I think there was more of an impact from the anime version overall, though. While it lacked the kind of intimacy from the VN, the ending was much better, and it doesn't feel as disjointed as the other heroine arcs. It's a setup for what's to come, which is great. I would've changed some things, but I'd say this is the 3rd route to have a better ending than the VN. Mio, Haruka, and Kurugaya's endings I found to be much better than in the VN, though Haruka and Kurugaya's buildup weren't quite as good. So yeah, I think Japanese Creative Staff did get pretty creative with how they handled the endings. Clannad's endings stayed true to the VN if I recall. Kyou's and Tomoyo's were similar, though I liked Tomoyo's ending in the anime more than in the VN. I'd like to see what other techniques they'll use for the heart of the story. Pacing and buildup aside, I like the route ending adaptations more than anything I've seen from Clannad VN -> anime, except maybe the flowerfield scene which I hear was mostly a change from KyoAni from the VN. |
Vladz0rOct 20, 2013 9:49 PM
| It's always so sad to forget things that one would rather cherish. It was hard to take that Riki won't remember the fireworks and all the time spent with Kurugaya. I still don't know how her wish became so powerful to form a time trap, but at the end of everything, I will just think that it was a wish that was granted and it was saddening that the wish was never meant to last. I am also curious to what she meant when she asked Riki to protect Rin. And I cannot really comprehend what she meant when she said thank you and bid farewell. Does that mean that the memories won't be there anymore or does it imply that she will disappear from Riki's life for good? I really hope it is not the latter because the preview doesn't show anything. I am lost and cannot wait to find out in next episode. More than Kurugaya's tears, it hit me harder when they showed a glimpse of her smile sitting on the piano at the end of the episode. That was really emotional. All of my feels were with her. I have always waited for LB! to be animated, but seeing S1, I was actually a bit disappointed, but everything's changing as every episode of the sequel is going by. I am glad that I decided to finish S1 as quickly as possible to catch-up with weekly releases! This is turning out to be some anime! |
shanimebibOct 20, 2013 11:09 PM
| Stay Home and Wash Your Hands. Protect Yourself. Protect Your Loved Ones. Protect Your Community and Help Defeat Coronavirus. |
| I hope you are content with utterly butchering the route JC Staff. I wonder how you will mess up Refrain next. 1/5. |
| Great episode I almost crying. Also it seems like the animation in this episode really amazing. They really saved it for great moment like this. I expect more in the Refrain part then, JC Staff. |
| Fantastic episode, I love Kurugaya arc so much, it was one of the best! And now let's move to Rin2 or back to some scenes from common route again. They changed some things and went without romance but if that's because of Rin x Riki relationship I am fine with that. So things were omitted (scene with snowy lake for example) but they did really good job with this episode, nice work with soundtrack (though I am not sure if those rectangular flashback videos were good choice) Still, I like every episode more and more. I don't know how many episodes are they gonna animate, but this seems like they want to do it in 13 eps only. |
| Awesome Episode..... Loli Kurugaya..... <3 5/5 |
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| I still need to finish the VN but wow, this was so saddening. Season 2 is going strong! |
| whatahell????????? wtf they did with my fav char????? |
| To think it's only the beginning and the emotion is already overflowing. |
| Kamisama no Inai Nichiyoubi vibe!!!!! T_____T Kurugaya !!!!!!! Noooo!!! Come back!!!! |
| I face-palmed myself and I laughed at times where I should've been crying. This should've been good but oh my god the execution was terrible. Even Twilight's love story has more impact than this! Please get better because this was just terrabad. |
I almost never read discussions after I made my post, if you want to reply PM me or post on my profile page. |
MasterMeNL said: I face-palmed myself and I laughed at times where I should've been crying. This should've been good but oh my god the execution was terrible. Even Twilight's love story has more impact than this! Please get better because this was just terrabad. Lold, it had better buildup and was better executed than most endings from Key that he gave a 10 to. He probably just missed the 30 or so hints about the Secret of the World and was thrown off by the ending of this arc. Well, considering how a lot of people found Kurugaya's arc in the VN to be the weakest, so I figure they did a good job if most people liked it. Some of the routes gain meaning and impact if you know the Secret already. |
Vladz0rOct 21, 2013 2:05 PM
MasterMeNL said: I face-palmed myself and I laughed at times where I should've been crying. This should've been good but oh my god the execution was terrible. Even Twilight's love story has more impact than this! Please get better because this was just terrabad. Thanks for summing up how I thought about angel beats ending. |
egnaro315 said: MasterMeNL said: I face-palmed myself and I laughed at times where I should've been crying. This should've been good but oh my god the execution was terrible. Even Twilight's love story has more impact than this! Please get better because this was just terrabad. Thanks for summing up how I thought about angel beats ending. Wasn't Clannad's ending pretty bad at leaving it on air? Angel beats was bad because it was originally suppose to have 24 episodes. For comparison, Kurugaya's arc was probably as bad as either Fuko's arc or Misae's arc from Clannad. |
| ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ |
omfgugay said: Wasn't Clannad's ending pretty bad at leaving it on air? Angel beats was bad because it was originally suppose to have 24 episodes. For comparison, Kurugaya's arc was probably as bad as either Fuko's arc or Misae's arc from Clannad. Fuuko's arc was bad?! Wat. |
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Kitsu-nee said: omfgugay said: Wasn't Clannad's ending pretty bad at leaving it on air? Angel beats was bad because it was originally suppose to have 24 episodes. For comparison, Kurugaya's arc was probably as bad as either Fuko's arc or Misae's arc from Clannad. Fuuko's arc was bad?! Wat. Correction*** - as weak as, or the weakest arc |
| ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ |
omfgugay said: Kitsu-nee said: omfgugay said: Wasn't Clannad's ending pretty bad at leaving it on air? Angel beats was bad because it was originally suppose to have 24 episodes. For comparison, Kurugaya's arc was probably as bad as either Fuko's arc or Misae's arc from Clannad. Fuuko's arc was bad?! Wat. Correction*** - as weak as, or the weakest arc Fuko's arc was the best of the entire Clannad anime. |
NayukiShiina said: omfgugay said: Kitsu-nee said: omfgugay said: Wasn't Clannad's ending pretty bad at leaving it on air? Angel beats was bad because it was originally suppose to have 24 episodes. For comparison, Kurugaya's arc was probably as bad as either Fuko's arc or Misae's arc from Clannad. Fuuko's arc was bad?! Wat. Correction*** - as weak as, or the weakest arc Fuko's arc was the best of the entire Clannad anime. What was so special about that arc that differentiates from the other arcs? |
| ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ |
omfgugay said: NayukiShiina said: omfgugay said: Kitsu-nee said: omfgugay said: Wasn't Clannad's ending pretty bad at leaving it on air? Angel beats was bad because it was originally suppose to have 24 episodes. For comparison, Kurugaya's arc was probably as bad as either Fuko's arc or Misae's arc from Clannad. Fuuko's arc was bad?! Wat. Correction*** - as weak as, or the weakest arc Fuko's arc was the best of the entire Clannad anime. What was so special about that arc that differentiates from the other arcs? Was more touching, just imagine my little sister (who is alike Fuko) doing the same thing for me is so f!cking heartwarming uvu And I didn't care for the other characters and their arcs, Clannad dies for me when Fuko's arc ended, nuff said. |
Flying_Cow2014 said: Lets carry this on a clannad discussionNayukiShiina said: omfgugay said: NayukiShiina said: omfgugay said: Kitsu-nee said: omfgugay said: Wasn't Clannad's ending pretty bad at leaving it on air? Angel beats was bad because it was originally suppose to have 24 episodes. For comparison, Kurugaya's arc was probably as bad as either Fuko's arc or Misae's arc from Clannad. Fuuko's arc was bad?! Wat. Correction*** - as weak as, or the weakest arc Fuko's arc was the best of the entire Clannad anime. What was so special about that arc that differentiates from the other arcs? Was more touching, just imagine my little sister (who is alike Fuko) doing the same thing for me is so f!cking heartwarming uvu And I didn't care for the other characters and their arcs, Clannad dies for me when Fuko's arc ended, nuff said. Well... I don´t know... For me Fuko´s arc was not that sad because I had already cried rivers on Makoto´s arc in Kanon. That´s why I think that Fuko´s was the weakest route in clannad too. |
| >opinions There's little consensus for the route quality of most of Key's works. Refrain and After Story are the point of the story. Other side routes are sometimes written by Key's side writers, or just have issues regardless. Key/Maeda might design a character to make you feel an emotion too quickly, or might make the character annoying or whatever. Others can have rushed/sudden drama, especially in the anime. I just hope Refrain is done properly, somehow. Kurugaya's route in the VN and anime served an almost entirely different purpose, and the anime lacked the development I liked, but the ending was much better. If they stuck to the VN plot/ending, the arc would feel fragmented and people would't know what's going on at all. It could've been better if they developed the arc and kept the same ending, but it's whatever. Read a VN if you want a fully developed heroine route. Anime scriptwriters are afraid to do it properly. They cut details to simplify the story, and honestly, if they decided to build up romance with Kurugaya and Riki more, it wouldn't matter in the overall plot and might have just made the ending of the route feel even more forced. I'm still upset that the best parts of Kurugaya were lost in the anime, but it's fine. The original route didn't even have much substance that wasn't in the anime aside from Riki and Kurugaya's repetitive conversations and their romantic development. The only thing I wish they added was the part about Kurugaya's diary, and I think aside from that lack of buildup, it was fine, and I liked it as a VN vet. I just want this adaptation to be done with already, since the routes were doomed to get butchered in some way from the start, seeing how the romantically driven aspect of them was cut out, along with the character development, and they wanted to animate people's favorites scenes despite not being able to build up to them properly. I just want to hear about how Refrain goes from now on, since there is literally no VN->Anime adaptation for a side route that will make you feel more engaged than the VN, unless there are some significant changes made to improve the source material. And come on, there are a lot of essential plot points to Key's arcs that people didn't like. People wanted more realism and a lot of people who didn't like the routes found problems with main plot points and character traits. Komari's route is filled with sudden random/tragic drama and Komari is whiny.. Some people didn't like Mio's character/magic aspect. She might seem kind of boring, I guess? People didn't like how Haruka's family conflict didn't just have them go get a lie detector test or something, and her silliness might be too much for people. Some people didn't like Kud's character/magic aspect, and her constant "wafu" cutesyness. And Kurugaya's arc has this fated tragic heroine ending that plenty of people were unsatisfied with from the VN. I just think there are issues with how people will receive any of these arcs unless they abandon realism and become engaged in them. It's just what you get from Key's side writers, though the character personalities were all done by Maeda. I've seen countless people who disliked every Clannad or LB side route but liked After Story and Refrain. Sadly, the routes probably aren't of great quality to begin with, and JC Staff might have not been able to improve them for you. tldr; The above is basically about route quality,adaptations and source material. So yeah, did you guys actually want to be a full blown romantic development with Kurugaya with the dream world collapsing while Kurugaya held onto Riki like in the VN? I doubt that the development and that ending would've impressed anime watchers as much as the ending JC Staff did. I hate how the changes killed her development, but I love the ending and it's integration into the story as the Secret unfolds. I've honestly seen a more serious discussion of this route on /a/ than I have from the people here on MAL. What do you think they should've done to please VN viewers and anime watchers? |
Vladz0rOct 21, 2013 4:35 PM
omfgugay said: Kitsu-nee said: omfgugay said: Wasn't Clannad's ending pretty bad at leaving it on air? Angel beats was bad because it was originally suppose to have 24 episodes. For comparison, Kurugaya's arc was probably as bad as either Fuko's arc or Misae's arc from Clannad. Fuuko's arc was bad?! Wat. Correction*** - as weak as, or the weakest arc I found Fuuko's arc to be the most boring, it's usually when people quit the show. |
| Lol vladz0r everytime I refresh the page your texts multiply like crazy. But yeah, the general consensus is that the girls routes should not be compared to refrain given the huge difference in quality. |
egnaro15Oct 21, 2013 5:02 PM
egnaro315 said: Lol vladz0r everytime I refresh the page your texts multiply like crazy. But yeah, the general consensus is that the girls routes should not be compared to refrain given the huge difference in quality. Yeah. I don't know why I even make these walls of text anymore. I need to stay off of the forums throughout the week. |
Vladz0r said: egnaro315 said: Lol vladz0r everytime I refresh the page your texts multiply like crazy. But yeah, the general consensus is that the girls routes should not be compared to refrain given the huge difference in quality. Yeah. I don't know why I even make these walls of text anymore. I need to stay off of the forums throughout the week. those guys totally just disregarded your explanation.. |
| この世界には。。。秘密がある |
KeyIsLove said: I was spoiled before watching clannad but I knew of its beautiful ending so I forced myself to watch Fuuko's arc just in case I miss somethingomfgugay said: Kitsu-nee said: omfgugay said: Wasn't Clannad's ending pretty bad at leaving it on air? Angel beats was bad because it was originally suppose to have 24 episodes. For comparison, Kurugaya's arc was probably as bad as either Fuko's arc or Misae's arc from Clannad. Fuuko's arc was bad?! Wat. Correction*** - as weak as, or the weakest arc I found Fuuko's arc to be the most boring, it's usually when people quit the show. |
KeyIsLove said: omfgugay said: Kitsu-nee said: omfgugay said: Wasn't Clannad's ending pretty bad at leaving it on air? Angel beats was bad because it was originally suppose to have 24 episodes. For comparison, Kurugaya's arc was probably as bad as either Fuko's arc or Misae's arc from Clannad. Fuuko's arc was bad?! Wat. Correction*** - as weak as, or the weakest arc I found Fuuko's arc to be the most boring, it's usually when people quit the show. Ah, I respect your opinion of course, but I really find it hard to believe that you haven't got teary eyes at least at goodbye scene (well, it made me cry at least three times, including the visual novel (arghh I want a full kiss scene though)). Honestly, I always see that most of the people didn't enjoy the same routes I did (not enough love for Chihaya :( And Nayuki. And Fuuko, yup). |
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sanata50lbsb said: Vladz0r said: egnaro315 said: Lol vladz0r everytime I refresh the page your texts multiply like crazy. But yeah, the general consensus is that the girls routes should not be compared to refrain given the huge difference in quality. Yeah. I don't know why I even make these walls of text anymore. I need to stay off of the forums throughout the week. those guys totally just disregarded your explanation.. I dunno if it's an explanation, but I still feel that Kurugaya's arc in the anime made itself feel overall more consistent with the main story, even though I think it wish it was built up better and with less monologues. But hey, since the scriptwriter LOVES monologues, hopefully we get plenty for Refrain when they're actually necessary... Kitsu-nee said: Ah, I rexpect your opinion of course, but I really find it hard tto believe that you haven't got teary eyes at least at goodbye scene (well, it made me cry at least three times, including the visual novel (arghh I want a full kiss scene though)). Honestly, I always see that modt of the people didn't enjoy same routes I did (not enough love for Chihaya :( And Nayuki. And Fuuko, yup). Don't worry, I liked every Key route ;) |
Vladz0r said: Don't worry, I liked every Key route ;) Whoa, so there is after all another person like me! Always good to see that there is someone else to share love for Key with <3 |
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| I lived to see Kurugaya and Riki romance animated. But now..... welp, time to replay Kurugaya route. |
iRadiance said: I lived to see Kurugaya and Riki romance animated. But now..... welp, time to replay Kurugaya route. I'm sayin... |
Vladz0r said: I doubt that the development and that ending would've impressed anime watchers as much as the ending JC Staff did. I hate how the changes killed her development, but I love the ending and it's integration into the story as the Secret unfolds. I've honestly seen a more serious discussion of this route on /a/ than I have from the people here on MAL. What do you think they should've done to please VN viewers and anime watchers? I honestly think that this is all that can be done really... beacuse if you actually think about it; when I first played Kurugaya's route till the end, i also felt more confusion rather than feeling the drama of her parting. Unless you already learned the secret of the world, no helping it that people will look at Kurugaya's route as an emotional train-wreak from the first viewing. (´・ω・)つ |
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| The anime only viewers will soon come to realize that refrain is full of feels. I guess from season 1, some won't be able to take refrain seriously. If only JC Staff put the same effort they did in the recent episodes to S1 |
| Haven't tried out the Visual Novel so I have no clue what's going on. Nevertheless that was a really nice episode. I wonder what happened to Kurugaya and what's with the last wish thing??? Protect Rin? I can't wait till they explain everything. |
~ El Psy Congroo~  |
Kitsu-nee said: Ah, I respect your opinion of course, but I really find it hard to believe that you haven't got teary eyes at least at goodbye scene (well, it made me cry at least three times, including the visual novel (arghh I want a full kiss scene though)). Believe it or not I have never cried at any Key work, or even gotten teary eyed. Yes, it is very, very, VERY sad and heartbreaking, but I just never cried at it. I felt sad, depressed even, but have yet to actually cry over it. I last cried a week ago because of the stress of having panic disorder, and before that it's been six years since I cried. So things like TV, movies, books, etc. etc. won't make me cry, no matter how sad they are. |
KeyIsLove said: Believe it or not I have never cried at any Key work, or even gotten teary eyed. Yes, it is very, very, VERY sad and heartbreaking, but I just never cried at it. I felt sad, depressed even, but have yet to actually cry over it. I last cried a week ago because of the stress of having panic disorder, and before that it's been six years since I cried. So things like TV, movies, books, etc. etc. won't make me cry, no matter how sad they are. Well yeah, I don't find it THAT groundbreaking or anything, especially since you are a guy, but I know ones who really cried after Clannad, so maybe I'm a bit surprised ;) Though I get your point of view, I watch a lot of movies, but I never get too emotional about those, same thing with books. Still, Jun Maeda is able to make me cry like a baby almost every time, sigh ;) |
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Kitsu-nee said: KeyIsLove said: Believe it or not I have never cried at any Key work, or even gotten teary eyed. Yes, it is very, very, VERY sad and heartbreaking, but I just never cried at it. I felt sad, depressed even, but have yet to actually cry over it. I last cried a week ago because of the stress of having panic disorder, and before that it's been six years since I cried. So things like TV, movies, books, etc. etc. won't make me cry, no matter how sad they are. Well yeah, I don't find it THAT groundbreaking or anything, especially since you are a guy, but I know ones who really cried after Clannad, so maybe I'm a bit surprised ;) Though I get your point of view, I watch a lot of movies, but I never get too emotional about those, same thing with books. Still, Jun Maeda is able to make me cry like a baby almost every time, sigh ;) It's a very individual question as to how you react to something sad though. It's not specifically about how much you're emotionally affected, but rather whether or not that makes you cry or not. Personally I can get teary-eyed every so often at touching scenes, but I don't really ever cry no matter how sad anything is. I could when I was younger but nowadays, nope. |
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Hoshimaru57 said: Me being who I am, spoiled it for myself, and like every Key anime ever made, I felt bad knowing what I did. I am now in Refrain, where I know full well that everything is going to go to hell. Chances are, you only spoiled the ending of the series, and have no clue how the characters build around it. Stick around, because unless you've read an in-depth summary of the entire plot of the Rin and Refrain arcs, there's much more to Refrain than what you think there is. I spoiled the Secret for myself as well, and you'll probably still enjoy Refrain despite knowing it, like I did. Tell me what you actually spoiled. (spoiler it or pm me or something) |
| SO I haven't played the VN. Kurugaya asks Riki to protect Rin?????? From what? I'm so lost =( I guessing something really bad happens to Kurugaya though..... |
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Hoshimaru57 said: When this anime was announced (the first season), I said I'd watch it, and love it for what it was no matter what. For some odd reason, I got attached to LB, never really knowing what it was about. Me being who I am, spoiled it for myself, and like every Key anime ever made, I felt bad knowing what I did. I am now in Refrain, where I know full well that everything is going to go to hell. Truly, this is what decides if I can actually feel alive or if it stings too much to admit my own humanity. Knowing is only half the experience man. Seeing it all unfold right before your very eyes is a whole different story. I also got spoiled but that didn't stop me from enjoying the ride. |
| For me, knowing was like 10% the experience ;3 And there are plenty of people who have come really close to figuring out the Secret before the end of it. It's all about how the Rin and Refrain arcs unfold. The Secret is what pulls it all together. |
Vladz0r said: For me, knowing was like 10% the experience ;3 And there are plenty of people who have come really close to figuring out the Secret before the end of it. It's all about how the Rin and Refrain arcs unfold. The Secret is what pulls it all together. Yeah maybe 50% is too much. But yeah, these final arcs are going to either make or break the whole series so hopefully it's done really well. |
Vladz0r said: Hoshimaru57 said: Me being who I am, spoiled it for myself, and like every Key anime ever made, I felt bad knowing what I did. I am now in Refrain, where I know full well that everything is going to go to hell. Chances are, you only spoiled the ending of the series, and have no clue how the characters build around it. Stick around, because unless you've read an in-depth summary of the entire plot of the Rin and Refrain arcs, there's much more to Refrain than what you think there is. I spoiled the Secret for myself as well, and you'll probably still enjoy Refrain despite knowing it, like I did. Allow me to butt in - I also spoiled the secret of the world. It was shortly before Riki found out who sends Rin all those "missions" via Lennon. I've taken a look at the character description of Koshiki on MAL and BAM! With just a single sentence, I've spoiled myself the secret of the world... So... don't click that spoiler button on Koshiki if you don't want the secret to be spoiled ^^ It didnt matter much. I still cried on refrain. The one and only time I cried when playing a game... |
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| You guys are talking about random stuff in the "episode 3 discussion" thread lol. Do it in the VN Thread xD |
DeathyZAOct 23, 2013 4:23 AM
Naoki-Saten said: Vladz0r said: Hoshimaru57 said: Me being who I am, spoiled it for myself, and like every Key anime ever made, I felt bad knowing what I did. I am now in Refrain, where I know full well that everything is going to go to hell. Chances are, you only spoiled the ending of the series, and have no clue how the characters build around it. Stick around, because unless you've read an in-depth summary of the entire plot of the Rin and Refrain arcs, there's much more to Refrain than what you think there is. I spoiled the Secret for myself as well, and you'll probably still enjoy Refrain despite knowing it, like I did. Allow me to butt in - I also spoiled the secret of the world. It was shortly before Riki found out who sends Rin all those "missions" via Lennon. I've taken a look at the character description of Koshiki on MAL and BAM! With just a single sentence, I've spoiled myself the secret of the world... So... don't click that spoiler button on Koshiki if you don't want the secret to be spoiled ^^ It didnt matter much. I still cried on refrain. The one and only time I cried when playing a game... Glad to see that I wasn't the only one. Wanted to know more about Kyousuke, and so I saw the spoiler on the MAL T^T At least I was silly enough to not get what the hell is it about, lol. Still, I think that one can't comprehend the Refrain for real until seeing all the emotions in characters' voices, and hearing their thoughts, even knoowing the secret of the world. That what really makes it so good, in my opinion. It's more about characters, than story, at least for me. |
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DeathDoUsPart said: You guys are spewing crap in the "episode 3 discussion" thread lol. Do it in the VN Thread xD There is no need to be so rude. It's not like the talk is completely unrelated. Surely, there are anime viewers who also accidentally had the secret of the world spoiled, and now they're troubled over whether or not the series will still be fun to watch. |
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