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Kolios said: It does, visually. It's a show rather than tell approach. You connect the dots based on what's shown. People complain about too much exposition and they're not necessarily wrong. Don't tell them that, apparently viewers can't comprehend unless they are spoonfed everything. |
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Eylandos said: Says he wasn't trying to kill him physically yet said multiple times he would kill him and his ideals, as well even projected swords at him too kill him. Gtfo. I don't know if you missed it, but here's the deal, he's trying to do both: ANGRY2011 said: The goal of Archer breaking Shirou's spirit is to try and eliminate his past self as completely as possible, since it isn't guaranteed in the slightest that killing his past self would remove his current self from existence. So he tries to completely eradicate his past self in body and mind, to make the most impact possible and hope that it will suffice - as well as proving himself right. Instead of Archer breaking Shirou's spirit, however, Shirou breaks Archer's spirit in the end, which is why UBW begins to fall apart (though there was no UBW in the VN here) and Archer doesn't finish the job even when he definitely could have killed Shirou. So it isn't so much Archer abandoned his goal, so much as Shirou broke him, which then resulted in that. You're free to dislike it, but in a battle that was both physical and of wills/ideals, in the end Shirou won because he succeeded in the battle of wills/ideals, not in the physical department. In the VN, the physical battle itself is just a backdrop for the mental battle anyway, which is admittedly difficult to portray. |
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cupc said: Mickdrew said: Shitty fireworks what made you dislike it? I didn't, jks ^^ |
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Mathias2001 said: Vanisher said: So gilgamesh is supposed to leave because the mansion was crumbling (obvious plot armor)? that looked retarded. From what we know about Gilgamesh, it's fit and please don't say plot armor, Shirou dies like more than 30 times in the vn and you still call it plot armor. It gives me nausea. Shirou has anything but plot armor. Hahahaha so funny. Let's just ignore how almost every character in the series (villians included) saved him from death or didn't kill him when they could and just leave because reasons (legit or not, it doesn't matter) |
Eylandos said: Says he wasn't trying to kill him physically yet said multiple times he would kill him and his ideals, as well even projected swords at him too kill him. Gtfo. Wasn't it specifically stated last episode that nothing would change unless he killed him and broke his spirit. Pretty sure Archer said he was betting on a small possibility. Comprehension skills FTW!!!! |
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xenovibe said: FanEu said: Could say the same about Tokyo Ghoul to be honest. Everything related to that series just screams mediocrity to me. Yet the fans seem to be putting it on the same pedestal as something like Berserk (lol).Could it be that they source material just isn't that great? Parasyte is mediocre too. Don't kid yourself. The beginning was good but the middle and the end fell apart and there was nothing "thrillerish" about it after the first third. |
| Alright, finally got around watching the subbed version. I honestly get the complaints, but "one of the worst episodes"? Really? My biggest complaints are the mildly short continuation of the Answer and Rin missing Gil (seriously, why?). 4.5/5 overall. |
| 1/5 Never go full DEEN. |
Vanisher said: Hahahaha so funny. Let's just ignore how almost every character in the series (villians included) saved him from death or didn't kill him when they could and just leave because reasons (legit or not, it doesn't matter) Yes it does, lmao did you really just say that? Do you understand what plot armor is? No matter where you look for the definition one thing will always remain the same "An unexplained reason that prevents the main (or plot-related) character/s from dying at a particular time, other than the fact that they are the main (or plot-related) character If there is a reason that can be explained, it is not plot armor. Regardless as to whether you like/dislike/tolerate/ give 2 f's about the reason, if it is there plot armor isn't. |
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Vanisher said: So gilgamesh is supposed to leave because the mansion was crumbling (obvious plot armor)? that looked retarded. He left because he was getting his clothes dirtied. I think it fits gilgameshs personality perfectly. |
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Kolios said: It does, visually. It's a show rather than tell approach. You connect the dots based on what's shown. People complain about too much exposition and they're not necessarily wrong. And there are certain things that need to be said so dots can be connected. This is one of them and there were more. |
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Insertanamehere said: Mickdrew said: Shitty fireworks I'd say it's good choreography, actually, as compared to some of their sfx fests a la Saber vs Berserker and about as good as Lancer vs Archer round 1, too bad it's in an inappropriate place. choreography that is a plothole and goes against what should be going on is NOT a good choreography. Pls explain shirou's crazy parkour fighting skills? |
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| I have only one question (well, for now)... those giant swords. Is that a thing that can happen? Archer can do that? What swords were those? It really did catch me off guard. Previous episode was better. Still, this one had some good moments anyway. But I really don't like watching this as an airing series to be honest. The whole Archer and Shirou confrontation should just be one big scene, and not a scene cut into several parts that you have to wait weeks for. The feeling that one got after seeing the "ending" to ep20 should've just kept going into this one. But nope, one week of waiting to cool all of that down into pretty much nothing. |
astroprogs said: I honestly get the complaints, but "one of the worst episodes"? Really? Funnily enough I don't think anyone's actually said that yet. |
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CookingPriest said: Insertanamehere said: I'd say it's good choreography, actually, as compared to some of their sfx fests a la Saber vs Berserker and about as good as Lancer vs Archer round 1, too bad it's in an inappropriate place. choreography that is a plothole and goes against what should be going on is NOT a good choreography. Pls explain shirou's crazy parkour fighting skills? Wasn't it explained in the previous episode? Shirou gains more skills as he fight Archer |
CookingPriest said: Insertanamehere said: I'd say it's good choreography, actually, as compared to some of their sfx fests a la Saber vs Berserker and about as good as Lancer vs Archer round 1, too bad it's in an inappropriate place. choreography that is a plothole and goes against what should be going on is NOT a good choreography. Pls explain shirou's crazy parkour fighting skills? Remember the "tripped on a nonexistant rock" that was actually a proper way to make a landing, in order to not break your legs. |
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Harlequina said: I have only one question (well, for now)... those giant swords. Is that a thing that can happen? Archer can do that? What swords were those? It really did catch me off guard. Overedge, he took small swords and pumped them. They probably should have looked distorted though. Either that or it's like that "Iron something" spell Executors use on black keys. |
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| Rip shinipoo |
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So the awesome younger EMIYA's design is from Extra: |
| I find it weird that some people are complaining about the second half of the episode. I thought the holy grail talk was excellent, to the point they probably couldn't have done it any better. I think they could have shown Saber's motivations a little more clearly for anime viewers, but that's not a different story. The first half of this episode wasn't bad either, although it could have been better in some regards. I didn't like those giant swords, especially the moment Shirou blocks those 2 swords at the same time. The way he moved was kind of the awkward there. Shirou breaking UBW was a nice way to finish it though. Archer's poker face after Shirou pierces him with his sword... dunno, it should've looked a little more painful than that imo. I really missed the moment Archer jumps to block Gil's swords with his own body even though it looks like he's going to hit Shirou with all he has. That would've looked great. By the way, Shirou was doing great in his first skirmish against Archer. I really liked that. Dolphins confirmed, maybe? lol |
CookingPriest said: Insertanamehere said: I'd say it's good choreography, actually, as compared to some of their sfx fests a la Saber vs Berserker and about as good as Lancer vs Archer round 1, too bad it's in an inappropriate place. choreography that is a plothole and goes against what should be going on is NOT a good choreography. Pls explain shirou's crazy parkour fighting skills? it is good choreography, but just not very canon. but that is not relevant to the matter at hand the definition of choreography: 1. the art of composing ballets and other dances and planning and arranging the movements, steps, and patterns of dancers. 2. the technique of representing the various movements in dancing by a system of notation. 3. the arrangement or manipulation of actions leading up to an event |
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| WOW!!! The real Archer has beaten his faker. I've got nothing more to say, Gilgamesh is the BADASS |
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WrongPriest said: astroprogs said: I honestly get the complaints, but "one of the worst episodes"? Really? Funnily enough I don't think anyone's actually said that yet. A Preemptive strike lol. Seriously though, I've read that somewhere but confused it with MAL. |
CookingPriest said: WrongPriest said: Also as Pikachu pointed out above once his spirit is weakened his projections become hollow just like Shirou's were. He can't maintain them. That's why his projected armaments shattered against Shirou's. Good thing anime explained that.... ... oh wait. oh look, I was right. It did state it in the VN. LOL Like, I'm not going to speak for everyone or anime onlies, but being someone who has only watched playthroughs of the VN, I never saw the scenes or information from the VN. I figured it out almost purely through the anime itself; Everytime Shioru REALLY wants a projection and his strong beliefs are still strong, the projection will appear provided he's got a base. And when they're over powered, they're overpowered and broken, but when his spirit is getting hampered on by Archer, archer doesn't even need to put much weight into cracking the swords, shown by the backhanded slow cut he did into shirou's swords in the last episode. Then, when shirou's spirit is renewed, he blocks archer's thrown swords with painful ease, and they look all new and clean. Add to that you've got archer's swords, which seem to get weaker and weaker as shirou constantly defies him, to the point that even shioru's cracked swords are more full then the giant ones archer creates. (that and mana reserves played a factor.) It just seemed like the most likely explanation to me. |
 A most noble goal, King of Heroes. I approve. |
I am the Priest of my church Yuetsu is my body, and wine is my blood I have trolled over a thousand users Unknown to sympathy, nor known to apathy Withstood Shirou to eat Mapo Tofu Yet, my question will never be answered So as I rejoice, Unlimited Kirei Works! |
KamiCity said: Vanisher said: Hahahaha so funny. Let's just ignore how almost every character in the series (villians included) saved him from death or didn't kill him when they could and just leave because reasons (legit or not, it doesn't matter) Yes it does, lmao did you really just say that? Do you understand what plot armor is? No matter where you look for the definition one thing will always remain the same "An unexplained reason that prevents the main (or plot-related) character/s from dying at a particular time, other than the fact that they are the main (or plot-related) character If there is a reason that can be explained, it is not plot armor. Regardless as to whether you like/dislike/tolerate/ give 2 f's about the reason, if it is there plot armor isn't. No it doesn't matter if there's an explanation if that explanation is clearly just an excuse to get that outcome, instead of that explanation being the logical reason that leads to that outcome to happen in the first place. Everytime shirou (or rin) is in danger one is always expecting someone or something to save them or the enemy to leave, that's all there's to it. It can matter though, so I was wrong with how I said it, for example Archer not killing shirou and trying to make Shirou regret his ideal is fine because that's what he's trying to do. |
WrongPriest said: Harlequina said: I have only one question (well, for now)... those giant swords. Is that a thing that can happen? Archer can do that? What swords were those? It really did catch me off guard. Overedge, he took small swords and pumped them. They probably should have looked distorted though. Either that or it's like that "Iron something" spell Executors use on black keys. Hm, alright. I hadn't even heard about Overedge before, or I just forgot about it. |
Eylandos said: Kolios said: The whole point was for Archer to break Shirou's spirit. He wasn't trying to kill him physically. The only thing that's half assed is your ability to comprehend. EDIT: In your other post you said Archer saw Shirou resisting but he did almost break him in the last epsiode. That is evidence enough for Archer to try and continue. Says he wasn't trying to kill him physically yet said multiple times he would kill him and his ideals, as well even projected swords at him too kill him. Gtfo. People like you who can't understand conjunction in logic should be the ones to never post again. Let P be killing Shirou physically and Q be destroing Shirou mentally Archer wants to do P and Q. If P becomes true but Q is false, Archer has failed. True AND False = False. Come on this is simple logic. Archer wants to do both and common sense says killing someone physically wouldn't let you destroy them mentally because they'd already be dead. |
CyberNTMay 30, 2015 12:20 PM
| shinji LMAO even as he dies i cant help myself but laugh at him X'D more of archa dis episode 10/10 :> |
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TrueKirei said: A most noble goal, King of Heroes. I approve.  |
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| there's more action in this thread than the anime itself.. i r8 the anime 7/10 and the MAL boards 10/10 |
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| 5/5 Another perfect adaptation No reason to even waste 15 hours on the VN route and its naval gazing text walls anymore. |
I am the Priest of my church Yuetsu is my body, and wine is my blood I have trolled over a thousand users Unknown to sympathy, nor known to apathy Withstood Shirou to eat Mapo Tofu Yet, my question will never be answered So as I rejoice, Unlimited Kirei Works! |
Harlequina said: WrongPriest said: Overedge, he took small swords and pumped them. They probably should have looked distorted though. Either that or it's like that "Iron something" spell Executors use on black keys. Hm, alright. I hadn't even heard about Overedge before, or I just forgot about it. https://youtu.be/WfSdCSM9s9k?t=2m36s |
ZeroDragon said: TrueKirei said: A most noble goal, King of Heroes. I approve. he just wants to trim the fat. is dat so bad ?? :/ |
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ZA_WAYD said: ZeroDragon said: he just wants to trim the fat. is dat so bad ?? :/ Whatever I desire can never be wrong.  |
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Stark700 said: Shinji. What an ending that was lol.  |
| how do you guys know we're getting dolphins next episode? |
| この世界には。。。秘密がある |
sanata50lbsb said: how do you guys know we're getting dolphins next episode? Because ufotable is adapting this properly, so they would naturally avoid the sexist rape scene. |
I am the Priest of my church Yuetsu is my body, and wine is my blood I have trolled over a thousand users Unknown to sympathy, nor known to apathy Withstood Shirou to eat Mapo Tofu Yet, my question will never be answered So as I rejoice, Unlimited Kirei Works! |
sanata50lbsb said: how do you guys know we're getting dolphins next episode? the end card shows rin hugging a pillow and being all embarrassed, almost in the exact same way UBW the movie does it. It's scaringly similar to the pose in there. it's just a guess tho, nothing more, nothing less. |
Vanisher said: KamiCity said: Yes it does, lmao did you really just say that? Do you understand what plot armor is? No matter where you look for the definition one thing will always remain the same "An unexplained reason that prevents the main (or plot-related) character/s from dying at a particular time, other than the fact that they are the main (or plot-related) character If there is a reason that can be explained, it is not plot armor. Regardless as to whether you like/dislike/tolerate/ give 2 f's about the reason, if it is there plot armor isn't. No it doesn't matter if there's an explanation if that explanation is clearly just an excuse to get that outcome, instead of that explanation being the logical reason that leads to that outcome to happen in the first place. Everytime shirou (or rin) is in danger one is always expecting someone or something to save them or the enemy to leave, that's all there's to it. It can matter though, so I was wrong with how I said it, for example Archer not killing shirou and trying to make Shirou regret his ideal is fine because that's what he's trying to do. But they do have logical reasons and explanations. Ilya and Berserker - Ilya's personality, Archers unexpected noble phantasm, and the backstory between her kiritusugu and shirou. Caster and Kuzuki - Shirou's unexpected projection, Saber got back up + not knowing sabers noble phantasm. After we figured out Caster's noble phantasm would you say rule breaker could win against any Noble phantasm at all? Caster and Kuzuki pt - Archer letting them go/ because he was playing caster from the start. Gil after Berserker/Ilya - The heart would spoil, His interest in rin got peaked, Archer views everyone as bugs and deemed them not important. Personality plays a key factor, arrogance has lost wars throughout history. Here again, Gils personality is a fitting reason, he could care less about shirou. Archer was his target, and he wouldn't kill Saber that easily, he's taunting her and Shirou. Once again I don't like the reasons =/= plot armor Plot armor is defined, and the definition states it must be "unexplained" If you ignore that then you are trying to make up your own definition to words. |
KamiCityMay 30, 2015 12:33 PM
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ZeroDragon said: TrueKirei said: A most noble goal, King of Heroes. I approve. "To build a better world sometimes means tearing the old one down. And that makes enemies." ―Alexander Pierce, peace nobel prize approve. |
| enjoyed it. loved the moment where archer accepted he lost, though i wish the sequence where emiya played was longer in regards to the projections as pikachu said it is really is not hard to figure out. honestly it is pretty basic fantasy logic. stronger spirit stronger spirtual weapons, weak spirit weak weapons. |
Guilek said: ZeroDragon said: "To build a better world sometimes means tearing the old one down. And that makes enemies." ―Alexander Pierce, peace nobel prize approve. Looks like the Grail taking a shit. |
| And here it comes. Anime-only saltiness, please GTFO back to your own dark and edgy show that is /Zero. By now it should be clear that this is not the show you're looking for. But I had to tear up when they showed Emiya's past in Middle-East. Coupled with Emiya BGM, that sure is a cheap way to make some feels. My only problem is that this is another DEEN scene of Shirou deflecting TWO hugeass swords before the stab, instead of copying Archer's swordspam. Man, that real wasted potential of showing competent Shirou. And usual Shinji scene is as I imagined, maybe even more gruesome than the VN. |
| Large pic: |
| MAL is toxic as ever I see C'mon guys, didn't they say the answer scene was going to be different than the one in the VN? My only complaint about the episode is Shirou giving just a flesh wound to Archer and not really stabing him through the freaking chest I will just hold hope for the EMIYA theme in the future episodes 4/5 |
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