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Sep 9, 2017 7:50 AM
#1

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THIS IS AN ANIME ONLY DISCUSSION POST. DO NOT DISCUSS THE MANGA BEYOND THIS EPISODE.
----------------------------------------
Welp, that was one heck of a reunion between Altair and Setsuna...
Altair actually got quite emotional and I'm not surprised.

A lot of psychology this episode. Up to this point, Altair hasn't really expressed emotions like this until she sees Setsuna. A very talky episode that didn't rely on action but instead with feelings. Setsuna really is a kind person.
Sep 9, 2017 8:01 AM
#2
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Jan 2017
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Well, Altair has a heart after all. In other words, she isn't a real villain. I said it since episode 13. The other characters are there to fill the story but are irrelevant to the main story. After seeing all the dialogue between Altair and Setsuna, I conclude that all the predictions happened. Also, it was obvious Altair will save Setsuna and she did.

This show had a lot of potential but now with all these predictable actions, it is just another entertainment anime but not a master piece.





Sep 9, 2017 8:47 AM
#3
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Now Altair has become more famous after this show, more stories will be written about her and she will become much stronger. She does not have the limit of strength and she is not limited to any stories. So she can become the strongest character, am I right?
Sep 9, 2017 8:48 AM
#4

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Debigll said:
Now Altair has become more famous after this show, more stories will be written about her and she will become much stronger. She does not have the limit of strength and she is not limited to any stories. So she can become the strongest character, am I right? I still do not understand the meaning of this moment:
[IMG] file:///C:/Users/Acer/Desktop/%D0%A1%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%BC%D0%BE%D0%BA.PNG [/ IMG]


My understanding is that she created a world with just her and Setsuna. She has no more reason to fight.
Sep 9, 2017 8:49 AM
#5

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Amazing . I can't believe i cried the whole episode. This is already past beyond masterpiece. 1 more episode
It is official. Altair is the all time op character
joshua10redSep 9, 2017 9:02 AM

Sep 9, 2017 8:51 AM
#6

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Oh shit, the feels in this episode. Altair and Setsuna moments had me crying. That's all I have to say.

Sep 9, 2017 8:57 AM
#7

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Great episode.

Altair and Setsuna reunion was beautiful and hearing them pour out their hearts to each other was really satisfying to watch. I especially loved the part where Setsuna tells Altair what it means to create a world.

Glad to see Altair saved Setsuna and it was expected but once again very satisfying, I suppose they'll now live together in an infinite story created by each other.

I suppose that the underlying theme of this series is, 'Every story is beautiful in it's own way'.
Sep 9, 2017 9:01 AM
#8

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Freaking episode tugged my heart strings. Damn it... T_T
Sep 9, 2017 9:03 AM
#9
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Stupid ending, all creations except meteora and magane got erased by Altair...
Sep 9, 2017 9:05 AM
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This anime is a masterpiece.
It holds a very deep and important meaning: the importance of creations.

The relationship creator-creation between Altair and Setsuna is beatiful and this episode was very moving.

Altair can be considered the rea protagonist of this show, but all the characters are a protagonist in their own way from different point of view.

Next is last episode...
Sep 9, 2017 9:09 AM

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Phew, 20 Minutes of Altair finally talk to her heart content, some confession. And then finally Sota talk again with Setsuna for a moment. That surely lots of Drama for one Action episode. Oh well, one more step to the end.
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Sep 9, 2017 9:10 AM
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This episode was both more and less than I expected.

Oddly enough all of the vectors that I had predicted came true in some form: Altair both rejected Setsuna as a fake, and then saved her. I suspected that she might actually try to create a world herself, but the thought of Altair being so powerful as to actually create two universes for an infinite feedback loop for her and her creator was beyond what I had imagined.

I thought that the one thing she couldn't defy would be fate; that she would be left with the final intent of Setsuna, and would have to accept the world as it is.

This is an ending worthy of her redemption, but it's also a massive cop-out. It's an anti-climax that blows the oxygen out of the room, so to speak, and leaves few if any vectors for its continuation.

What's Magane going to do, for instance? Is she set up for a sequel hook? What happens to the whole thing if Magane disappears, since the "lie" is sustained by her power?

The ending here raises too many questions, and would better have been the completion of a 21 episode arc of a much larger series.
Sep 9, 2017 9:19 AM
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The talk no Jutsu was real lol but I loved it....I kinda hope that Altair and Setsuna are in the real world now for good
Sep 9, 2017 9:24 AM
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Lelouch0202 said:
Great episode.

Altair and Setsuna reunion was beautiful and hearing them pour out their hearts to each other was really satisfying to watch. I especially loved the part where Setsuna tells Altair what it means to create a world.

Glad to see Altair saved Setsuna and it was expected but once again very satisfying, I suppose they'll now live together in an infinite story created by each other.

I suppose that the underlying theme of this series is, 'Every story is beautiful in it's own way'.

R u saying that Altair went back in time or not?
Sep 9, 2017 9:36 AM

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firemagnet said:

What's Magane going to do, for instance? Is she set up for a sequel hook? What happens to the whole thing if Magane disappears, since the "lie" is sustained by her power?


It only has to be sustained long enough for it to become truth. If Setsuna gained enough audience acceptance, she would no longer have to be maintained by Megane's lie.
Sep 9, 2017 9:36 AM
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Zethus_Thorne96 said:
Lelouch0202 said:
Great episode.

Altair and Setsuna reunion was beautiful and hearing them pour out their hearts to each other was really satisfying to watch. I especially loved the part where Setsuna tells Altair what it means to create a world.

Glad to see Altair saved Setsuna and it was expected but once again very satisfying, I suppose they'll now live together in an infinite story created by each other.

I suppose that the underlying theme of this series is, 'Every story is beautiful in it's own way'.

R u saying that Altair went back in time or not?

Altair created another world just for her and Setsuna, where Setsuna can live and create the stories she wants, in which Altair would also be omnipotent and all mighty and would create one more world for Shimazaki, spinning the endless cycle of creation, where there would not be any reason for Shimazaki to stop. A perfect loop, I guess. We should see more.
Re:formed
Sep 9, 2017 9:39 AM
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So Altair pressed the reset button?
Sep 9, 2017 9:44 AM
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Zethus_Thorne96 said:
So Altair pressed the reset button?


She clicked the create a new world button.
Sep 9, 2017 9:48 AM

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That was an awesome reunion. It was truly beautiful. Altair got quite emotional when she saw Setsuna. She managed to save her and are now living in another world.
Sep 9, 2017 9:49 AM

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Holy shit Im speechless thank you so much for this episode.

Grand finale next week, Im hoping for an amazing episode!

Also that Sota segment really hit me in the feels, it actually felt so good to see him get rid of that burden that has been with him for 21 episodes.
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Sep 9, 2017 9:54 AM
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What a wonderful episode. I was so scared for Setsuna but they made it work in such a fantastic way.
Sep 9, 2017 9:56 AM
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Zethus_Thorne96 said:
Lelouch0202 said:
Great episode.

Altair and Setsuna reunion was beautiful and hearing them pour out their hearts to each other was really satisfying to watch. I especially loved the part where Setsuna tells Altair what it means to create a world.

Glad to see Altair saved Setsuna and it was expected but once again very satisfying, I suppose they'll now live together in an infinite story created by each other.

I suppose that the underlying theme of this series is, 'Every story is beautiful in it's own way'.

R u saying that Altair went back in time or not?



She didn't. Here's what happened. The lie was that you couldn't defy the ultimate law of the world: what has died cannot come back to life. So Magane and Souta sidestepped it; the lie about the lie was the the only way a dead person could come back as a creation.

They resurrected the real Setsuna as a creation, along with a copy of the world to act as her container. But it couldn't exist forever, since the world could only last as long as Setsuna's anointed fate would allow. However, since Setsuna and the world around her was a creation, Altair was able to rewrite her fate within that world and create two entirely distinct universes from it. One for Setsuna, where she would continue to create Altair. The other, the universe that Setsuna wrote, where Altair would continue to sustain Setsuna's existence.
Sep 9, 2017 9:56 AM

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Apr 2016
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Just 1 more episode , damm i want more and more
sad this episode have no action but only emotions
BRAWLERS
Sep 9, 2017 9:57 AM

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Apr 2016
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huh i thought magane will be final enemy but she did not appear
BRAWLERS
Sep 9, 2017 10:06 AM

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''I wanted to show you to the person who wore those glasses. What's why I drew you.''

Ouch...that line was quite overwhelming.

Magane is too Op, her little 'lie' created this whole episode and made Haruhi looks stupid with that crappy endless arc.
Sep 9, 2017 10:07 AM

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I knew Setsuna would show up and save the day and Altair would be defeated with love. She was too overpowered, so this was the only one.

That being said, I was wondering how Setsuna's parents must have felt seeing their daughter up there as a character. That must have been hard for them, not only seeing their daughter's creation as a villain but seeing their dead daughter there too.

I hope Souta spoke with them before doing this.
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Sep 9, 2017 10:12 AM

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A very emotional episode with the fated reunion between Altair and Setsuna. I think it was really nice for the two of them, as well as Souta, to get some closure and peace. Only one episode left, I imagine it's just going to be a "what's going on in the aftermath" epilogue.
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Your taste in anime isn't a personality trait.

MAL is literally just anime Twitter as its own website lol.


Sep 9, 2017 10:14 AM

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For me this is the AOTS.
Sep 9, 2017 10:25 AM

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Hmm, so when you think about it a Creation became a "God" like they considered the mangakas to be. Reminds me of Madoka Magica, but not as good.





Three things cannot be long hidden..
...the s u n, the m oo n, and the tr u th.


Sep 9, 2017 10:29 AM

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Episode 9 - RIP Mamika!I hate you Altair
Episode 19 - And I was just started to like Alicetelia. I hope Altair die painful death.
Episode 21 - Oh,I'm so happy for you Altair. What a touching moment.

I've never been so inconsistent how I feel about anime character.

firemagnet said:
Zethus_Thorne96 said:

R u saying that Altair went back in time or not?



She didn't. Here's what happened. The lie was that you couldn't defy the ultimate law of the world: what has died cannot come back to life. So Magane and Souta sidestepped it; the lie about the lie was the the only way a dead person could come back as a creation.

They resurrected the real Setsuna as a creation, along with a copy of the world to act as her container. But it couldn't exist forever, since the world could only last as long as Setsuna's anointed fate would allow. However, since Setsuna and the world around her was a creation, Altair was able to rewrite her fate within that world and create two entirely distinct universes from it. One for Setsuna, where she would continue to create Altair. The other, the universe that Setsuna wrote, where Altair would continue to sustain Setsuna's existence.


So it was the real Setsuna all along? That makes it even better. I was still a bit confuse whether it's the real Setsuna or just simply a creation base on Setsuna by the end of the episode.Thanks for the explanation. That clear things up.
But it's important to remember that a movie review is subjective;it only gives you one person's opinion.

http://www.classzone.com/books/lnetwork_gr08/page_build.cfm?content=analyz_media&ch=30

It doesn't matter if you like LoGH,Monster etc.If you are a jobless or college/school dropout living in your mom basement, you are still an unintelligent loser. Taste in anime does not make you a better person.If elitist don't exist, casual pleb and shit taste also don't exist.
Sep 9, 2017 10:34 AM
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Hardgore_Lasagna said:
For me this is the AOTS.


Same, but this ending felt a bit too forced. It's not as good as it otherwise would have been.

Worth noting that for Altair and Setsuna in the cathedral, the art style and shading noticeably different



Could this be part of what Souta drew?
Sep 9, 2017 10:40 AM

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So they are Madoka and Homura in another world where she can't save Madoka.



ZBlastHistorySep 9, 2017 11:00 AM
Into the Internet!
Sep 9, 2017 10:42 AM
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This episode effectively broke the series for me. I'm glad Setsuna and Sota got some needed reconciliation and the world was saved at the final moment, but I'm still pissed at how the show let Altair got away with all the crap she has pulled. Even if she got reunited with her creator, that doesn't change the fact that she had to walk over many good people to make it happen. We'll never have justice for Mamika, Aliceteria, Selesia and Charon, the people who saw beauty in the world and fought tooth and nail to save it. Everything is about Altair and because of her sob story, the universe agreed with that narcissism. I might be underestimating the bond between Setsuna and Altair but I can't help but feel cheated that Altair was vindicated in the end. Her moral selfishness wasn't punished, it was rewarded. And with only one episode left, I don't know how this will work out.
Sep 9, 2017 10:44 AM

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i'm kinda speechless right now
Sep 9, 2017 10:47 AM

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This was awful story wise, but altair x setsuna yuri moments is good.
Sep 9, 2017 10:53 AM

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Nothing short of godly level emotions. I thought this episode would be some dull dialogue (it gave hints of that but..meh).The scene where Altair fights the train ( probably symbolizes fate) was super!!"If your existence causes this world to become warped, then I'll create another universe for you, in another world, in another story. And you'll write my story, in the story that I'll create, an infinite world... " That line killed me, I could hear the remaining fragments of my heart overheat and evaporate...
Sep 9, 2017 10:58 AM
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HeroVladimir93 said:
This episode effectively broke the series for me. I'm glad Setsuna and Sota got some needed reconciliation and the world was saved at the final moment, but I'm still pissed at how the show let Altair got away with all the crap she has pulled. Even if she got reunited with her creator, that doesn't change the fact that she had to walk over many good people to make it happen. We'll never have justice for Mamika, Aliceteria, Selesia and Charon, the people who saw beauty in the world and fought tooth and nail to save it. Everything is about Altair and because of her sob story, the universe agreed with that narcissism. I might be underestimating the bond between Setsuna and Altair but I can't help but feel cheated that Altair was vindicated in the end. Her moral selfishness wasn't punished, it was rewarded. And with only one episode left, I don't know how this will work out.



Actually, if you go back to episode 1, and think about who Souta is referring in the scene immediately after Setsuna commits suicide, its clear that he was talking about Altair. She was always going to be the main character, if the "main character" is meant as the "person who events revolve around."

This was always a story of what he saw and what happened to him.

Yeah, this ending is kinda crappy; it's a cop out. However it seems like in the song brave the ocean: "no revenge should govern our fate."
Sep 9, 2017 11:05 AM

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So talk no jutsu saved the world again ? xD

Very nice and emotional episode.

One Piece episode 914 & 915 & 1027 were a mistake and 957 brought the salvation - FMmatron


Sep 9, 2017 11:06 AM
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firemagnet said:
HeroVladimir93 said:
This episode effectively broke the series for me. I'm glad Setsuna and Sota got some needed reconciliation and the world was saved at the final moment, but I'm still pissed at how the show let Altair got away with all the crap she has pulled. Even if she got reunited with her creator, that doesn't change the fact that she had to walk over many good people to make it happen. We'll never have justice for Mamika, Aliceteria, Selesia and Charon, the people who saw beauty in the world and fought tooth and nail to save it. Everything is about Altair and because of her sob story, the universe agreed with that narcissism. I might be underestimating the bond between Setsuna and Altair but I can't help but feel cheated that Altair was vindicated in the end. Her moral selfishness wasn't punished, it was rewarded. And with only one episode left, I don't know how this will work out.



Actually, if you go back to episode 1, and think about who Souta is referring in the scene immediately after Setsuna commits suicide, its clear that he was talking about Altair. She was always going to be the main character, if the "main character" is meant as the "person who events revolve around."

This was always a story of what he saw and what happened to him.

Yeah, this ending is kinda crappy; it's a cop out. However it seems like in the song brave the ocean: "no revenge should govern our fate."


The show is asking us to think of Altair as a good person who forgot to be good and accept her pain and the way she chose to process it, but she used that pain to abuse others. To me at least, Altair wore her pain like a crown and abused others to get what she wanted. She wasn't a good person and even if she let go of her revenge, she still got what she wanted at the expense of good people who tried to show her a better way. I guess I'm too human to forgive and forget.
Sep 9, 2017 11:16 AM

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HeroVladimir93 said:
firemagnet said:



Actually, if you go back to episode 1, and think about who Souta is referring in the scene immediately after Setsuna commits suicide, its clear that he was talking about Altair. She was always going to be the main character, if the "main character" is meant as the "person who events revolve around."

This was always a story of what he saw and what happened to him.

Yeah, this ending is kinda crappy; it's a cop out. However it seems like in the song brave the ocean: "no revenge should govern our fate."


The show is asking us to think of Altair as a good person who forgot to be good and accept her pain and the way she chose to process it, but she used that pain to abuse others. To me at least, Altair wore her pain like a crown and abused others to get what she wanted. She wasn't a good person and even if she let go of her revenge, she still got what she wanted at the expense of good people who tried to show her a better way. I guess I'm too human to forgive and forget.


Altair didn't have what she wanted. The real Setsuna is dead and she didn't destroyed the world, the Setsuna with her is a fake with a personality based in what Souta knew about her. Altair accepted that she was a fake because even then, she was somehow Setsuna.
Sep 9, 2017 11:24 AM

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Fusion "Acceptance" is just a cheap tactic to make weak gems "Creators" stronger

Also RIP violin gun ;_;

Sep 9, 2017 11:26 AM

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so much feel this episode, its youtube time to see reaction mashup xD
Sep 9, 2017 11:33 AM

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My feels hurt....that's all I can say right now after watching this.
Don't believe the hype.
Sep 9, 2017 11:37 AM
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Standalone wise, this episode might be very heavy on the dialogue but for the second time in the series, I really enjoyed watching this week. The screenplay was beautiful in the first half of the episode and touching too, especially during the Sota moments.

Unfortunately this is definitely not enough to save the show for me and I seriously doubt the last episode is going to change anything too.
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Sep 9, 2017 11:37 AM

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Altair calling cheap while she is the most overpowered being in the universe lmao, was a good episode nonetheless, I am a bit sad that it turned out the cliche way.
Sep 9, 2017 11:39 AM
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There are still many questions left. In the interview they said that the last episode will be connected to 1. There they will most likely answer all our questions. And what now will do Magane is unknown.
Sep 9, 2017 11:55 AM
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caio_ken said:
HeroVladimir93 said:


The show is asking us to think of Altair as a good person who forgot to be good and accept her pain and the way she chose to process it, but she used that pain to abuse others. To me at least, Altair wore her pain like a crown and abused others to get what she wanted. She wasn't a good person and even if she let go of her revenge, she still got what she wanted at the expense of good people who tried to show her a better way. I guess I'm too human to forgive and forget.


Altair didn't have what she wanted. The real Setsuna is dead and she didn't destroyed the world, the Setsuna with her is a fake with a personality based in what Souta knew about her. Altair accepted that she was a fake because even then, she was somehow Setsuna.


I feel that analysis ignores the core premise of the show. This entire series was based on the idea that a story world is no less real than any other world. The Setsuna that Souta created may not be the Setsuna that died, but if you accept the core message of the show then you can't really call her fake. It's the same with every other creation in the series; they were each significantly more than the sum of their stories. I really liked the way Yuuya said it in an earlier episode; a creator is just the concept of fate with a personality tacked on.

With that in mind, had Souta created an empty caricature with Setsuna's face and voice, one who just tried to admonish Altair, then you would be perfectly correct to claim her a fake. However, that was not his intention. He explicitly said that he created the character of Setsuna to be the Setsuna he knew. This is why she could claim to have memories of things he could not have known about, just like all of the other creations could have lives, thoughts, and opinions beyond what the other creators could thing of. In the end, it all comes down to that one core idea; if you accept that a created world is no less real than the creator's world, then it all fits. If you don't, then I feel you missed the deepest and most interesting part of the story.

---

Also, a bunch of people are making the claim that the show wants to present Altair as a good person, which is a rather strange argument when even Altair's creator called her evil. I think it's more correct to say that the show wants to present Altair as a tragic, or sympathetic villain. She is a character that does bad things for reasons that the viewers should be able to understand and emphasize with, even if we don't agree with her actions. It's not about her forgetting to be good; her "god" literally created her while full of pain and hatred. Not only that, but having watched the episode there are a lot of hints that Altair was meant to be a sort of author-proxy, or even self-insertion character. Setsuna claimed that she filled Altair with all of her thoughts and emotions, which poses the question, what else is there to Altair beyond that base.

That said, all of Altair's actions make sense in the context within which she was created. She wanted to destroy the world, because hate was the only thing her creator left her with. When later she was given the chance to be reunited with her creator, she decided to abandon everything else and create an entirely new universe just for that sole purpose. It wasn't about abandoning revenge. It was about choosing what was most important. There's nothing to forgive or forget after that. As far as the main Re: Creators universe is concerned, both Altair and Setsuna are gone, the same way Selesia, Mamika, and Alicetaria are gone. All of their stories will continue in the minds of the people within that universe, but that's it. If someone is annoyed that they didn't see Altair bruised, beaten into the ground and left to bleed out in agony then that's an issue they need to work out for themselves. There's nothing reasonable about such a desire, though even the fact that the show managed to evoke that sort of feelings in some is a good indication about how powerful the it was.
TikiTDOSep 9, 2017 12:15 PM
Sep 9, 2017 12:00 PM

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HeroVladimir93 said:
This episode effectively broke the series for me. I'm glad Setsuna and Sota got some needed reconciliation and the world was saved at the final moment, but I'm still pissed at how the show let Altair got away with all the crap she has pulled. Even if she got reunited with her creator, that doesn't change the fact that she had to walk over many good people to make it happen. We'll never have justice for Mamika, Aliceteria, Selesia and Charon, the people who saw beauty in the world and fought tooth and nail to save it. Everything is about Altair and because of her sob story, the universe agreed with that narcissism. I might be underestimating the bond between Setsuna and Altair but I can't help but feel cheated that Altair was vindicated in the end. Her moral selfishness wasn't punished, it was rewarded. And with only one episode left, I don't know how this will work out.

Altair was a lost child in pain. She wasn't "rewarded", she was given compensation. Like a prayer that was answered.
"Vaut mieux se suffire à soi que finir assoiffé dans le monde des apparences."

Sep 9, 2017 12:05 PM
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I swear, it's a terrible day for rain...

Man, this episode. I didn't think Altair would actually be able to save Setsuna and create their own world. I wonder how the next episode will wrap everything up.
Sep 9, 2017 12:17 PM

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joshua10red said:
Amazing . I can't believe i cried the whole episode. This is already past beyond masterpiece. 1 more episode
It is official. Altair is the all time op character


I rofl'd at everyone who says that Altair is the most op character ever, more like the most asspulled character ever (she's not mach for Saiki tho)
"We could make the world better, but it's easier to just shut our eyes."
~Blackwall
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