Attack on Titan
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Nov 13, 2023 11:50 PM
#51
Reply to Madhav001
Fuhrer_Wrath said:
@Madhav001 They did compare it. People were literally saying it's as bad as GoT's ending. That's literally called comparing.
They also said that it be as poorly received as GoT ending. That it's ratings will drop. That it will become irrelevant like GoT.
They were making full on comparisons. You can go the S4P2 discussion and search for them if you want to.
I don't have the stamina or the inclination to do it myself but they are there.
People made clear cut comparisons between the 2 to get their point across and now I'm doing the same.
I'm not comparing the quality of the 2 am I? I'm not saying AoT is better than GoT?
I'm simply pointing out that AoT Ending did not have the same kind of reception as GoT ending.
There's no comparison except for their reception.
@Madhav001 They did compare it. People were literally saying it's as bad as GoT's ending. That's literally called comparing.
They also said that it be as poorly received as GoT ending. That it's ratings will drop. That it will become irrelevant like GoT.
They were making full on comparisons. You can go the S4P2 discussion and search for them if you want to.
I don't have the stamina or the inclination to do it myself but they are there.
People made clear cut comparisons between the 2 to get their point across and now I'm doing the same.
I'm not comparing the quality of the 2 am I? I'm not saying AoT is better than GoT?
I'm simply pointing out that AoT Ending did not have the same kind of reception as GoT ending.
There's no comparison except for their reception.
As I said if you are not comparing it's fine....
I did not see a lot of threads at that time due to the extreme number of them being created at that time, and hence did not see any thread comparing them, but I will believe you since you say they are still there.
But simple difference should be that They were foolish, you are not.
Why do the same foolishness?
I think the rating and reviews of the last ep are testimony of them being wrong sufficient in itself.
Maturity is when you realise,
Justification is not always needed.
Everything doesn't need to be said, something speaks louder than words, Silence it is.
An I know you are mature enough, but the frustrations, is what you wanted to get out probably.
| @Madhav001 I guess you can call it immaturity. Perhaps it is a bit immature of me but I was really frustrated too. I'm not an avid Anime watcher but I still watch some. And I never had anyone to talk to about the Animes I watched because literally none of my family or friends watch Anime. That's why I made my MAL account for the first time in 2021. Because I just wanted to talk about AoT. And you can imagine how good the S4P1 conversations were with people complaining about animation. And in 2022 during S4P2 it was absolutely ruined by Manga Readers consistently complaining about the ending. And a lot of them made GoT comparisons. It was the one time I tried having discussions about something I liked on the Internet(because I had no other option) and it was ruined by people who didn't like an ending which wasn't even adapted yet. So yeah I guess you can it petty. And it probably is. But I still want to do it. Because something was ruined for me that I wanted to just simply enjoy. And now I want to retaliate in some way. I don't insult them or call them names. I try to be as decent in my replies as I can. But I want to atleast tell them they were wrong. |
Nov 14, 2023 12:11 AM
#52
Reply to Fuhrer_Wrath
@MonsterSkas Dude you basically expanded on my point. I'm not saying that it's Imdb score increased because people loved the ending.
I'm saying it's Imdb rating increased because the ending worked for the show.
1. Exactly. And if the ending had a really bad WoM like GoT there wouldn't be a surge of new viewers. That's my point.
Clearly people are hearing good things about how the show ended that's why they are going for it.
2.yes a lot of people rate a show after it's ending. And if the ending was really so bad as to bring the whole anime down, as some people claim, then the people who rate the show after finishing would not have given it a good rating. Or atleast not as good as the show already had before the ending was released.
3. Yeah, I don't think people are changing their existing rating. That almost never happens.
4. Again my exact point. If people change the score to be better than clearly they think the ending works.
My point wasn't that the ending was universally beloved. Even on Imdb it sits at 8.6. And while that's still good it's far from the universally beloved AoT epsisodes which had ratings of 9+.
My point was that the ending itself while having some issues, clearly still works for most people as a satisfying conclusion to the overall story.
So it enhances the overall story because it feels complete.
Thus the positive word of mouth or increased ratings of the overall show.
I'm saying it's Imdb rating increased because the ending worked for the show.
1. Exactly. And if the ending had a really bad WoM like GoT there wouldn't be a surge of new viewers. That's my point.
Clearly people are hearing good things about how the show ended that's why they are going for it.
2.yes a lot of people rate a show after it's ending. And if the ending was really so bad as to bring the whole anime down, as some people claim, then the people who rate the show after finishing would not have given it a good rating. Or atleast not as good as the show already had before the ending was released.
3. Yeah, I don't think people are changing their existing rating. That almost never happens.
4. Again my exact point. If people change the score to be better than clearly they think the ending works.
My point wasn't that the ending was universally beloved. Even on Imdb it sits at 8.6. And while that's still good it's far from the universally beloved AoT epsisodes which had ratings of 9+.
My point was that the ending itself while having some issues, clearly still works for most people as a satisfying conclusion to the overall story.
So it enhances the overall story because it feels complete.
Thus the positive word of mouth or increased ratings of the overall show.
| @Fuhrer_Wrath I like how nicely you elaborate your points, that makes you a very good critic. However you'd have to go to imdb again and analyze the rating distribution in different regions of the final episode. It's actually received pretty well, not so high that I could say its universally beloved, but its still pretty high. It has a weighted score of 8.7 on Egypt, 9.0 on UK, 8.9 on India, 9.1 on United States, and 7.2 on Saudi Arabia unfortunately which unfortunately put the overall score down to 8.6. It seems like a planned review bombing was organized by some Saudi Arabian user(s) and hence the weighted score from that region appears low, but that's just an assumption. |
Nov 14, 2023 12:36 AM
#53
Reply to MonsterSkas
@Fuhrer_Wrath I like how nicely you elaborate your points, that makes you a very good critic. However you'd have to go to imdb again and analyze the rating distribution in different regions of the final episode. It's actually received pretty well, not so high that I could say its universally beloved, but its still pretty high. It has a weighted score of 8.7 on Egypt, 9.0 on UK, 8.9 on India, 9.1 on United States, and 7.2 on Saudi Arabia unfortunately which unfortunately put the overall score down to 8.6. It seems like a planned review bombing was organized by some Saudi Arabian user(s) and hence the weighted score from that region appears low, but that's just an assumption.
| @MonsterSkas Yeah I heard some Arab One Peace fans decided to review bomb the finale and some of the previous episodes. I think I saw a screenshot of a tweet from one Arab guy. Wierd people honestly. |
Nov 14, 2023 12:37 AM
#54
| @gazelle2580 Yes you are. |
Nov 15, 2023 12:42 AM
#55
Reply to Fuhrer_Wrath
@ktg No. AoT was never 9.3 on Imdb.
Yes it was 9.1 for a while but went back to 9.0 before the Finale aired.
Depends on where you are comparing with the earlier seasons. It's definitely better than some parts of the Earlier seasons.
I disagree with your take of Isayama doing Shonen start twice. Hell I disagree with the notion of Isayama doing it even once.
The first episode of AoT was not like the typical start of a shonen. That's what made AoT so popular. That it was different.
Nor do I think Isayama used old tropes and I do think the show got better and better with time.
Look the argument about how good AoT was or the ending was is irrelevant in this conversation.
It's based in subjective opinions. We can both be here arguing for hours based in subjective perception of the show.
That's not what this post is about. This post is just about the objective reception of the Finale from General Audiences.
Yes it was 9.1 for a while but went back to 9.0 before the Finale aired.
Depends on where you are comparing with the earlier seasons. It's definitely better than some parts of the Earlier seasons.
I disagree with your take of Isayama doing Shonen start twice. Hell I disagree with the notion of Isayama doing it even once.
The first episode of AoT was not like the typical start of a shonen. That's what made AoT so popular. That it was different.
Nor do I think Isayama used old tropes and I do think the show got better and better with time.
Look the argument about how good AoT was or the ending was is irrelevant in this conversation.
It's based in subjective opinions. We can both be here arguing for hours based in subjective perception of the show.
That's not what this post is about. This post is just about the objective reception of the Finale from General Audiences.
| @Fuhrer_Wrath I wasn't talking about the first episode, I was talking about the first half of S1. The old generic protag type is naive, not exactly the smartest and having big dreams. Goku: being strongest. Luffy: becoming the Pirate King. Naruto: becoming the Hokage. Eren: becoming a hero that fights against titans. Gabi: becoming a hero that fights against the people on the island. As for the start, the generic hero has an encounter when he/she still too weak to do anything and this becomes his motivation. In both Eren's and Gabi's case, this was the titan attack, but we've seen this in other cases where we don't have the generic protag type, like in KnY where demon kills Tanjiro's family. They usually mix and match more and less generic aspects of a shounen start and Isayam chose the most generic ones, because even Goku falls into this category. I can even name completely similar starts from other shows, like TTGL has the same start. SnK did get better and better until S4, where we've seen a similar outcome as in GoT. While the audience reacted differently, the parallels are still there. In S4 Isayama introduced several plot holes that downgraded the show. And no, I'm not talking about subjective opinions here. Fuhrer_Wrath said: Wether an average Anime is better than an average Western show is honestly a matter of subjective opinion. No. Again, I'm not talking about subjective things here. Animation on average is better because of the effects. An average show has average budget and with average budget a live action show's CGI effects are not that good. It does not work in that live action universe. While you could draw a bad effect, but it will still work in that universe, because everything is drawn. This also true for acting. An average actor is not that good, while you draw any face on a character. The only aspects where anime is objectively better compared to western animation is the VA'ing. |
Nov 15, 2023 2:31 AM
#56
Reply to ktg
@Fuhrer_Wrath I wasn't talking about the first episode, I was talking about the first half of S1.
The old generic protag type is naive, not exactly the smartest and having big dreams.
Goku: being strongest.
Luffy: becoming the Pirate King.
Naruto: becoming the Hokage.
Eren: becoming a hero that fights against titans.
Gabi: becoming a hero that fights against the people on the island.
As for the start, the generic hero has an encounter when he/she still too weak to do anything and this becomes his motivation. In both Eren's and Gabi's case, this was the titan attack, but we've seen this in other cases where we don't have the generic protag type, like in KnY where demon kills Tanjiro's family.
They usually mix and match more and less generic aspects of a shounen start and Isayam chose the most generic ones, because even Goku falls into this category.
I can even name completely similar starts from other shows, like TTGL has the same start.
SnK did get better and better until S4, where we've seen a similar outcome as in GoT. While the audience reacted differently, the parallels are still there. In S4 Isayama introduced several plot holes that downgraded the show.
And no, I'm not talking about subjective opinions here.
No. Again, I'm not talking about subjective things here.
Animation on average is better because of the effects. An average show has average budget and with average budget a live action show's CGI effects are not that good. It does not work in that live action universe.
While you could draw a bad effect, but it will still work in that universe, because everything is drawn.
This also true for acting. An average actor is not that good, while you draw any face on a character.
The only aspects where anime is objectively better compared to western animation is the VA'ing.
The old generic protag type is naive, not exactly the smartest and having big dreams.
Goku: being strongest.
Luffy: becoming the Pirate King.
Naruto: becoming the Hokage.
Eren: becoming a hero that fights against titans.
Gabi: becoming a hero that fights against the people on the island.
As for the start, the generic hero has an encounter when he/she still too weak to do anything and this becomes his motivation. In both Eren's and Gabi's case, this was the titan attack, but we've seen this in other cases where we don't have the generic protag type, like in KnY where demon kills Tanjiro's family.
They usually mix and match more and less generic aspects of a shounen start and Isayam chose the most generic ones, because even Goku falls into this category.
I can even name completely similar starts from other shows, like TTGL has the same start.
SnK did get better and better until S4, where we've seen a similar outcome as in GoT. While the audience reacted differently, the parallels are still there. In S4 Isayama introduced several plot holes that downgraded the show.
And no, I'm not talking about subjective opinions here.
Fuhrer_Wrath said:
Wether an average Anime is better than an average Western show is honestly a matter of subjective opinion.
Wether an average Anime is better than an average Western show is honestly a matter of subjective opinion.
No. Again, I'm not talking about subjective things here.
Animation on average is better because of the effects. An average show has average budget and with average budget a live action show's CGI effects are not that good. It does not work in that live action universe.
While you could draw a bad effect, but it will still work in that universe, because everything is drawn.
This also true for acting. An average actor is not that good, while you draw any face on a character.
The only aspects where anime is objectively better compared to western animation is the VA'ing.
| @ktg wasn't talking about the first episode, I was talking about the first half of S1. The old generic protag type is naive, not exactly the smartest and having big dreams. Yes in the start of AoT Eren has a Typical Shonen Protagonist like goal.(Though still I will say the goal of killing all your enemies is not a "Typical" Anime protagonist goal since most of them are more concerned with saving their enemies). But that's the point. It's to show how bad these tropey Shonen motivations can be if taken to an extreme. But that does not mean the Anime itself had Shonen tropes. Gabi: becoming a hero that fights against the people on the island. I disagree with Gabi. Her goal of becoming a hero lasted for all of 5 epsisodes. After that she just wanted revenge for her homeland bieng attacked. As for the start, the generic hero has an encounter when he/she still too weak to do anything and this becomes his motivation. In both Eren's and Gabi's case, this was the titan attack, Except thats not true at all. Eren's motivation was never that he was weak. His motivation waa his need for revenge for his mother's death and his wish for freedom. Eren reiterates this much multiple times in the First Season. This is the reason he gives for Joining The Survey Corps. Usually characters who's motivation is that they were too weak in the past, try to constantly get stronger. Eren doesn't do that. The guy just jumps head first into every situation. Eren's motivation is not at all like a typical The very start of the Anime is literally opposite of a typical Shonen. Unlike a typical Shonen Protagonist with a heart of Gold and noble goals Eren is literally an angry child whose goals are violent and stem from a place of hatred. Unlike a typical Shonen who maybe weak in the start but still has a knack for a special ability and unbreakable resolve Eren is shown to be Pathetic at ODM and he cries and eventually gets killed in his first major conflict. And unlike a typical Shonen Protagonist who has to work to achieve his abilities and powes Eren is literally just given immense power in the first half of the first Season. Same with Gabi. Her motivation is not that she's weak.(Hell she was the top of her class). Her motivation is simply hatred and revenge for the people who attacked her homeland. It's not like she realizes that she's weak and this motivates her to be strong. She literally goes on the enemy ship and shoots the first person she sees. That's as far from a typical anime protagonist as you can get. but we've seen this in other cases where we don't have the generic protag type, like in KnY where demon kills Tanjiro's family. KnY has the most typical Shonen Protagonist start ever. They usually mix and match more and less generic aspects of a shounen start and Isayam chose the most generic ones, because even Goku falls into this category. Except that he didn't. Isayama literally went in the opposite direction of a typical Shonen start. SnK did get better and better until S4, where we've seen a similar outcome as in GoT. Except that we didn't. AoT got even better in Season 4. It stumbled a bit in the Rumbling arc but nothing that could be called bad. And it actually reached peak again between S4P2 - Ep 12 and S4P3. The Finale while not perfect was still very good. While the audience reacted differently, the parallels are still there The audience reception is different because there are no parallels. S4 Isayama introduced several plot holes that downgraded the show. Except that he didn't. There are just some plot holes that exist in the finale. And even they are just a few. And not enough to effect the overall quality of the finale that much. Overall the Quality of Season 4 was great easily matching the Previous 3 Seasons with the Finale coming in slightly below but not enough to affect the overall quality of the show. And no, I'm not talking about subjective opinions here. It's literally all Subjective Opinions here. No. Again, I'm not talking about subjective things here. Yes you are even if you don't accept it. Animation on average is better because of the effects. This is again a very subjective Opinion. There are quiet a few people out there who don't think Animation on Average is better than Live Action effects. There is a reason that there are still a lot of people out there who refuse to watch Animated shows. Because in their opinion Animation is not better than Live Action. An average show has average budget and with average budget a live action show's CGI effects are not that good. It does not work in that live action universe. Same is true for Anime. The Average anime does not have really good animation. An average Anime usually has average animation. While you could draw a bad effect, but it will still work in that universe, because everything is drawn. Not if it's not drawn well. Just look at the complaints some of the most well animated popular shows like CSM and JJK are receiving. This also true for acting. An average actor is not that good, while you draw any face on a character. This again a matter of subjective opinion and what you consider good acting. In my opinion every average show has atleast a few really good actors. And even then the acting in an average show is still better than the "Acting" or Facial Animation in an average Anime. The only aspects where anime is objectively better compared to western animation is the VA'ing. This is something I can agree with. |
Nov 15, 2023 6:44 AM
#57
| Yeah, it turns out anime fans have even lesser standards than GOT fans. Who could have predicted that? Seeing as how most of the positive reviews and comments are coming from kids who were pre-school age when the manga started, I suspect that the same people would have rated GoT's final season highly as well. We'll have to wait 5+ years to see the real opinions formulate on this thing. It's going to be a long and slow process. |
Nov 15, 2023 2:56 PM
#58
Reply to Yang_Wenli
Yeah, it turns out anime fans have even lesser standards than GOT fans. Who could have predicted that? Seeing as how most of the positive reviews and comments are coming from kids who were pre-school age when the manga started, I suspect that the same people would have rated GoT's final season highly as well. We'll have to wait 5+ years to see the real opinions formulate on this thing. It's going to be a long and slow process.
| @Yang_Wenli I agree. There is always a recency bias of the shows. Even when the finale came out, it didn't pass FMAB when normally recent shows would. |
Nov 15, 2023 7:35 PM
#59
Fuhrer_Wrath said: @ghier Honestly the same is true for MAL. Hell I would say a lot of the more casual fans who have seen AoT and maybe a few other animes but aren't full blown Anime fans usually don't come to MAL to voice their opinions either. I mean yeah, but that doesn’t negate the point I made … And actually, I’m here specifically because it’s for anime, which I’m passionate about as a medium. I’m sure it’s the same for everyone else. People who go to IMDb… I doubt it’s out of passion for anything other than the show they are rating. Maybe movie critics still go there out of a passion for film though. |
ghierNov 15, 2023 7:41 PM
Nov 15, 2023 10:16 PM
#60
Reply to ghier
Fuhrer_Wrath said:
@ghier Honestly the same is true for MAL.
Hell I would say a lot of the more casual fans who have seen AoT and maybe a few other animes but aren't full blown Anime fans usually don't come to MAL to voice their opinions either.
@ghier Honestly the same is true for MAL.
Hell I would say a lot of the more casual fans who have seen AoT and maybe a few other animes but aren't full blown Anime fans usually don't come to MAL to voice their opinions either.
I mean yeah, but that doesn’t negate the point I made …
And actually, I’m here specifically because it’s for anime, which I’m passionate about as a medium. I’m sure it’s the same for everyone else. People who go to IMDb… I doubt it’s out of passion for anything other than the show they are rating. Maybe movie critics still go there out of a passion for film though.
| @ghier You're basically making the same point I am. As you said MAL is for people like you who are specifically passionate about the medium of Anime. And as a result it excludes people who may like an Anime but are not passionate about Anime as a whole. As again as you said people who go to rate shows on Imdb do it out of the passion for the show itself rather than a specific medium or genre. AoT in my opinion has grown way past just the Anime community. That's why to get a fair assessment of the opinions of the fans outside of the Anime Community I had to go to a source other than MAL. A source that is more mainstream. And that source was Imdb. |
Nov 15, 2023 11:38 PM
#61
| Who tf uses IMDb to rate anime lol. And comparing AoT to FMAB is straight up insult to FMAB. Also a protagonist being driven by revenge and being corrupted by power is not even original lol and by its own doesn't make the protagonist compelling (we redo of healer now? lol). PS: Tanjiro's infinitely more relatable and human than Eren. |
Nov 15, 2023 11:49 PM
#62
| On topic, not as bad as GoT, but still pretty bad IMO. Calling it opposite of GOT as title to thread may cause people to assume the ending made the series better when obviously it did not. |
Nov 16, 2023 12:56 AM
#63
Reply to raffyzita
Who tf uses IMDb to rate anime lol. And comparing AoT to FMAB is straight up insult to FMAB.
Also a protagonist being driven by revenge and being corrupted by power is not even original lol and by its own doesn't make the protagonist compelling (we redo of healer now? lol).
PS: Tanjiro's infinitely more relatable and human than Eren.
Also a protagonist being driven by revenge and being corrupted by power is not even original lol and by its own doesn't make the protagonist compelling (we redo of healer now? lol).
PS: Tanjiro's infinitely more relatable and human than Eren.
| @raffyzita I used Imdb to determine the general audiences reaction to AoT. And going by Imdb about 500K people rated AoT by Imdb. No comparing AoT to FMAB is not an insult to FMAB since both of them are very comparable in quality. No idea is original. You just praised FMAB and yet none of it's characters or themes are original in their ideas either. What matters is how they are presented and AoT presents it's ideas very well. The idea doesn't make the protagonist compelling the execution of the idea makes the character compelling. Also I haven't seen Redo of Hero but I do know the character was never a good guy corrupted by power. No, Tanjiro is the most clichéd Shonen protagonist. And if you prefer characters like Tanjiro I get why you didn't like AoT or Eren as a character. |
Nov 16, 2023 12:59 AM
#64
Reply to raffyzita
On topic, not as bad as GoT, but still pretty bad IMO. Calling it opposite of GOT as title to thread may cause people to assume the ending made the series better when obviously it did not.
| @raffyzita Well in my opinion it's the opposite of GOT. Not only is it not bad. It's actually really good. As reflected in it's Audience Reception. Calling it the opposite is exactly the purpose to convey that the ending did Infact make the Anime feel complete and enhanced it's experience. Which it obviously did. |
Nov 16, 2023 1:35 AM
#65
Reply to Fuhrer_Wrath
@raffyzita I used Imdb to determine the general audiences reaction to AoT.
And going by Imdb about 500K people rated AoT by Imdb.
No comparing AoT to FMAB is not an insult to FMAB since both of them are very comparable in quality.
No idea is original. You just praised FMAB and yet none of it's characters or themes are original in their ideas either. What matters is how they are presented and AoT presents it's ideas very well.
The idea doesn't make the protagonist compelling the execution of the idea makes the character compelling.
Also I haven't seen Redo of Hero but I do know the character was never a good guy corrupted by power.
No, Tanjiro is the most clichéd Shonen protagonist.
And if you prefer characters like Tanjiro I get why you didn't like AoT or Eren as a character.
And going by Imdb about 500K people rated AoT by Imdb.
No comparing AoT to FMAB is not an insult to FMAB since both of them are very comparable in quality.
No idea is original. You just praised FMAB and yet none of it's characters or themes are original in their ideas either. What matters is how they are presented and AoT presents it's ideas very well.
The idea doesn't make the protagonist compelling the execution of the idea makes the character compelling.
Also I haven't seen Redo of Hero but I do know the character was never a good guy corrupted by power.
No, Tanjiro is the most clichéd Shonen protagonist.
And if you prefer characters like Tanjiro I get why you didn't like AoT or Eren as a character.
| @Fuhrer_Wrath No they are not comparable in quality. FMAB didn't have to resort to time travel shenanigans to force twists and keep it vague to let the audience hamster their brain to make sense of it via predetermination, time paradox and other shit. No. Eren comes across as shallow and pathetic. There is nothing to learn from this person. He's basically a school shooter anime incarnate. Masking his world-ending tantrum with a "for freedom" bullshit. I find it hard to relate or even feel sympathy for such loser. To be like him, just don't do any work on yourself really basically. I don't know about you but Tanjiro's strength of character, as shown in the scene where the guy who got his fiance killed accused him of not knowing the pain and Tanjiro stood there, reminiscing his dead family, no doubt hurt by such words, but choosing to take that opportunity to console him, is admirable. That TOOK effort. That is noble. That is compelling. |
Nov 16, 2023 1:36 AM
#66
Reply to Fuhrer_Wrath
@raffyzita
Well in my opinion it's the opposite of GOT. Not only is it not bad. It's actually really good. As reflected in it's Audience Reception.
Calling it the opposite is exactly the purpose to convey that the ending did Infact make the Anime feel complete and enhanced it's experience.
Which it obviously did.
Well in my opinion it's the opposite of GOT. Not only is it not bad. It's actually really good. As reflected in it's Audience Reception.
Calling it the opposite is exactly the purpose to convey that the ending did Infact make the Anime feel complete and enhanced it's experience.
Which it obviously did.
| @Fuhrer_Wrath If I not mistaken you rated this season lower than the others, how does that hold up the "enhanced the experience" claim. |
Nov 16, 2023 2:32 AM
#67
| I think Game Of Thrones is a catchall reference for any series that ended poorly, much like how Nazis are considered the premier example of iredeemable and unquestionably evil. It is the easiest reference to make when someone wants to mention bad endings, even if the degree of "badness" is arguably quite different. Now while you could argue many things about how Attack on Titan went downhill in some respects before the ending, I think it is exaggerated to compare it to Game of Thrones's Season 7 and Season 8 levels of mediocrity to bullshit. Whatever means they arrived to its ending, I at least can say of Attack on Titan that even if I did not completely like the execution, the direction of its ending is fine with me. The issue I think I have the most with the ending is how many Eren apologists are out there; you have half the fanbase seeing the series as Eren becoming the villain while the other sees him as the marytr, despite it being fucking Mikasa who kills him in the end. I see no bigger condemnation of Eren as an individual than having who is arguably his most faithful companion ending him. |
PeripheralVisionNov 16, 2023 2:35 AM
| Auroraloose's Aurorasimp |
Nov 16, 2023 2:34 AM
#68
Reply to raffyzita
@Fuhrer_Wrath No they are not comparable in quality. FMAB didn't have to resort to time travel shenanigans to force twists and keep it vague to let the audience hamster their brain to make sense of it via predetermination, time paradox and other shit.
No. Eren comes across as shallow and pathetic. There is nothing to learn from this person. He's basically a school shooter anime incarnate. Masking his world-ending tantrum with a "for freedom" bullshit. I find it hard to relate or even feel sympathy for such loser. To be like him, just don't do any work on yourself really basically.
I don't know about you but Tanjiro's strength of character, as shown in the scene where the guy who got his fiance killed accused him of not knowing the pain and Tanjiro stood there, reminiscing his dead family, no doubt hurt by such words, but choosing to take that opportunity to console him, is admirable. That TOOK effort. That is noble. That is compelling.
No. Eren comes across as shallow and pathetic. There is nothing to learn from this person. He's basically a school shooter anime incarnate. Masking his world-ending tantrum with a "for freedom" bullshit. I find it hard to relate or even feel sympathy for such loser. To be like him, just don't do any work on yourself really basically.
I don't know about you but Tanjiro's strength of character, as shown in the scene where the guy who got his fiance killed accused him of not knowing the pain and Tanjiro stood there, reminiscing his dead family, no doubt hurt by such words, but choosing to take that opportunity to console him, is admirable. That TOOK effort. That is noble. That is compelling.
| @raffyzita Wether AoT and FMAB are comparable in quality is a matter of Subjective Opinion. In your opinion they are not. In my opinion they are. I don't think the Time Travel element is that convoluted or vague or unexplained in AoT. I got most of it. And FMAB did kind of convolute or break rule with it's own Power mechanism too. Like Edward using his own sole for transmutation, Edward trading his Alchemy for Alfonse, Pride bieng reborn, Father absorbing Truth, or all of the souls in Father bieng returned to dead people without any equivalent exchange etc. In my opinion Eren does not come of as Shallow but yes a little pathetic. But that's on purpose and a character bieng Pathetic doesn't make it a bad character. There is much to learn. The Folly of putting to much power in one person's hand, the folly of taking idealogies to an extreme, the effects of brain washing little kids with notions of Nationalism etc. A school shooter character can still be a great character if done well. I don't why it seems like your conflating a character bieng a bad person with it bieng a bad character. And even then Eren is more than that. Eren is more akin to the Afghani Child suicide bombers who attacked US forces. There was no masking. He admits to all of it. In the end it was indeed a childish decision stemming from his own childish warped desires taken to an extreme. Eren admits this much. Your not supposed to sympathize or relate to Eren. That's the point. He did something unforgivable. You're not supposed to relate to him. You're supposed to do the opposite of relate to him. He's an example of what happens when too much power goes in the hands of an ordinary person. Your supposed to try and be opposite to him. No, to be like him you have to obsessed with your singular ideas and give in to your violent tendencis. Which again your not supposed to be like him. Yes what Tanjiro does in the surface is admirable. But it's what a hundred other cliche Shonen protagonists do. It's no different from what Deku or Naruto would do. Amd it's very one note. A character who is just good, without any moral flaws who sympathizes with everyone, who tries to do the best for everyone. For me a more flawed and broken character like Eren who can't let go of his violent tendencies no matter how much he tries who would knowingly commit morally wrong acts because he deems them necessary to his goals is a much more interesting character. For me anyone who is just Noble or Just Morally Good is boring. I prefer more morally complex characters. |
Nov 16, 2023 2:43 AM
#69
Reply to raffyzita
@Fuhrer_Wrath If I not mistaken you rated this season lower than the others, how does that hold up the "enhanced the experience" claim.
| @raffyzita Because ending when taken as a part of the whole show is greater than the sum of it's parts in my opinion. For me the ending on it's own is good but has some problems. Like the whole Ymir/Mikasa thing. It's a solid 8/10. But as a finale to a show, for me it makes the show feel comolete. It delivers on the themes and narrative and provides satisfactory character conclusions. So as a result the show as a whole feels more complete and this enhances the experience. For me it's like the finale of TBBT(The Big Bang Theory). Now by the time that show ended it had already run it's course. And it's Finale was not perfect by any stretch. But the finale gave satisfying conclusion to it's characters and their friendship ans what the show was about. Doesn't matter if it did it in a clunky way. That's why most fans loved the ending of TBBT. Because they were rewarded for their wait. And now anytime someone is rewatching the show they have the satisfaction that in the end the stroy ends in a great place. |
Nov 16, 2023 8:24 PM
#70
Fuhrer_Wrath said: @ghier You're basically making the same point I am. As you said MAL is for people like you who are specifically passionate about the medium of Anime. And as a result it excludes people who may like an Anime but are not passionate about Anime as a whole. As again as you said people who go to rate shows on Imdb do it out of the passion for the show itself rather than a specific medium or genre. AoT in my opinion has grown way past just the Anime community. That's why to get a fair assessment of the opinions of the fans outside of the Anime Community I had to go to a source other than MAL. A source that is more mainstream. And that source was Imdb. You don’t seem to understand that it isn’t mainstream to rate on it though … the fans have to be passionate enough That rating is horribly inflated. You might as well have referenced the IGN review. People do not actually think it’s that good. |
Nov 16, 2023 8:49 PM
#71
Reply to ghier
Fuhrer_Wrath said:
@ghier You're basically making the same point I am.
As you said MAL is for people like you who are specifically passionate about the medium of Anime.
And as a result it excludes people who may like an Anime but are not passionate about Anime as a whole.
As again as you said people who go to rate shows on Imdb do it out of the passion for the show itself rather than a specific medium or genre.
AoT in my opinion has grown way past just the Anime community.
That's why to get a fair assessment of the opinions of the fans outside of the Anime Community I had to go to a source other than MAL. A source that is more mainstream.
And that source was Imdb.
@ghier You're basically making the same point I am.
As you said MAL is for people like you who are specifically passionate about the medium of Anime.
And as a result it excludes people who may like an Anime but are not passionate about Anime as a whole.
As again as you said people who go to rate shows on Imdb do it out of the passion for the show itself rather than a specific medium or genre.
AoT in my opinion has grown way past just the Anime community.
That's why to get a fair assessment of the opinions of the fans outside of the Anime Community I had to go to a source other than MAL. A source that is more mainstream.
And that source was Imdb.
You don’t seem to understand that it isn’t mainstream to rate on it though … the fans have to be passionate enough
That rating is horribly inflated. You might as well have referenced the IGN review. People do not actually think it’s that good.
| @ghier Except that it is mainstream. AoT on Imdb has almost 500K votes. That's easily comparable to some of the biggest shows on Imdb.(Not THE BIGGEST though). AoT is pretty much treated like a Mainstream show now. AoT rating on Imdb is about as inflated as anyother show on Imdb. It's not at all comparable to IGN since IGN doesn't compile mass audience scores. People do actually think it's that good. That's why they rated it that high. Otherwise what you're saying is that people don't actually think The Sopranos, The Wire or Better Call Saul is that good. They just rate it high because they are passionate fans. |
Nov 17, 2023 1:00 AM
#72
Reply to Fuhrer_Wrath
@ktg
Yes in the start of AoT Eren has a Typical Shonen Protagonist like goal.(Though still I will say the goal of killing all your enemies is not a "Typical" Anime protagonist goal since most of them are more concerned with saving their enemies).
But that's the point. It's to show how bad these tropey Shonen motivations can be if taken to an extreme.
But that does not mean the Anime itself had Shonen tropes.
I disagree with Gabi. Her goal of becoming a hero lasted for all of 5 epsisodes. After that she just wanted revenge for her homeland bieng attacked.
Except thats not true at all.
Eren's motivation was never that he was weak. His motivation waa his need for revenge for his mother's death and his wish for freedom. Eren reiterates this much multiple times in the First Season. This is the reason he gives for Joining The Survey Corps.
Usually characters who's motivation is that they were too weak in the past, try to constantly get stronger. Eren doesn't do that. The guy just jumps head first into every situation.
Eren's motivation is not at all like a typical
The very start of the Anime is literally opposite of a typical Shonen.
Unlike a typical Shonen Protagonist with a heart of Gold and noble goals Eren is literally an angry child whose goals are violent and stem from a place of hatred.
Unlike a typical Shonen who maybe weak in the start but still has a knack for a special ability and unbreakable resolve Eren is shown to be Pathetic at ODM and he cries and eventually gets killed in his first major conflict.
And unlike a typical Shonen Protagonist who has to work to achieve his abilities and powes Eren is literally just given immense power in the first half of the first Season.
Same with Gabi. Her motivation is not that she's weak.(Hell she was the top of her class).
Her motivation is simply hatred and revenge for the people who attacked her homeland.
It's not like she realizes that she's weak and this motivates her to be strong.
She literally goes on the enemy ship and shoots the first person she sees.
That's as far from a typical anime protagonist as you can get.
KnY has the most typical Shonen Protagonist start ever.
Except that he didn't. Isayama literally went in the opposite direction of a typical Shonen start.
Except that we didn't. AoT got even better in Season 4. It stumbled a bit in the Rumbling arc but nothing that could be called bad. And it actually reached peak again between S4P2 - Ep 12 and S4P3.
The Finale while not perfect was still very good.
The audience reception is different because there are no parallels.
Except that he didn't. There are just some plot holes that exist in the finale. And even they are just a few. And not enough to effect the overall quality of the finale that much.
Overall the Quality of Season 4 was great easily matching the Previous 3 Seasons with the Finale coming in slightly below but not enough to affect the overall quality of the show.
It's literally all Subjective Opinions here.
Yes you are even if you don't accept it.
This is again a very subjective Opinion. There are quiet a few people out there who don't think Animation on Average is better than Live Action effects. There is a reason that there are still a lot of people out there who refuse to watch Animated shows. Because in their opinion Animation is not better than Live Action.
Same is true for Anime. The Average anime does not have really good animation. An average Anime usually has average animation.
Not if it's not drawn well. Just look at the complaints some of the most well animated popular shows like CSM and JJK are receiving.
This again a matter of subjective opinion and what you consider good acting.
In my opinion every average show has atleast a few really good actors.
And even then the acting in an average show is still better than the "Acting" or Facial Animation in an average Anime.
This is something I can agree with.
wasn't talking about the first episode, I was talking about the first half of S1.
The old generic protag type is naive, not exactly the smartest and having big dreams.
The old generic protag type is naive, not exactly the smartest and having big dreams.
Yes in the start of AoT Eren has a Typical Shonen Protagonist like goal.(Though still I will say the goal of killing all your enemies is not a "Typical" Anime protagonist goal since most of them are more concerned with saving their enemies).
But that's the point. It's to show how bad these tropey Shonen motivations can be if taken to an extreme.
But that does not mean the Anime itself had Shonen tropes.
Gabi: becoming a hero that fights against the people on the island.
I disagree with Gabi. Her goal of becoming a hero lasted for all of 5 epsisodes. After that she just wanted revenge for her homeland bieng attacked.
As for the start, the generic hero has an encounter when he/she still too weak to do anything and this becomes his motivation. In both Eren's and Gabi's case, this was the titan attack,
Except thats not true at all.
Eren's motivation was never that he was weak. His motivation waa his need for revenge for his mother's death and his wish for freedom. Eren reiterates this much multiple times in the First Season. This is the reason he gives for Joining The Survey Corps.
Usually characters who's motivation is that they were too weak in the past, try to constantly get stronger. Eren doesn't do that. The guy just jumps head first into every situation.
Eren's motivation is not at all like a typical
The very start of the Anime is literally opposite of a typical Shonen.
Unlike a typical Shonen Protagonist with a heart of Gold and noble goals Eren is literally an angry child whose goals are violent and stem from a place of hatred.
Unlike a typical Shonen who maybe weak in the start but still has a knack for a special ability and unbreakable resolve Eren is shown to be Pathetic at ODM and he cries and eventually gets killed in his first major conflict.
And unlike a typical Shonen Protagonist who has to work to achieve his abilities and powes Eren is literally just given immense power in the first half of the first Season.
Same with Gabi. Her motivation is not that she's weak.(Hell she was the top of her class).
Her motivation is simply hatred and revenge for the people who attacked her homeland.
It's not like she realizes that she's weak and this motivates her to be strong.
She literally goes on the enemy ship and shoots the first person she sees.
That's as far from a typical anime protagonist as you can get.
but we've seen this in other cases where we don't have the generic protag type, like in KnY where demon kills Tanjiro's family.
KnY has the most typical Shonen Protagonist start ever.
They usually mix and match more and less generic aspects of a shounen start and Isayam chose the most generic ones, because even Goku falls into this category.
Except that he didn't. Isayama literally went in the opposite direction of a typical Shonen start.
SnK did get better and better until S4, where we've seen a similar outcome as in GoT.
Except that we didn't. AoT got even better in Season 4. It stumbled a bit in the Rumbling arc but nothing that could be called bad. And it actually reached peak again between S4P2 - Ep 12 and S4P3.
The Finale while not perfect was still very good.
While the audience reacted differently, the parallels are still there
The audience reception is different because there are no parallels.
S4 Isayama introduced several plot holes that downgraded the show.
Except that he didn't. There are just some plot holes that exist in the finale. And even they are just a few. And not enough to effect the overall quality of the finale that much.
Overall the Quality of Season 4 was great easily matching the Previous 3 Seasons with the Finale coming in slightly below but not enough to affect the overall quality of the show.
And no, I'm not talking about subjective opinions here.
It's literally all Subjective Opinions here.
No. Again, I'm not talking about subjective things here.
Yes you are even if you don't accept it.
Animation on average is better because of the effects.
This is again a very subjective Opinion. There are quiet a few people out there who don't think Animation on Average is better than Live Action effects. There is a reason that there are still a lot of people out there who refuse to watch Animated shows. Because in their opinion Animation is not better than Live Action.
An average show has average budget and with average budget a live action show's CGI effects are not that good. It does not work in that live action universe.
Same is true for Anime. The Average anime does not have really good animation. An average Anime usually has average animation.
While you could draw a bad effect, but it will still work in that universe, because everything is drawn.
Not if it's not drawn well. Just look at the complaints some of the most well animated popular shows like CSM and JJK are receiving.
This also true for acting. An average actor is not that good, while you draw any face on a character.
This again a matter of subjective opinion and what you consider good acting.
In my opinion every average show has atleast a few really good actors.
And even then the acting in an average show is still better than the "Acting" or Facial Animation in an average Anime.
The only aspects where anime is objectively better compared to western animation is the VA'ing.
This is something I can agree with.
Fuhrer_Wrath said: Yes in the start of AoT Eren has a Typical Shonen Protagonist like goal.(Though still I will say the goal of killing all your enemies is not a "Typical" Anime protagonist goal since most of them are more concerned with saving their enemies). But that's the point. It's to show how bad these tropey Shonen motivations can be if taken to an extreme. But that does not mean the Anime itself had Shonen tropes. No, most of them has no enemies based on their goal. Becoming the Pirate king or Hokage says nothing about your enemies. And no, Eren is not extreme. Every shounen protagonist goal is extreme, that's the point. Naruto is a weak and not very talented who wants to become the strongest and most respected man in the village. It is the same as Eren's dream, where we see that humans are weak, made no progress against the titans and Eren is saying that he will kill all of them. This 2 dreams are technically the same. An extreme dream by weak, naive kids. Fuhrer_Wrath said: I disagree with Gabi. Her goal of becoming a hero lasted for all of 5 epsisodes. After that she just wanted revenge for her homeland bieng attacked. Again, it is not true. The revenge was part of being a hero. You are actually split things that belong together. Gabi was okay with the revenge, because she thought bad guys did it. When she learned about the truth, the motivation for revenge still existed, because it's already happened. What changed was actually how to accept getting a revenge. So no, Gabi's dream was the same, or more like Gabi's dream changed the same amount as Eren's and that's a typical shounen protag start. Eren originally didn't hate that much the titans. He has never even met them. His deep hatred comes from the first encounter which is a shounen start encounter, where the protag's family, friends etc got hurt. This happened with Gabi too. Fuhrer_Wrath said: Except thats not true at all. Eren's motivation was never that he was weak. His motivation waa his need for revenge for his mother's death and his wish for freedom. That is not true. Firstly, I've never said that his motivation was that he was weak. I said that the character was weak. It has nothing to do with the motivation, just pointed out that usually we start with a weak protag, that's a typical shounen start. The motivation is a different thing and originally Eren was not talking about getting revenge. He wanted to be a hero, like it was a pure dream, the same way as it was originally in Gabi's case. Secondly, you are mixing things up again. If he wasn't weak, then I could mean that Eren would have been able to save his mother or kill the titans. So being weak is a crucial part in a generic shounen start. That's why for example, One Punch Man doesn't have a generic shounen start. Fuhrer_Wrath said: The very start of the Anime is literally opposite of a typical Shonen. Unlike a typical Shonen Protagonist with a heart of Gold and noble goals Eren is literally an angry child whose goals are violent and stem from a place of hatred. Firstly, no, typical shounen's protag does not necessary have a gold heart. Most of the time, they are pretty selfish, becoming the pirate king, hokage, being the best in something. These are selfish dreams and they don't care about others originally. Secondly, Eren's original goal was more noble, because, again, Eren wanted to be a hero who saves humanity. Originally it had nothing to do with revenge or hate. Fuhrer_Wrath said: Unlike a typical Shonen who maybe weak in the start but still has a knack for a special ability and unbreakable resolve Eren is shown to be Pathetic at ODM and he cries and eventually gets killed in his first major conflict. Again, not true. Look at Naruto, he was the weakest in his class that's why he was in the same team as Sasuke. In many cases, the typical shounen protag is actually pathetic. Naruto is great example, but even in One Piece where Luffy is originally relatively strong, he lacks in everything else. Usually how the author solve this is they give a unique thing to the protag and later turns out that it is not that unique. Naruto having the kyuubi, Luffy with the devil's fruit and Eren having the Shingeki no Kyojin. This was very typical shounen idea. Btw, Eren's ODM gear example is quite bad actually, we know that the gear had problems. Fuhrer_Wrath said: And unlike a typical Shonen Protagonist who has to work to achieve his abilities and powes Eren is literally just given immense power in the first half of the first Season. Again, no, Naruto did not work for the kyuubi, Luffy did not work for the devil's fruit, and Eren did not work for the titan power. In JJK, Itadori did not work for Sukuna. The usual is that they got those powers for free, but they work to master it. It is true in all cases. This is the typical shounen route. Fuhrer_Wrath said: Same with Gabi. Her motivation is not that she's weak.(Hell she was the top of her class). Her motivation is simply hatred and revenge for the people who attacked her homeland. Again, no, that was later. The original motivation was to help his people, like Eren wanted to do that too. But I'm not gonna repeat all that stuff, read everything again that I said above. Fuhrer_Wrath said: KnY has the most typical Shonen Protagonist start ever Sadly no. KnY is actually quite a new. First, usually in the first encounter there are no survivors like Nezuko. Second, even if there is one which is already quite unique, they don't "change side". So having Nezuko as a demon is fairly unique take. Secondly, the protag is rarely selfless like Tanjiro. It is actually a really new aspect. Usually protag's have big dream, Goku being the strongest, Naruto becoming Hokage, Luffy becoming Pirate King, Eren saving, freeing humanity, but Tanjiro just simply wants to live with his family. That is pretty new. Thirdly, Tanjiro does not have a really unique ability like the characters above. The best he has is a bit better smell which is not that unique in that universe and some knowledge about a dance that will be useful later on. There are 2 "typical" shounen protag if you like it that way. The old is Eren, Goku, Luffy, Naruto, almost everyone. And in the last couple years, we started to see more of this new type, where the protag is selfless and just wants to live happily without any big dream. He does not wants to find his dad (like Gon), simply living, that's all. This include protags like Tanjiro or Midoriya from BnHA. Fuhrer_Wrath said: Except that he didn't. Isayama literally went in the opposite direction of a typical Shonen start. No, you just know what a typical start is. We literally saw a TTGL start again. Fuhrer_Wrath said: Except that we didn't. AoT got even better in Season 4. It stumbled a bit in the Rumbling arc but nothing that could be called bad. And it actually reached peak again between S4P2 - Ep 12 and S4P3. The Finale while not perfect was still very good. Again, sadly no. Objectively speaking while S4 P1 was still okay story-wise, the animation itself was already questionable. While the biggest plot holes were introduced in S4 P2 that made the characters really stupid. And S4 P3 didn't help in that either. So yes, a show full of plot holes at that end, can be called bad. (And the finale was also stolen from Code Geass, but badly executed, which was expected from Isayama at this point. To be fair, MAPPA could have solved some plot holes or stupid things, but decided not to change even small details.) Fuhrer_Wrath said: The audience reception is different because there are no parallels. Argument LVL 500. Look, if you can't say anything, then don't say it. It's just pathetic at this point. Fuhrer_Wrath said: Except that he didn't. There are just some plot holes that exist in the finale. And even they are just a few. And not enough to effect the overall quality of the finale that much. Overall the Quality of Season 4 was great easily matching the Previous 3 Seasons with the Finale coming in slightly below but not enough to affect the overall quality of the show. It has a huge effect on it, because if we don't ignore those plot holes, then... Firstly, there were like 10 episodes that would have never happened. One of the plot holes made us wait almost a season. That is literally stupid. Secondly, the ending would have been different. Completely different. Fuhrer_Wrath said: It's literally all Subjective Opinions here. No, having plot holes in it or not is objective. Accepting plot convenience is subjective. Those are two different things. Fuhrer_Wrath said: Yes you are even if you don't accept it. No, even if you don't accept it. See? This is why we don't argue with stupid takes like this. Plot holes are not subjective. Plot holes are things that knowing the rules of the universe do not work in that universe. For example, if you have a clever character and was introduced as a clever character, but acts stupidly for no reason, then we are talking about objectively a plot hole. Fuhrer_Wrath said: This is again a very subjective Opinion. There are quiet a few people out there who don't think Animation on Average is better than Live Action effects. There is a reason that there are still a lot of people out there who refuse to watch Animated shows. Because in their opinion Animation is not better than Live Action. There were many people 500 years ago who thought the Earth was flat. Believe me the Earth did not change its shape, because of them. When I talk about "good" or "better" here, I meant compatibility with the universe. If you draw an explosion in a drawn world, then it will work. So, again, it is still objectively true. Fuhrer_Wrath said: Same is true for Anime. The Average anime does not have really good animation. An average Anime usually has average animation. Okay, at this point I can clearly say that, you can't read. I was not comparing it to animation, I was comparing it to live action. As an average anime with average animation, the explosion still works in that show, because it is drawn. If the characters, the backgrounds, the explosions are drawn, then those things work together in that universe. But when you have reality and an average explosion that can be seen, then you would be able to tell that explosion is not the reality, which lowers quality. Last time I had to explain it so simplistically was when I was talking to a kindergarten kid... Holy shit... Fuhrer_Wrath said: Not if it's not drawn well. Just look at the complaints some of the most well animated popular shows like CSM and JJK are receiving. Again, you can't read. I was not talking about complaining about quality. I was talking about working in that universe. These complains about CSM and JJK is not about how those effects does not work because so different compared to other scenes. Almost all of your take can be explained by how you don't understand things and mixing up things. And btw, JJK S2 and CSM quality-wise are not that good, but it is still not about having effects that do not work in that universe. It is simply about it's not being as great as it could have been. Fuhrer_Wrath said: This again a matter of subjective opinion and what you consider good acting. In my opinion every average show has atleast a few really good actors. And even then the acting in an average show is still better than the "Acting" or Facial Animation in an average Anime. No, it is again a factual thing. A good actor can cry, but bad actors can't, while every anime character can cry, because it is drawn. I agree that there are a few good actors or can be, but usually there are some bad ones. While in anime, like said, every character can "act" well, because their acting is drawn. And btw, because you still can't read. I was not talking about facial animation. We are not talking about fluidity. When we are talking about acting, it's abou conveying feelings. If you are sad, you cry, if you are happy, you smile. These are better in animations, because you can literally draw that feeling, while a bad actor can't cry. |
Nov 20, 2023 1:01 AM
#73
| IMDB makes sense in that case to see the ratings of general audience even if it’s not exactly general audience because general audience wouldn’t go as far as rating a series. On MAL it’s even less general audience. And that’s also where most of the manga haters will go to review bomb. Both are not really reliable but gives an idea. I would say that the exact number doesn’t matter because if it’s controversial, it might fluctuate quite a lot. But it gives a general idea if it’s trash, good or great. With its scores, we can pretty much say AOT is great. I would also add that anyone giving it a score of 1 is a joke and a hater. You have never seen something scored lower than 50% if you really think that’s a 1 out of 5 or out of 10 |
Dec 10, 2023 2:03 AM
#74
Reply to Ayanokamisama
Soon it will surpass Breaking Bad, Band of the brothers & Chernobyl man trust me
| You smoking something? Fma is still rated higher than aot lmao https://m.imdb.com/chart/toptv/?ref_=tt_awd Ayanokamisama said: Soon it will surpass Breaking Bad, Band of the brothers & Chernobyl man trust me Have some shame before you type filth like this |
Dec 10, 2023 8:34 AM
#75
Reply to Boruto_Fiction
You smoking something?
Fma is still rated higher than aot lmao
https://m.imdb.com/chart/toptv/?ref_=tt_awd
Have some shame before you type filth like this
Fma is still rated higher than aot lmao
https://m.imdb.com/chart/toptv/?ref_=tt_awd
Ayanokamisama said:
Soon it will surpass Breaking Bad, Band of the brothers & Chernobyl man trust me
Soon it will surpass Breaking Bad, Band of the brothers & Chernobyl man trust me
Have some shame before you type filth like this
| @Boruto_Fiction Just wanted to point out that even going by the list you provided AoT is technically above FMAB. Despite AoT for some reason bieng put on number 24 in this list(and below a show with 9.0 Score) both AoT and FMAB have 9.1 score. But AoT has more overall votes which puts it ahead of FMAB. An error remedied in this list. https://www.imdb.com/search/title/?title_type=tv_series&sort=user_rating,desc&num_votes=100000, |
Dec 10, 2023 8:38 PM
#76
Reply to Fuhrer_Wrath
@Boruto_Fiction Just wanted to point out that even going by the list you provided AoT is technically above FMAB.
Despite AoT for some reason bieng put on number 24 in this list(and below a show with 9.0 Score) both AoT and FMAB have 9.1 score.
But AoT has more overall votes which puts it ahead of FMAB.
An error remedied in this list.
https://www.imdb.com/search/title/?title_type=tv_series&sort=user_rating,desc&num_votes=100000,
Despite AoT for some reason bieng put on number 24 in this list(and below a show with 9.0 Score) both AoT and FMAB have 9.1 score.
But AoT has more overall votes which puts it ahead of FMAB.
An error remedied in this list.
https://www.imdb.com/search/title/?title_type=tv_series&sort=user_rating,desc&num_votes=100000,
| @Fuhrer_Wrath "error remedied" you are so funny In my link the search results are by "rankings" while in your search results the filter is by "user ratings" Rankings is the better filter because it is the one criteria that shows up on the series' imdb page Fmab is higher than aot whether you like it or not Observe their pages and see which series had a higher position number after the "top tv rated" text https://m.imdb.com/title/tt1355642/ https://m.imdb.com/title/tt2560140/ |
Boruto_FictionDec 10, 2023 9:27 PM
Dec 11, 2023 6:18 AM
#77
Reply to Boruto_Fiction
@Fuhrer_Wrath
"error remedied" you are so funny
In my link the search results are by "rankings" while in your search results the filter is by "user ratings"
Rankings is the better filter because it is the one criteria that shows up on the series' imdb page
Fmab is higher than aot whether you like it or not
Observe their pages and see which series had a higher position number after the "top tv rated" text
https://m.imdb.com/title/tt1355642/
https://m.imdb.com/title/tt2560140/
"error remedied" you are so funny
In my link the search results are by "rankings" while in your search results the filter is by "user ratings"
Rankings is the better filter because it is the one criteria that shows up on the series' imdb page
Fmab is higher than aot whether you like it or not
Observe their pages and see which series had a higher position number after the "top tv rated" text
https://m.imdb.com/title/tt1355642/
https://m.imdb.com/title/tt2560140/
| @Boruto_Fiction Ranking by what? Ranking has to be by a standard. What is it ranked by in your list? In your list we have multiple instances of shows with higher rating bieng lower than shows with lower rating. Your list is absolutely arbitrary as it doesn't provide any criteria by which the shows are ranked. My list is also a ranking. Except it has a proper criteria. Shows are ranked by their user rating and by the number of votes. And only shows with a 100,000 Votes are counted. The user rating is the entire point of Imdb. Just because your list arbitrarily puts shows where ever it wants without any set criteria doesn't make it better. It makes it worse. I did see their pages. And in their pages it refers their position on an arbitrary list by "Ranking" without any mention of how that ranking is achieved. And that very list you provided has a sort by option where you can sort by User rating and it shows AoT above FMAB. And the very page where their ranking is mentioned you can see their User rating is showed on Top. Meaning their user rating is more important since it's above all else. So in the end the "Ranking" is just one option of listing Imdb provides. That very list provides the option of listing by User rating where AoT is above FMAB. There is no evidence of one list bieng better than the other. Both are list Imdb provides on its main page. |
Dec 11, 2023 8:38 AM
#78
Reply to Fuhrer_Wrath
@Boruto_Fiction Ranking by what? Ranking has to be by a standard. What is it ranked by in your list?
In your list we have multiple instances of shows with higher rating bieng lower than shows with lower rating.
Your list is absolutely arbitrary as it doesn't provide any criteria by which the shows are ranked.
My list is also a ranking. Except it has a proper criteria. Shows are ranked by their user rating and by the number of votes. And only shows with a 100,000 Votes are counted.
The user rating is the entire point of Imdb.
Just because your list arbitrarily puts shows where ever it wants without any set criteria doesn't make it better. It makes it worse.
I did see their pages. And in their pages it refers their position on an arbitrary list by "Ranking" without any mention of how that ranking is achieved.
And that very list you provided has a sort by option where you can sort by User rating and it shows AoT above FMAB.
And the very page where their ranking is mentioned you can see their User rating is showed on Top.
Meaning their user rating is more important since it's above all else.
So in the end the "Ranking" is just one option of listing Imdb provides. That very list provides the option of listing by User rating where AoT is above FMAB.
There is no evidence of one list bieng better than the other. Both are list Imdb provides on its main page.
In your list we have multiple instances of shows with higher rating bieng lower than shows with lower rating.
Your list is absolutely arbitrary as it doesn't provide any criteria by which the shows are ranked.
My list is also a ranking. Except it has a proper criteria. Shows are ranked by their user rating and by the number of votes. And only shows with a 100,000 Votes are counted.
The user rating is the entire point of Imdb.
Just because your list arbitrarily puts shows where ever it wants without any set criteria doesn't make it better. It makes it worse.
I did see their pages. And in their pages it refers their position on an arbitrary list by "Ranking" without any mention of how that ranking is achieved.
And that very list you provided has a sort by option where you can sort by User rating and it shows AoT above FMAB.
And the very page where their ranking is mentioned you can see their User rating is showed on Top.
Meaning their user rating is more important since it's above all else.
So in the end the "Ranking" is just one option of listing Imdb provides. That very list provides the option of listing by User rating where AoT is above FMAB.
There is no evidence of one list bieng better than the other. Both are list Imdb provides on its main page.
@Fuhrer_Wrath  Me (1st image) Fma has #17 rank on its imdb page Aot has #24 rank on its imdb page So fma is ranked higher than aot You (2nd image) Ranking by what User rating is the true point AOT ABOVE FMAB |
Dec 11, 2023 9:36 AM
#79
Reply to Boruto_Fiction
@Fuhrer_Wrath
Me (1st image)
Fma has #17 rank on its imdb page
Aot has #24 rank on its imdb page
So fma is ranked higher than aot
You (2nd image)
Ranking by what
User rating is the true point
AOT ABOVE FMAB
Me (1st image)
Fma has #17 rank on its imdb page
Aot has #24 rank on its imdb page
So fma is ranked higher than aot
You (2nd image)
Ranking by what
User rating is the true point
AOT ABOVE FMAB
| @Boruto_Fiction So no real argument? Sure. By Ranking FMAB is higher. By user rating AoT is higher. Both lists provided by Imdb on their main page. What exactly did you refute here? But I'm glad you atleast put some effort in your art project. |
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