Enel VS Kizaru

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Aug 2012

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Characters: Enel VS Kizaru
Location: Marineford, frozen sea
Initial distance: 50 meters

Who would win?

Mar 6, 2014 10:06 AM

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Nov 2013

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Kizaru stomps.

SCARY MONSTER

Mar 6, 2014 10:37 AM

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Aug 2012

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Why.

Mar 6, 2014 10:59 AM

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Nov 2013

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Kizaru is a lightman which means he's way faster than Enel, being an admiral he also has haki mastery meaning he can bypass Enel's logia who was weak enough physically to get beaten by Luffy back in Skypiea. Enel's lightning won't work on Kizaru because he only knows observation haki. Kizaru is a top tier, Enel is fodder compared to him.

SCARY MONSTER

Mar 6, 2014 7:27 PM

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In first place:

Enel is a genius when it comes to observation haki. He has the best observation haki in the whole One Piece world, he was able to watch places in the Earth from the sky, and he was able to predict Luffy's movements with total perfection, as well as many other attacks. Enel is granted to be able to predict ANYONE'S attacks.

His logia is not weak. The ONLY POSSIBLE WEAKNESS of his logia is rubber. He was simply very unlucky to have a fight against Luffy, because as you may probably know, rubber > electricity

People say Kizaru is as faster as light, but in none of his fights, he showed to be as fast as that. He is apparently as fast as Enel.

Mar 7, 2014 12:59 AM

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lupadim said:
In first place:

Enel is a genius when it comes to observation haki. He has the best observation haki in the whole One Piece world, he was able to watch places in the Earth from the sky, and he was able to predict Luffy's movements with total perfection, as well as many other attacks. Enel is granted to be able to predict ANYONE'S attacks.

His logia is not weak. The ONLY POSSIBLE WEAKNESS of his logia is rubber. He was simply very unlucky to have a fight against Luffy, because as you may probably know, rubber > electricity

People say Kizaru is as faster as light, but in none of his fights, he showed to be as fast as that. He is apparently as fast as Enel.

Kizaru travels at the speed of light, he kicks you at the speed of light, that's not debatable. Also Enel didn't seem to predict Luffy's movements very well when they fought, his observation haki has a wider range thanks to his devil fruit but it doesn't mean he's better than anyone else we've seen with it, it's obvious Kizaru wins with no difficulty. Any top tier could beat Enel, hell the only reason he didn't get killed by Zoro, Wiper and Ganfall is because they didn't have haki at the time.

SCARY MONSTER

Mar 7, 2014 4:43 AM

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It is debatable. Look at his fights. All he do is reproducing his image somewhere else. If he could really move and fight in the speed of light:

1 - He would die, accordingly to the laws of physics, and One Piece never goes against basic laws of physics

2 - He would be impossible to be defeated, because he would be ahead from his image

I am serious, just look at his fights. He never moved in the speed of light. Any One Piece wiki will say the same; He is extremely fast, that is part of his Akuma no Mi, but he does NOT move in the speed of light. Enel, on the other hand, is able to move in the speed of lightning, which is good.

Also, Enel's mastery in observation haki is not debatable, it is fact he is the best that ever existed in observation haki. I think you should watch the Enel VS Luffy fight again; Luffy wasn't able to land a SINGLE punch in the whole fight, but at the end, Luffy decided to fight without thinking at anything, by bouncing his punches on the walls. If he had his mind empty, Enel would not be able to predict what he wanted to do, so he would not see the bouncing punches coming. That was something that could be done only ONCE, because Enel would learn that "trick" after seeing it once. Now it won't work anymore. Enel can predict any attack from dozens of kilometers.

I also highly doubt Kizaru can use haki with his light attacks, it would be way too difficult for him to "attach" haki in each single light blip. One thing was clear in the one piece Z movie: Kizaru trusts too much in his akuma no mi. He probably doesn't needs to use haki because there is no element that is invulnerable to light, but what about electricity?

Mar 7, 2014 4:01 PM

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Your points seem very desperate. Just stop, Kizarus fruit lets him move at the speed of light which was an established fact ever since we got introduced to it, he needs to dematerialize his body to move at that speed though which takes time and is the reason why characters like Rayleigh and Marco can keep up with him. That's one fact, here is another, all marines from vice admiral level and up possess haki and Kizaru is an admiral so it would be stupid to assume he himself can't hit logias or predict movements. Enel being the best in observation haki is simply your opinion, it's not a fact, having a wider range doesn't mean he can predict attacks any better than other haki users when facing an opponent infront of him. Even if say for arguments sake Enel knew what Kizaru would do, there is nothing he would be able to do to stop him, Kizaru has much more speed and power than Enel can hope to handle. One more thing, Film Z is filler so don't use it here.

SCARY MONSTER

Mar 7, 2014 4:59 PM

Ochimusha

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Jun 2012

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I agree with Guus here, there's no possibility of Enel beating Kizaru unless he got some massive powerups over the two years he's been on the moon.

lupadim said:
One Piece never goes against basic laws of physics.

Good one.

Mar 7, 2014 5:19 PM

#10

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Looool, as if having your body made of rubber or setting your foot on fire while inside water doesn't go against basic law of physics.

SCARY MONSTER

Mar 9, 2014 8:22 AM

#11

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A body made of rubber does not go against the law of physics, it is simply fantasy. Setting the "foot" (you obviously didnt watch One Piece apparently, it was the fist) is fantasy as well, plus I believe we are still going to have an explanation as for that.

But saying that he can move in the speed of light is major bullshit. If that was true, Kizaru would be the STRONGEST in the One Piece world.

Let me develop Kizaru's speed.

Is it true that Kizaru can move at the speed of light? Yes, it is. He can.

But is it true that he can move at the speed of light in combat? NO, COMPLETE BULLSHIT.

Kizaru's Speed mainly stems from his DF. This DF basically makes him a logia made of photons which is perceived as light. This grants everyone the illusion that he is actually the speed of light, which is not the case.

In order to understand why he isn't the speed of light (in combat) you need to understand the laws of light.

Light goes in one direction unless affected by gravity or distorted space-time (Which would still be one direction, but that's a different subject.) This means that Kizaru can only go light speed in one direction, and this is 8.00 x 10^8 meters / second.

In other words, 186,282 miles a second. That's enough to cross the earth 7.8 times a second at the equator. That's really fucking fast, right? Technically, Kizaru can go this speed, but what are his limits on this speed?

Well, you are considering that Kizaru can actually see the world in the speed of light. Unfortunately, if Kizaru really tried to charge at the speed of light in Enel, as example, he would have to make his full body become light. Then, he would have to charge. Why? Because, my main point is: Kizaru depends on his reaction time in order to make use of his power. When Kizaru is moving at the speed of light, he has no reaction time. Enel would simply discharge some electricity and Kizaru would be dead. Because he has no time to react.

In other words, Kizaru is still a human, and he can move as fast as he can react to things. If he moves in the speed of light, he will be committing suicide.

One other reason he can't use it in combat: He can only move in one direction if going in the speed of light.

Now, what about Enel? He has the best haki. Stop trying to use fail arguments, it is a fact that his observation haki is the best shown so far. What basis do you have to conclude that he only has bigger range? Again, watch the fight against Luffy, he managed to predict EVERY SINGLE MOVEMENT Luffy planned to do. He was able to read Luffy's mind. Enel was able to hear every single word people were saying in the Sky Island, and I am sure you remember that the Sky Island was HUGE. Don't you remember when Luffy was having a suspicious conversation and suddenly, Enel sends the huge electricity beam to take him down? While Rayeligh (the second best COO shown so far) was able to tell the average population of an Island, Enel was able to tell exactly who they are, where they are and what they are saying or listening to.

Check this topic as example, where people discuss who has the strongest haki. Enel was suggested to have the best COO several times.

I feel like you are trying to win this argument by saying "Enel sucks at Haki, Kizaru can fight at the speed of light" which is pretty sad, because it is obvious you are wrong.

Mar 12, 2014 9:41 AM

#12

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Too long, didn't read and very stupid to call those fantasy yet go all nerdy over Kizaru being lightspeed.
Also I was refering to Sanji when I said foot, another failed attempt at trying to look good on your part.

SCARY MONSTER

Mar 12, 2014 2:07 PM

#13

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10014

Let me get shit straight

You create a club for discussing and debating which character is better

Your argument is "too long didn't read also very stupid to go all nerdy over a character and actually develop arguments over him"

I am leaving that club, have fun with your shitty debates. I will also consider this a victory for me as you couldn't even argue against Kizaru's speed.

Mar 12, 2014 5:07 PM

#14

Capitalism

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Mar 2014

Whoever thinks Enel can win this fight probably lost or had a parent that lost a lot of their brain cells in the Iraq war.

Fyi
Light > Lighting in terms of speed and everything.

Mar 13, 2014 8:49 AM

#15

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1525

Looks like we got someone with common sense. Welcome Captialism.

SCARY MONSTER

Mar 13, 2014 9:06 AM

#16

Capitalism

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GuusWayne said:
Looks like we got someone with common sense. Welcome Captialism.

Why thank you, it's good to be here. I hope we have better matchmaking skills tho.

Mar 17, 2014 9:31 AM

#17

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Jan 2014

lupadim said:
It is debatable. Look at his fights. All he do is reproducing his image somewhere else. If he could really move and fight in the speed of light:

1 - He would die, accordingly to the laws of physics, and One Piece never goes against basic laws of physics

2 - He would be impossible to be defeated, because he would be ahead from his image

I am serious, just look at his fights. He never moved in the speed of light. Any One Piece wiki will say the same; He is extremely fast, that is part of his Akuma no Mi, but he does NOT move in the speed of light. Enel, on the other hand, is able to move in the speed of lightning, which is good.

Also, Enel's mastery in observation haki is not debatable, it is fact he is the best that ever existed in observation haki. I think you should watch the Enel VS Luffy fight again; Luffy wasn't able to land a SINGLE punch in the whole fight, but at the end, Luffy decided to fight without thinking at anything, by bouncing his punches on the walls. If he had his mind empty, Enel would not be able to predict what he wanted to do, so he would not see the bouncing punches coming. That was something that could be done only ONCE, because Enel would learn that "trick" after seeing it once. Now it won't work anymore. Enel can predict any attack from dozens of kilometers.

I also highly doubt Kizaru can use haki with his light attacks, it would be way too difficult for him to "attach" haki in each single light blip. One thing was clear in the one piece Z movie: Kizaru trusts too much in his akuma no mi. He probably doesn't needs to use haki because there is no element that is invulnerable to light, but what about electricity?

the conversation is pointless if u state physics in anime battles..its anime..and kizaru would win with ease...he is at the level of yonkos like whiitebeard and all..and whitebeard was clearly stated the strongest man in the world after gol d roger..enel was just a logia user with a god complex..and kizaru MOVES at the speed of light..its not debatable..i bet any of the shichibukai like doflamingo, mihawk, hancock nd kuma could defeat him easily..remember luffy defeated him without haki...and it IS NOT STATED ANYWHERE THAT ENEL HAS THE BEST OBSERVATION HAKI..dont state points which have no grounds...he was able to evade punches from pre-time skip luffy who was a nothing when compared to Admirals..and was miles slow in speed than the Mighty Kizaru..enel has electricity but kizaru is light...light>lightning..and don't state things like Kizaru can not use Haki as it is never shown that kizaru is unable to use it..and he used it with akainu and aokiji at marineford remember?

Mar 17, 2014 9:37 AM

#18

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Jan 2014

lupadim said:
A body made of rubber does not go against the law of physics, it is simply fantasy. Setting the "foot" (you obviously didnt watch One Piece apparently, it was the fist) is fantasy as well, plus I believe we are still going to have an explanation as for that.

But saying that he can move in the speed of light is major bullshit. If that was true, Kizaru would be the STRONGEST in the One Piece world.

Let me develop Kizaru's speed.

Is it true that Kizaru can move at the speed of light? Yes, it is. He can.

But is it true that he can move at the speed of light in combat? NO, COMPLETE BULLSHIT.

Kizaru's Speed mainly stems from his DF. This DF basically makes him a logia made of photons which is perceived as light. This grants everyone the illusion that he is actually the speed of light, which is not the case.

In order to understand why he isn't the speed of light (in combat) you need to understand the laws of light.

Light goes in one direction unless affected by gravity or distorted space-time (Which would still be one direction, but that's a different subject.) This means that Kizaru can only go light speed in one direction, and this is 8.00 x 10^8 meters / second.

In other words, 186,282 miles a second. That's enough to cross the earth 7.8 times a second at the equator. That's really fucking fast, right? Technically, Kizaru can go this speed, but what are his limits on this speed?

Well, you are considering that Kizaru can actually see the world in the speed of light. Unfortunately, if Kizaru really tried to charge at the speed of light in Enel, as example, he would have to make his full body become light. Then, he would have to charge. Why? Because, my main point is: Kizaru depends on his reaction time in order to make use of his power. When Kizaru is moving at the speed of light, he has no reaction time. Enel would simply discharge some electricity and Kizaru would be dead. Because he has no time to react.

In other words, Kizaru is still a human, and he can move as fast as he can react to things. If he moves in the speed of light, he will be committing suicide.

One other reason he can't use it in combat: He can only move in one direction if going in the speed of light.

Now, what about Enel? He has the best haki. Stop trying to use fail arguments, it is a fact that his observation haki is the best shown so far. What basis do you have to conclude that he only has bigger range? Again, watch the fight against Luffy, he managed to predict EVERY SINGLE MOVEMENT Luffy planned to do. He was able to read Luffy's mind. Enel was able to hear every single word people were saying in the Sky Island, and I am sure you remember that the Sky Island was HUGE. Don't you remember when Luffy was having a suspicious conversation and suddenly, Enel sends the huge electricity beam to take him down? While Rayeligh (the second best COO shown so far) was able to tell the average population of an Island, Enel was able to tell exactly who they are, where they are and what they are saying or listening to.

Check this topic as example, where people discuss who has the strongest haki. Enel was suggested to have the best COO several times.

I feel like you are trying to win this argument by saying "Enel sucks at Haki, Kizaru can fight at the speed of light" which is pretty sad, because it is obvious you are wrong.

and oda told u that didn't he? u r totally illogical..you are saying that kizaru can move at the speed of light but he cant in battles..are u mad? what changes during battles? when he kicked basil hawkins that have you ever experienced a kick from the speed of light? dont state things like photons and shit made by you..all the things u said have no ground or proof as it is never shown in op and not stated by oda rendering the conversation moot

Mar 19, 2014 2:24 PM

#19

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Aradhya123 said:
and oda told u that didn't he? u r totally illogical..you are saying that kizaru can move at the speed of light but he cant in battles..are u mad? what changes during battles? when he kicked basil hawkins that have you ever experienced a kick from the speed of light? dont state things like photons and shit made by you..all the things u said have no ground or proof as it is never shown in op and not stated by oda rendering the conversation moot

How is Kizaru supposed to control himself on the speed of light? If he REALLY could move in the speed of light, wouldn't he do that in battles? But he NEVER did that. The best he did is kicking the guy in the speed of light, but notice how he moved to him slowly and then kicked him. It's not like he can teletransport everywhere; do you have any idea how that would be? He would be able to kill the entire Marineford population in less than one second if he really had that power.

His power depends on his reaction time, this is a fact, and anyone that tries to argue against that either doesn't understand English, is stupid or is trolling.

Mar 19, 2014 2:45 PM

#20

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Jan 2014

lupadim said:

How is Kizaru supposed to control himself on the speed of light? If he REALLY could move in the speed of light, wouldn't he do that in battles? But he NEVER did that. The best he did is kicking the guy in the speed of light, but notice how he moved to him slowly and then kicked him. It's not like he can teletransport everywhere; do you have any idea how that would be? He would be able to kill the entire Marineford population in less than one second if he really had that power.
His power depends on his reaction time, this is a fact, and anyone that tries to argue against that either doesn't understand English, is stupid or is trolling.

He walked up to hawkins because he didnt needed to use his full power on a small fry like hawkins..nd he teleported many times at marineford battle

Mar 19, 2014 2:49 PM

#21

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Jan 2014

http://onepiece.wikia.com/wiki/Borsalino ....open this link...go to his devil fruit power section...IT IS CLEARLY STATED THAT HE IS ABLE OF MOVING AND ATTACKING AT THE SPEED OF LIGHT...

Mar 19, 2014 2:52 PM

#22

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Jan 2014

There is also written that he is the fastest man in the world as nothing is faster than light..,now what do u have to say?

Mar 20, 2014 2:49 AM

#23

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It is confirmed; You are either stupid, trolling or can't read English.

In first place: You quoted a fucking wikia, a source that can be edited at ANY TIME by ANYONE.

In second place: I already said that he can move and attack in the speed of light, stop trolling. I just said that he can't FIGHT in the speed of light.

Use your brain and answer me this: Why didn't Kizaru instantly kill EVERYONE in Marineford? If he can really fight in the speed of light, he would be able to kill everyone there in less than a blink. Even Marco managed to outmaneuver him, and Marco is slower than Enel.

Come on. Are you really going to say he didn't do that because it wasn't needed? Come on. You have only ONE chance. Enel could have killed everyone instantly at any moment, but he didn't. Why?

Mar 24, 2014 1:45 PM

#24

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Nov 2013

1525

Kizaru was said to be the speed of light, he can move at the speed of light, he has done it plenty.

SCARY MONSTER

Mar 25, 2014 6:21 PM

#25